Okay, so My friend is a Black Belt in Tae Kwan Do and he says that since he's a blackbelt he can start training people and giving them belts. First I want to know if thats true, and next if the same is true for BJJ because my trainer is a 2nd degree BB in it and I've never really thought of actually trying to get belts from him :\ Thanks
I'm pretty sure that is true. It's pretty hard to become a black belt in BJJ, so I'm pretty sure all black belts can teach students and give out belts.
My trainer is my brother in law too so I can train with him for free. My friend the TKD belt is getting his own dojo in a year or two and we're going to expand it to be a BJJ/TKD/MMA Gym. My brother in law is also a silver glove boxer so we'll probably incorperate that and Hapkido too.
EDIT: He got his BJJ belt from his father (3rd degree BB) and he trained with Dan Severn
Let me get this straight. You brother in law, is a 2nd degree black belt. in Brazilian Jujitsu. And he got his Black Belt, from his Dad. Who is a 3rd Degree blackbelt, in BJJ?
I would like to confirm that a blackbelt in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu can give out ranks. The fact is, though, in the BJJ world it matters alot more who gave you your belt. That's why it's important to check the lineage of the belt and make sure that you know what you're saying when you claim your instructor.
I'm not sure about TKD, but I will say that there are alot of TKD blackbelts that I train with that make me think that a blackbelt in the style is about on the level of a bluebelt in BJJ. I'm sure that TKD guys will disagree with me, but they do give out blackbelts way to young, as do many martial arts instructors.
Belts dont mean alot. For along time I didnt give karate any respect at all because I totally destroyed a "black belt" afew years back. At the time the only thing ive trained in was boxing.
You gain your belt in Bjj usually when your instructor sees fit. Some schools have tests to become a blue belt or a purple belt, here's an example: http://youtube.com/watch?v=pDObjJipKIo
It obviously gets more difficult once you get past a blue belt, and gaining a purple, brown, black,etc are for a multitude of reasons, such as how much mat time you hvae, your ability to roll with higher belts, competition experience, etc. I would say very generally speaking if you practice Bjj 2-3 times a week here's what the belt system will look like:
8 months - 1 year: blue belt
2 - 3 years: purple belt
4 - 7 years: brown belt
8+ years: black belt
For starters you have to be 5th Dan to grade in TKD and i think you need to have a 5th dan to be head of a dojo in order to allow lower black belts to teach classes
im 4th Dan btw
it really depends on your Sensei or Trainer b/c there ae the shit schools that grade fast
it's take me 15 years to get where i am in TKD thats being trained by a Korean Grand master
Let me say this about TKD and the problems with bringing it into MMA.
I've fought a half dozen TKD blackbelts in MMA/pankration/NHB competition, and there are alot of reasons why TKD is a waste of time in training for MMA.
The first is that they focus so much on point sparring that as hard as they hit me, they can never do any serious damage. A great boxer (like Olympic Gold Medalist Andre Ward, who I've worked with a few times) hits quick and hard, but TKD guys lack the input from their hips that allows them to do alot of the serious damage that a boxer can do with their hands and that a kickboxer/muay thai fighter can do with their feet and shins and knees.
It marginally increases their speed, which matters alot for point-sparring competition, but it doesn't matter at all in MMA. Landing one good shot that puts an opponent to sleep is much, much better than landing a couple dozen that do next to nothing (except, they tend to make your opponent angry and give them a great chance to close distance and take the fight to the ground).
The obvious one (as we've seen from guys like Danny Abbadi) is that they have no ground game. Even with guys in as extreme a martial art as Kajukembo (and Grandmast Gaylord is a genuis, despite his funny name), if you don't teach submission skills, you're going to get tapped out.
The only TKD guy who's ever given me a problem is a guy from Pitt's Martial Arts acadamy, and his instructor holds blackbelts in 5 martial arts, one of which is JJJ (which he teaches out of his school). The rest all struggled to hurt me and they all failed to put up much of a fight on the ground.
If you're going to learn a martial art, I also suggest going into something that has a background more focussed on self defense, or at least full contact competition. I tend to frown on any style that uses point sparring as a means of judging the capacity of competitors, as it's not really an accurate meter for judging anything.
I also feel that blackbelts in TKD (and many karate styles) are given out way to easily, but that's just coming from my background as a GJJ guy, where getting a blackbelt is a mark of serious mastery and getting a purple belt is considered a serious achievement.
Ironman, I 100% agree dude. I really don't like TKD for MMA at all. The lack of hip power and using shins really puts me off it. That being said, there's no reason we cant teach TKD, MMA and BJJ at the same Dojo (allows more flexable scheduels and days off). Our MMA class will focus more on MT and just the way striking works in MMA (it's really developed into it's own thing) and we will encorperate BJJ, Hapkido and Wrestling into the mix.
One other thing to add to the post, I finally got a hold of him about a week ago.
he got his belt from Carlson Gracie when he used to live in Chicago. Forgot to act about his dad. He also verified the whole "theres only about 50 2nd degrees in the country" only he said there's probably more around 80.
Ironman, I 100% agree dude. I really don't like TKD for MMA at all. The lack of hip power and using shins really puts me off it. That being said, there's no reason we cant teach TKD, MMA and BJJ at the same Dojo (allows more flexable scheduels and days off). Our MMA class will focus more on MT and just the way striking works in MMA (it's really developed into it's own thing) and we will encorperate BJJ, Hapkido and Wrestling into the mix.
