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  • Junior dos Santos

    Votes: 51 79.7%
  • Cain Velasquez

    Votes: 13 20.3%
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***OFFICIAL*** Junior dos Santos vs. Cain Velasquez II Thread

34K views 344 replies 98 participants last post by  locnott 
#1 ·
Heavyweight bout: 255 pounds
Five round fight for the UFC Heavyweight Championship

 
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#297 ·
Dominating someone for 5 rounds is more impressive to me then a quick knock out.

ESPECIALLY if you cant repeat that knockout even though you are given 25 minutes. Clearly the first time around had a bit of luck behind it.

That said if you are so skilled that you can knock someone out quickly at will due to your superiority.. that is even more impressive. But JDS-Cain was never an example of that. No matter how hard JDS fans tried to believe it was.


"Edit"

Im not trolling MOOSE. You must see it that way because your a bit sensitive since you most likely expected JDS to win.
 
#304 ·
The early takedown attempts were a calculated risk. While JDS does have good takedown defence and can scramble up to his feet quickly, he doesn't really punish people for failed attempts. If you shoot on him and fail you're not going to eat a knee or get hit with a punch combo. Rather, he opens the range and then starts working the striking game.

Cain made the bet that he wasn't going to get creamed by knee or anything like that when going for takedowns, and he was right. He got his gameplan working and that was what won the fight for him.
 
#305 ·
Wow! Cain Valasquez sure showed everyone who gave him no chance in the rematch what he's made of. Myself included.

I figured it would go down pretty similar to last time but Cain wrecked JDS for 5 rounds and it is testament to JDS heart that he even got out of the 1st.

I found the Crowd last night infuriating. They would boo nearly every fight after 10 seconds of not seeing a brawl and I thought it was disgusting the way they booed JDS after the fight.

If you were at the event last night, and you booed, then you my friend are an asshole!
 
#306 · (Edited)
So Cain pounds JDS with heavy fists all night turning his head into a balloon, kicked JDS in the head with full momentum and tossed him around like a rag doll at will but Cain did'nt look impressive even though he basically took the soul out of one of the best fighters in the world to the point where he was in tears.

I love this place.
 
#311 ·
I'm really glad Cain won. I like him more than JDS. I was worried a few times in the fight though.

On a thread related to their prior fight I asserted that Cain is a more technical striker than JDS. I'd like to openly admit that I was mistaken in that claim. I have a bias towards fighters who pressure their opponents with combinations and a varied attack, utilizing kicks and punches. While Cain does this and Dos Santos does not, it truly is Dos Santos who throws crisper shots and utilizes better set ups and angles. To those who I argued with about this last fight, I was wrong.

THAT SAID, one of my biggest complaints about JDS (which i am not retracting, and I feel is more valid than ever) is that he's a bully in the ring. If you're afraid of him and give him tons of respect, he'll run over you. In those situations, where he can work his setups and body punches, he is a destroyer of men. But if someone gets in his face and refuses to be bullied, he doesn't look so great anymore.

This was revealed to me by his fight with Roy Nelson and was highlighted in yesterdays bout. JDS is a better striker than Cain, but Cain just got up in his face and hammered him. Yes, the threat of a takedown played a significant role, but even so JDS just doesn't respond well to that kind of pressure. And that's why Cain was successful.

Interestingly enough, though, I've become a much bigger fan of JDS after this fight. Why? Well his heart obviously played a part in winning me over, but even more so, I was SUPER impressed by his takedown defense and ability to scramble back on to his feet. Cain's smashed some serious guys with his top control and he couldn't keep Dos Santos down for any serious length of time. (Though he definitely did some damage with what control he had.)

Towards the end of the third, Cain faded quite a bit. They came in small bursts, but JDS returned with some fast and heavy hands. As Cain got slower, I was getting seriously worried that Dos Santos would come from behind with a KO.

Amazing fight overall! Screw the people who were booing.
 
#312 ·
Yah, I've long since set aside favoritism. Tough to do with emotions involved. BJ vs Diaz, Crocop vs everyone, Swick, etc. But ya gotta look at all elements. Cain was relentless and he stifled JDS's boxing and tired em out. The Roy Nelson fight showed me that after the third round he begins to tire significantly. Any striker won't do well against a fighter who sticks to em like glue constantly pressuring. Also Cain is NOT an ordinary fighter. He has cardio for days. Try doing a drop step takedown for a full five minutes and you'll be out of breath. Add that for a full 25 minutes and you'll see how damn impressive Cain's conditioning is. That's his SINGLE biggest weapon; conditioning.

