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post #76 of (permalink) Old 02-04-2013, 06:36 PM
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Idaho
Posts: 2,848
Fair enough, I'll concede Henderson's right to expression only on the grounds of free speech but I still do not agree with it.

Are you trying somehow to disconnect political and financial affairs? Politics is everywhere, and I mean everywhere, specially in business. Politics is just part of our daily lives. When you tell your mom her food is delicious when in fact she oversalted it that day, you are being politcal. So yes. UFC, Dana and all the promoters and whoever else you name are political.
Am I trying to disconnect political and financial affairs? Uhhhhh, no. I'm trying to show how they connect.
I'm pretty sure you knew exactly what I meant when I referenced the term "political" in regards to my argument. The UFC does not endorse a specific political platform. To my knowledge, neither do Bud Light, Harley Davidson, or Metro PCS. If they do (and many of them may), then they don't use the UFC to promote that platform. They just want you to buy their product.

As far as what you're talking about goes, I agree. Otherwise guys like Nick Diaz and Chael Sonnen wouldn't be getting title shots. But that is not what I was talking about.

He utilizes a different operational system than yours and you are not interested in understanding (understanding I emphasize, you don't need to accept) because you have your own truth. He is praising his God because that is who he gets power from where others rely on a horse shoe. When religious fighters thank God for the victory, it doesn't mean God helped him to kick somebody's ass, but to thank for the opportunity of making a good job. The subject is combustible for those who are intolerants. You are being intolerant, Ari. Let the guy be. Actually nobody needs to be right or wrong about the Universe. We know very little and thats a fact you can count on.
I actually understand where Henderson is coming from. I just don't agree with his point of view. Religion is a combustible subject bcause it's an extremely personal and private matter. I am absolutely not being intolerant. If I were intolerant I would be criticizing Henderson because he's a Christian. I am criticizing Henderson because he is using the spotlight of the UFC as a place of public faith expression without regard to the potential consequences it has for himself and his immediate employer. Not because he is a Christian.

Wrong. Although politics is everywhere, as mentioned, itīs the freedom of speech that allows more and more people to congregate and coexist.
Good grief, take off your rose colored glasses, man.

Freedom of speech is a double edged sword which can have tremendous consequences. It allows us to coexist but it also can cause massive upheaval and conflict. I have every right to walk up to someone and call them an offensive, derogatory term. Trust me, I've done it. I've also been punched in the face as a result, and I've done the same to other people. I'm all for freedom of speech and individual rights, but I recognize as someone who holds these rights that I am responsible for how I use them and I need to understand the consequences that result in the use of my rights. Regardless of whether or not I view it as appropriate, Henderson has every right to talk about his magical man in the sky after his fights. But he also needs to recognize that if and when he does so, there are potential consequences that will follow, many of them not good.
Jon Jones is a prime example that everyone is well aware of. He started out as a humble young man that the fans absolutely loved. When he opened his mouth and said some really, really dumb shit and did some even dumber things, look what happened? He's one of the most reviled athletes in the sport right now. I'm not saying the exact same thing will happen to Henderson because it's a completely different example, but it has the ability to turn into an unpleasent situation if he isn't careful.

Let's say Frank Mir, an avowed atheist, wins the Heavyweight title and slams religion in his post fight speech or says "I would like to thank science for giving me the ability to evolve". What happens then?

Religion is a personal choice but it is rather a collective thing. If you and others want to say religion should always be kept in privacy lets cancel all Christmas and Thanksgiving advertisements and never say Merry Christmas again, until there, either we accept other people beliefs or we are to blame for our own hypocrisy.
I agree that religion is a personal choice. Which is why I have a huge problem with the idea of evangelism. It's up to the individual to decide what he or she believes as they mature in life. If they decide that they believe in god, great. Just don't try and convert me. I'm 26 years old and I've been there and done that with religion (I grew up Mormon although I was an outcast because my mother is Honduran). But each person has the right to believe what they want.

I disagree about religion being a collective thing. Look at how many wars have been fought and how many lives have been lost as a result of religion, specifically regarding the Abrahamic religions who essentially believe in the same "god" but have fundamental differences when it comes to practice and history. As for your other remarks, I'm totally fine with people not saying "Merry Christmas" and saying "Happy Holidays" instead. That wouldn't bother me at all. You'll also notice that most of the TV ads that air for the holiday season have very little to do with the Christian interpretation of Christmas.

If you want everyone to practice their religion publicly, and they have that right, then let them. And watch the shitstorm that will follow.
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