Originally Posted by RearNaked
The thing I don't understand about your argument, is this.
Obviously we're limited this to 170 division because that's where all the guys you called out compete.
What else is there @ 170? There are no flashy guys in that division.
The champion is a wrestler primarily who will lie on any striker that comes at him for 5 rounds and use underpowered but quite accurate striking to touch up ground fighters for 5 rounds.
We have Condit, who it's hard to classify since he's been a killer his whole career, but after his last fight, who knows what to expect from him?
We had Diaz who is suspended and really the only interesting fighter @ 170.
Then we have a bunch of guys Koscheck, T. Silva, Fitch, Shields, Hardy who all got destroyed by the champion at least once each and will likely never get another title shot.
Then we have a sea of wrestlers because anyone without the wrestling credentials to think they can deal with GSP have left the division.
You need a wrestling base to even have a hope of beating GSP, but if you come at him with wrestling he just jabs you to death instead.
These guys you're calling out all have the correct style to beat GSP as he can't just lie on them, and if he stands with them he runs the risk of eating the ONE BIG PUNCH that the Serra fight proved is all that's needed.
Strikers have tried @ 170 and they get laid on by either Kos, Fitch or GSP depending how high they work their way up and can't take the title.
The only way to do it is to be able to stuff the takedown and land the big punch. GSP is too careful to fall for anything else.
I just don't see what other option there is @ 170 than relying on good wrestling and one shot KO power to have a (slim) hope of even beating GSP.
You sound a lot like me when Sean Sherk was coming up at LW and everyone was trying to tell me how awesome he was, when I could recognize his great guard passing and top control, but just found him incredibly boring. The point being, he TRIED to be exciting and mix it up a bit and he got KTFO'd for his troubles. Everyone has styles they find boring, but in this case, you're calling out the wrong guys.
You want more exciting guys at WW? Blame GSP. He cleared out the division. Or blame Condit, he stopped the one guy who probably could have beat GSP by exploiting refereeing/judging ignorance to cheat him out of a title shot (I'm still waiting for the warning, point reduction and disqualification for 'timidity' that Condit should have suffered in that fight, as if you read the unified rules, that is a foul, not just 'good game planning).
I don't see what's hard to understand about my argument. I don't like generic wrestle-boxers who aren't really elite in any area of mixed martial arts. It bores me. There is no argument here, I just think that they suck and I'm not interested in watching many of them fight.
Who says wrestle-boxers are the answer to GSP? Kos is one of the better wrestle-boxers in the division and he got molested with a jab for five rounds.
All of these wrestle-boxer drones simply aren't as technical as GSP standing and aren't as good at wrestling as him (in an MMA scenario).
The one type of opponent we haven't seen GSP deal with is an elite striker with a sick ground game. BJ Penn you say. One of the best top games in the sport, no doubt, but his bottom games leave a lot to be desired.
Guys like Carlos Condit, Erick Silva, Nick Diaz I feel are the most stylistically threatening opponents for GSP, not the influx of wrestle-boxers who aren't better than GSP in any actual area. You need guys who are better than GSP in two areas. The striking and BJJ, the guys I mentioned earlier fit that mould. I think GSP has proved time and time again in his career that wrestlers are not the answer.