Aftermath...

Cormier drops to LHW for the title shot.
JDS can KO Big Foot into oblivion again. The only other HW with crisp boxing is Arlovski EXCEPT he doesn't have the chin JDS has.

*NOTES* Although JDS was exhausted he showed tremendous will power.
Best takedown defense in the HW division.

Remember, Cain threw everything at em and did NOT finish. I should have stuck with my original prediction a year ago with a five round UD. I went with 4th round TKO Cain. Anyways in 2014 they will rematch again and I do believe JDS will take it to end the trilogy. I will place a nice let bet. I think it's destiny man. These two are at the top of the food chain.
 
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#313 ·
Great fight, Cain is an impressive man with his extraordinary cardio.

I think JDS made a mistake in focusing on his "strength" on this training camp. He looked bulked up a bit and his cardio dropped a ton due to this. He looked gassed by the middle of the first round and the big overhand right just took his gas tank to almost empty.

He also looked to fall in love with the big shot and didn't fire off combinations like he used to.

I think the trilogy will be even better of a fight.
 
#315 ·
Good call. For the rubber fight against Cain he has to drop 10 - 15 pounds and focus on one thing actually two things. How to connect when Cain comes in; left kick, knee or uppercut. He was trying to do the latter, but he's too tall and Cain drops very quickly.

Second, cut weight to increase mobility and conditioning. Anderson did this against Chael by coming in lighter in their rematch. He was much leaner cuz he was prepared for another five rounder. Anderson is the only one much like Fedor who can game plan INSIDE the Octagon.

Unfortunately he was smothered so he couldn't land his combinations.

End notes. Cain had 13 months to study this and create a proper game plan.

Amazing stuff from Cain, his plan was to charge in and hope something lands - it worked. Impressive because he went for takedowns immediately, JDS shrugged them off and he didn't let it knock his confidence.

Do not sleep on JDS though, he showed some amazing stuff in this fight. Heart and toughness, obviously, but the ability to land shots, defend takedowns, and get out from under Cain when he looked ready to die? That is sensational, that is some serious skill that is properly instinctual.

JDS is in the same spot Cain was a year ago, except he looked much better in his loss.
Looks like Bresko has a sig ready for ya...hehe. You should make a long term sig bet right now that JDS will retake it in their rematch. It's going to happen.

I've never seen two fighters in a division clear it out the way they did and dominate. Maybe Rich Franklin, but he faced a very different breed of fighter.

I feel bad for JDS's next opponent. Anyways I'm not a Cain fan, but I call it the way I see it. The DEFINING fight for me was Cain vs Bigfoot. Has anybody ever seen a comeback fight from a a fighter who gets knocked out for the belt. That proved to me beyond a reasonable doubt that he was on a MISSION. He simply took his frustrations out on poor Big Foot and got his sweet revenge on JDS. He'll be back...
 
#314 ·
Amazing stuff from Cain, his plan was to charge in and hope something lands - it worked. Impressive because he went for takedowns immediately, JDS shrugged them off and he didn't let it knock his confidence.

Do not sleep on JDS though, he showed some amazing stuff in this fight. Heart and toughness, obviously, but the ability to land shots, defend takedowns, and get out from under Cain when he looked ready to die? That is sensational, that is some serious skill that is properly instinctual.

JDS is in the same spot Cain was a year ago, except he looked much better in his loss.
 
#316 ·
Exactly. There are some fighters who don't get to the next level until they have faced defeat.

I believe it was Cain's first loss when he lost the belt, and I could see another level of maturity from him last night.

More so, I think JDS will come back even stronger and will reign on the division for a while (4-5 titles defenses).
 
#318 ·
Well, it was a great victory for Cain, no doubt about it, but that is just Cain's signature victory, overwelming people as he aways does, so the only thing really impressive about this victory was the fact JDS was the victim this time.
The first TD attempts were real and as they were ridiculously stopped with extreme and comical ease, Cain intelligently started to fake TDs and hit JDS's face hard and repeatedly. Great move showing high fighting IQ and adaptability. It payed off with glory.
Dória, JDS's coach was crazy about his low guard and yelled at him several times to defend himself with no success.

Both great champions, an epic battle and smells like a trilogy, indeed.
 
