Very legit point that is hard to argue. At the same time, it's not Brock's fault that Randy was gone for a year and the UFC got impatient and had an interim title fight. I mean if Randy had never come back, would you be unwilling to call Nog the undisputed UFC Heavey Weight Champion because he never beat Randy.
Randy never lost his title, so for Brock to defeat him does make him the champion. I think this is all because of TUF personally, if they hadn't tied up Nog and Mir in the show before Randy came back, Randy's first fight probably would have been against Nog to have an undisputed champion. But they have to finish that "story line" for like of a better term.
Either way, I don't think Nog is getting ignored by the UFC like so many have suggested, he got a job on TUF, which is a golden spot for UFC fighters that instantly boost their public appeal and so their stock.
So right now we have two Champs, enjoy the suspence.
But again, that's just one side of the argument, I agree that until the tournament is over, it's a very gray area.
The way I look at it the second Randy resigned he gave up his title. Nog and Big Tim fought for the vacant title and obviously Nog won so he's the champ.
Didn't the UFC only keep calling Randy the camp to strengthen their case against him fighting somewhere else?
To me Randy - Brock was for a number 1 contender spot to face the HW champ Nog, and before people start having a go I would have seen it like that regardless of who won.
The UFC saw a chance to make a lot of money by having two title fights especially considering that the one with any credibility is between two fighters not that well known to casual fans. They knew that with either Randy or Brock (but especially Brock) as "champ" the HW division is a lot more marketable than having Nog or Mir with the strap.
I always think it's a bit goofy when they do the "interim" thing. It's like you have Champion 1A and 1B(pending)- meh. Even though there will not be a true HW champion until the next 2 fights settle it- you have 2 "champs" right now.
he just beat the hw champ, and thus makes him the new hw champ....nog is an interim champ...he's been in the ufc for much longer and has fought less than brock has
That's a load of crap. Nog was a paper champion who beat Tim"lay n pray" Sylvia for a paper title. Randy was the man to beat and Brock did it. He beat the real champion. Nog has been the one with the question mark on his head. The Interim title is a joke. Mir/Nog are fighting to be #1 contender. It's a screwed situation but it's the one the UFC set up. Kind of reminds me of when the WWE purchased WCW, and ECW and their were championship belts coming out of the wood works.
You are aware that Randy Couture beat Tim "lay n pray" Sylvia for the title, right? Also, you're aware that Randy didn't beat anyone to earn that shot, right?
I dislike the whole interim champ thing. It is awkward though when you have to strip a champion, because even holding a fully fledge tournament to determine a new champ, the old champ can always say he never got beat.
They should scrap the 'interim' if a champion is stripped, the new champion is the official champion, not the interim champion. Then if the old champion returns he can fight the new champion to win the belt back.
So if my theory was in practice, Big Nog is the offical champion as a result of Randy being stripped. Randy would have come back and fight him to find out the undisputed champion. It would have avoided this whole silly situation, whereby Mir beats the now Champion, and now has to beat the interim Champion, to fight the Champion he already beat.:dunno:
So...beating the reigning title holder isn't enough and to be considered a legit champ you have to beat the interim or temporary title holder? I don't follow.:confused02:
We all know there's exactly one reason why Couture was never stripped and that's because the UFC could prevent him from fighting outside the organization that way. Well I'm not one of the UFC's or Couture's lawyers, so to me Minotauro is the current UFC HW champion and will remain so until someone beats him (or until he refuses to defend his title, like Randy did:thumb02.
Brock winning has made the HW division a bigger mess. I don't think he deserved a title shot but he beat Randy. Randy had the tag of champ, so like it or not, Brock now has the champ tag. TUF also screwed things up but so did Randy coming back into the picture. It will all be cleared up when Brock faces the winner of Nog/Mir.
I agree. I also think with the current state of the division tnat Brock slipped into this too quickly and without 'ranking' (of courses matches that make money have priorty in the UFC).
He may have won the title but he is not a true champion yet.
I agree 100% especially since I chose Nog to bet Randy anyways. When they announced that he is the heavyweight champ the first thing that came into my mind is "Bullshit he is, he has to beat Nog first"
I see neither man as the Undisputed UFC Heavyweight Champion at this point. Let's face it, both Nog and Lesnar have their cases on why neither should be considered the "real" champion, and both have their cases on why they should.
There is no point in arguing this topic, at the end of this Tournament we will know who really is the UFC Heavyweight Championship but it just so happens Brock had a name and was able to fight top competition that got him there over others, and there is two belts.
All will be right in the end, and if Brock just happens to win it (which I really think he has great chance at doing) a lot of us will just have to accept Brock made the cross over, and had no problem doing it.
Except Nog had a prior resume in a different organization that included wins over Werdum, Herring (2), Cro Cop, Henderson, Sapp, Ricco Rodriguez, and a long list of elite opponents...
why should his prior record count? it would work if he was fighting for the Pride belt...but this is the UFC...you should have to earn your UFC title shots in the UFC as far as I'm concerned...and a mediocore performance against Herring was hardly worthy of a title shot IMO
The prior record in another organization matters to the UFC though. They gave Rampage a title shot after a mediocore KO of Eastman (forgive the wording - mediocore KO - but anyone can know Eastman is gonna get wrecked by Rampage), and then gave Henderson an immediate title shot at Rampage. Had Rampage not beat Liddell, Wand surely would've gotten the next crack at the title in his first fight in the UFC (since UFC 25).
If Nog were a mediocre fighter coming into the UFC then I would agree with you, but he's not. He was without a doubt the #3/#2 Heavyweight in the World. His latest fight against Herring wasn't that bad considering he was nearly out cold and managed to comeback and still win a UD.
What you've done just in the UFC shouldn't matter, what you've done in your entire career should looked at.
Shit, even Lesnar's pro-wrestling career helped him get where he is in MMA.
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