One other thing to add to the post, I finally got a hold of him about a week ago.
he got his belt from Carlson Gracie when he used to live in Chicago. Forgot to act about his dad. He also verified the whole "theres only about 50 2nd degrees in the country" only he said there's probably more around 80.
That's good stuff. It's good to know where your lineage comes from.
Frankly, I have no problem with teaching TKD, MMA and BJJ at the same school. I have a problem with people seeing TKD as a serious fighting system that can be used in full contact competition.
I sort of see red when people talk about TKD blackbelts, as they make up some of the biggest smack talkers and worst competition I've ever had, so that's more of a personal greivance than anything. (I'll put it this way, I make a point of using lots and lots of neck cranks when I fight TKD guys)
My instructor is one of those 80 (he's actually a 3rd degree blackbelt) and a student of Royler Gracie.
I'm proud to say that getting a belt (even a blue belt) at my gym is harder then it is in most, becaue it shows the level of competition that we have on the mat and the bar that we hold students up to.
i like going to ground to fight anyways. My ground game is my strongest part of my game. plus i have put so much of my time and work really hard to get where i am at in TKD. so it's not like some places where they get Graded once every 2 weeks or so shit like that
Some great points made in this thread, you should ALWAYS be able to trace your instructors BJJ lineage direstly to a Gracie, if not then I wouldn't suggest training there.
umm...every bjj guys lineage is eventually going to get there.
but theres other acceptible things too, like the american bjj people in which jene lebelle is included, or if you get it through someone like sakuraba's group (lol but unlikely)
Here is a list of people Carlson Gracie gave black belts too:
Alan Goes (expelled)
Alberto “Apaga Vela” Dos Santos
Alexandre Macedo
Alexandre Derizans
Amaury Bitetti
Andre Pederneiras
Anselmo Montenegro
Antonio Claudio Correia Buchaul
Antonio Ricardo Bittencourt Cavalcanti
Antonio Ricardo Jardim Liborio (expelled)
Antonio “Tuninho” Rodrigues
Armando Alves “Maninho” Goncalves Filho
Arthur Virgilio Neto
Ary Galo
Braulio Carsalade
Cassio Cardoso (expelled)
Carley Gracie
Carlos “Penao”Alexandre Da Conceicao
Carlos Antonio Rosado
Carlos “Bagana”
Carlos Eduardo De Oliveira
Carlos Rollyson
Carlson Gracie Jr.
Carlson Guimaraes
Christian Kennedy Grandi
Cleiton De Souza
Clovis Rodrigues
Crezio De Souza
Daniel Cristoph
Djalma Jose De Santana Filho
Edir “Monge” Da Silva
Edson Carvalho
Elair Gilberto Da Silva Reis
Elcio Figueiredo
Fabio Macieira
Felipe Figalo Barbosa
Fernando “Nutri-Baby” Da Silva
Fernando “Pinduka” Guimaraes
Fernando Rosental
Francisco “Grego” Trivelas
Francisco “Toco” Albuquerque
Gustavo Gussem
Gutenberg Mello
Henrique Chvaicer
Isaias De Souza
Jeronimo Ventura
Joao Antonio Fernandes Filho
Jose De Oliveira
Jose Eduardo Gomes De Oliveira
Jose Mario Sperry (expelled)
Julio “Foca” Fernandez
Leo D’ilha
Luis Fernando “Nando” Da Costa
Luis Carlos “Manimal” Matheus
Luiz “Bebeo” Duarte (expelled)
Luiz Carlos Vallois
Manuel “Maneco” Maria Cardoso Neto
Marcel Duque Estrada
Marcelinho “Cremulhao”
Marcelo Alonso
Marcelo Bustamante
Marcelo “Playmobil”
Marcelo Procopio
Marcelo Tadeo De Oliveira
Marcello Saporito
Marco Aurelio Kuhner De Oliveira
Marco Aurelio Valadares Lisboa
Marcos “Parrumpinha” Da Matta (expelled)
Marcos Flexa
Marcos “Conan” Silveira (expelled)
Marcus Vinicius De Macedo Soares
Mario Cupertino
Marvin Swhab
Mauricio “Saddam”
Miguel Kelner (expelled)
Miguel “Dentista” Monteiro
Murilo Bustamante (expelled)
Orlando Saraiva
Oswaldo “Paqueta” Gomes Rosa
Oswaldo Viana
Otavio Augusto De Oliveira
Paulo Filho
Paulo “Mamao” Albuquerque Filho
Pedro De Secco
Renato “Macaquinho” Frossard
Renato Tavares (expelled)
Ricardo De La Riva
Ricardo “Rey” Diogo
Ricardo Luis Perrone
Ricardo Juca Santos
Ricardo “Kiko” Velloso
Rinaldo Santos
Roberto De Souza
Rocian Gracie
Rodrigo Medeiros
Sergio Abhimery
Sergio “De Niteroi” Iris Jose De Almeida
Sergio “Bolao” De Souza
Vinicius Cruz
Vitor Belfort (expelled)
Wallid “Paraiba” Ismail
Walter “Soldado” Da Silva
Walter “Casquinha” Guimaraes
Wander De Sousa
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