#319 ·
I like JDS but I think he has been exposed. Whatever happened to his supposed " best boxing in the heavyweight division"? He never put any combination(s) in place and to be honest, he couldn't even lift his right arm. I was shocked to see no offense from him. Did he hits the weights too much in preparation for this fight? He appeared stiff. Congratulations to Cain, he really wanted his belt back and it shows.
 
#324 ·
Great performance by Cain. I think there are some aspects of the fight that must be noticed:

1. Cigano training was not the best possible. He gave too much emphasis on strength training, and the result was no guard and a demolished face in the end of the fight. Besides that, I think he should have trained with some good quality wrestlers in order to prepare for Cain's takedowns.

2. Despite being better on striking than Cigano (which I was not expecting), Cain had some weaknesses on his striking game, putting his head down TOO much times and he could have been KO'd by JDS with an uppercut or a knee at any moment. Apart from that, he dominated Cigano the whole fight and deserved the belt!
 
#325 ·
I'm not sure the strength training was such a big issue. Has it been confirmed that he gained muscle? I think it was more his confidence in his TDD and hands that he wasn't conditioned to be put on his back much. Once that happened, and happened often he lost the mental edge, and his game plan shut down. All that was left was heart and pride.
 
#330 · (Edited)
What happened to that dude Khoveraki who used to post on here frequently. He was by far JDS' biggest bum buddy, claimed Cain or no other fighter ever had a chance in hell against "rocketfists Junior". lolz.

He should go down to 205 before he fights JDS. This rematch is going to be the worst business decision he's ever made. 2 losses to the Champion and no one is interested in a rematch, and dropping a weight class because you have to is way less marketable than doing it by choice.
Unlucky buddy, "your boy" got smashed.
 
#332 ·
What happened to that dude Khoveraki who used to post on here frequently. He was by far JDS' biggest bum buddy, claimed Cain or no other fighter ever had a chance in hell against "rocketfists Junior". lolz.



Unlucky buddy, "your boy" got smashed.
I remember him. He's the only guy to ever neg rep me. You know why. Everybody knows by now I made the prediction that they'd fight three times and win one a piece. When I made the prediction that Cain would win and this was posted like almost a year ago he negged me...lolz! Pretty childish. Doesn't understand the fight game. I like JDS...he's a helluve a fighter and I can say I'm a fan especially how he presents himself in public. But I really sensed it almost like destiny that these two would cross paths and do battle.

This is the fight business. Anything can happen on any given Saturday.

I wonder what Cain thinks. He just about threw everything at JDS and he would not go down. All I can say is that JDS's next opponent is going to feel some pain.


Come to think of it who can he fight. He's already beat all the top contenders. Maybe Bigfoot, but that's not even fair. Bigfoot would be a walking punching pag. Hunt is the only interesting fight or Cheick. Actually if I were the UFC I'd place Overeem vs Cain for Superbowl weekend and Bigfoot vs JDS. What "if" Bigfoot wins. Nobody wants to see a rematch. Werdum is a perennial contender, but not quite championship material. He's really really slow. Wicked BJJ, solid striking, but damn slow. Cain will be able to take care of em.
 
#331 ·
The best thing about this result is the division is now waaaaay more interesting. If Junior won there would only be the Overeem and i guess Cormier fight left, now there are loads more good future match-ups

Cain is a beast, ephasised once again how important wrestling/wrestling defence can be in a fight (bendo, gsp, jones)

Not great for me as dudes landing/not landing shots from on top is one of my least favourite aspects of the sport - and before anyone says, i know Cain outstruck junior, its just my pov

Also i think there needs to be a rule that you can only gloat once on here if your fighter wins against the odds, otherwise it makes you look silly :thumb02:
 
#334 ·
Just to point out that JDS was taken down at will ONLY after being punched hard and this is crucial info to understand how things played after that. I was rooting for Junior, but Cain is a great champ and sportsman and the belt is in good hands.

Anyway, who ever called Cain "pillow hands"? Looks like his punches are as heavier as they can get by those tests:

 
#335 ·
Cain never really managed much offense when he got junior down. As soon as he tried to punch junior was getting up even when he was completely gassed. Cains beat offense was in the clinch and when JDS was against the fence.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3
 
#341 ·
Cain never really managed much offense when he got junior down. As soon as he tried to punch junior was getting up even when he was completely gassed. Cains beat offense was in the clinch and when JDS was against the fence.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3
That comment couldn't be further from the truth. Cain dropped an enormous amount of bombs on Junior's face while on the ground.
 
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