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Best For Self Defense

10K views 95 replies 38 participants last post by  Trixter45 
#1 ·
HI All

Im a huge MMA fan and want to start getting into training (mainly for fitness and self Defense, dont want to get my head smashed in for a living.

While i was on youtube i came across this video:

YouTube - jkd

I was just interested to know which u thought was better for real life situations, JKD or a mixture of boxing, BJJ etc etc.

Also why is it that JKD has never been sucessful in something like UFC or pride? Are the moves shown in the video not going to work in real life situations?

Many thanks all!
 
#27 ·
Heggi said:
Ok.. lets say the fight goes to the ground, and the other guy is on top of you, you go for a submission..
What do you think hes friends will do when they see you choke him out?
they will most likely stomp you in the head over and over again.. well then your ****ed
I'd try to defend the grappling side of self-defense more but I really can't for two reasons: 1.) I haven't trained in it and have never been in a fight where I've used it and 2.) until recently I was like you and didn't think grappling was the way to go but people on a message board convinced me (but they banned me from the message board because of my political stance) so I can't get any more ideas from them.

I think that grappling has it benefits in self-defense (and so does striking) so it isn't a black and white thing where only striking works or only grappling work, which is why I suggested the original poster take Hapkido because they teach some grappling and joint manipulations along with chokes, throws and striking.
 
#28 ·
Krav is excellent for self defense very brutal has no other applications then doing serios damage to some with as little effort as possile.. if you are looking for strict self defense do the Krav 1st then add something else to it if you want "More style"
As for JKD.. it is very hard to find real JKD teachers and places for teh simple fact bruce only allowed very few select people to teach it and they all had the understanding.. IT WAS NOT COMPLETE. Brue Lee the ever perfectionist was constantly changing and adapting what he knew to make it more effiecent and effective. JKD was designed to be quick and effective in a REAL fight.. it was never intented to be used in competitions hence not many JKD people do well in Martial arts competitions including MMA, though the mental aspects of JKD such as learing on to think on your feet and change instantly with the situation are very good.. as stated.. not many qualified experts out there to teach it.. regardless of what the shingle on the door says.. TO give you an Idea.. Kareem Abdual, Chuck Norris, Bill Wallace all trained with Bruce.. among other big names.. None walking around claiming to be able to teach it because they all knew bruce was not done with it.. There was still alot to go.. but if you do find one of the few qualified people, it is a good art to take.
 
#31 ·
best for self defense? i would personally say a combination of eskrima/arnis/kali (to learn how to deal with weaponry like knives) in combination with boxing and some basic grapping would do you well...

best self defense though is to try and avoid such situations...

since we're talking about self defense however, i think you should take a look at this vid :D (ppl have probably seen this before, but i dont care) :

YouTube - Bas Rutten Street Self Defense
 
#32 ·
The Don said:
And can anyone see the pictures in my signature or is it just me not beain able to see them?????
Actually... Unless your a paying member, you aren't allowed pics in your sig.
 
#33 ·
TheZar said:
best for self defense? i would personally say a combination of eskrima/arnis/kali (to learn how to deal with weaponry like knives) in combination with boxing and some basic grapping would do you well...

best self defense though is to try and avoid such situations...

since we're talking about self defense however, i think you should take a look at this vid :D (ppl have probably seen this before, but i dont care) :

YouTube - Bas Rutten Street Self Defense

Right away you say "I'm Sorry" bang..bang..bang.."NO I'M NOT!
 
#34 ·
I'd go with a JKD, BJJ and Kickboxing/Muay Thai mix. Kickboxing is very good for building power, speed and devastating striking power, provided you adapt the high hand stance and angles a little to account for the lack of gloves and the possibility of groin attacks. Muay Thai will get you the devastating knees and elbows. BJJ is for up close and takedown situations, although in general you wanna stay off the ground in streetfights. And JKD combines a lot of the others with some very effective locks, punches and traps, extremely effective in a streetfight. I've trained for a while in all of the above and have had to test them on the street more than once.
If you really want to push the barrier, train in Kali for knives.. nothing is more dangerous up close than a knife and someone who knows how to use it. Of course, it might be worse if you end up stabbing somebody rather than take a beating but in a life-or-death situation the knife skills are handy.
 
#37 ·
yea I got that.. thanks though... I used to be a mod back in the day when the site had few people.. it has grown alot... Heck I was the first person to reach the 1,000 post mark.. now I see people with 2,000 plus this site is exploding... I was just glad to help move it along in its early days..
 
#38 ·
Another art that I'd love to learn (but it may be hard to find depending on where you live) is Systema. It's a Russian martial art (similar to Krav Maga, but according to the Russians, it is much, much older and has roots hundreds of years ago). It can be devestating, but like I said, it can be hard to find a place that teaches it.
 
#39 ·
Zapatista said:
Another art that I'd love to learn (but it may be hard to find depending on where you live) is Systema. It's a Russian martial art (similar to Krav Maga, but according to the Russians, it is much, much older and has roots hundreds of years ago). It can be devestating, but like I said, it can be hard to find a place that teaches it.
The Systema is awesome. It is one of the most effective scientific martial arts ever made.. deadly. Krav Maga is child's play in comparison; I was never very impressed by Krav Maga.. It seems they mostly stress on unrealistic disarms performed on unmoving, unreacting opponents that just stand and let it happen. There is never any sparring, no real test for it. Real situations are much more dynamic than the scenarios in those training exercises depict.
 
#40 ·
The Don said:
yea I got that.. thanks though... I used to be a mod back in the day when the site had few people.. it has grown alot... Heck I was the first person to reach the 1,000 post mark.. now I see people with 2,000 plus this site is exploding... I was just glad to help move it along in its early days..
Ya I remember when I came here you, moldy, and ironman posted all the time, there is a lot more people now.

As for self defense if you are really worried about knives and guns I wouldn't even bother with martial arts. If you are over 18 and have a clean record get a CCW and a gun, if you are under 18 just carry a knife, most states let you carry one if the blade is under a certain length or if you can see it or something like that.

Now if I guy attacks you and it does not warrant a gun or knife the I would just train in boxing/kickboxing/Muay Thai (one of the three), and if you want Judo. I would pick Judo because in a street fight if it does go to the ground you are not going to be fighting against one of the Gracies, and you will not likely be on the ground for long so you would only need basic Jiu-Jitsu, which you will learn in Judo. There is no reason to go too far in depth with Jiu-Jitsu if your just using it for self defense. Also Judo has great throws that can do some real damage on concrete, and if you throw a guy real nice and his head lands right on the concrete I could see him giving up pretty fast.
 
#41 ·
I've been thinking about this and while boxing/kickboxing/Muay Thai is good for striking, I think people should learn at least basic blocking techniques from traditional martial arts (or at least train in boxing/kickboxing/muay thai MMA style with no gloves). The reason being this, in boxing/kickboxing/Muay Thai matches you have big gloves to help defend your head and you can use that to your advantage but when you get into a fight outside the ring (similar to a MMA situation) you won't have your gloves and it becomes harder to block shots to the head. A lot of the traditional martial arts work on blocks and are taught without gloves, so you could work on your defense that way. Keeping that in mind, Kyokushin Karate is very similar to Muay Thai (with the exception of no gloves and no fist strikes to the head, but there are kicks) and it is full-contact karate. They work on the clinch and use knees too, so you get everything you would get from Muay Thai but you don't have to worry about adapting from gloves.
 
#42 · (Edited)
Zapatista said:
JKD isn't just taking from multiple arts (that is what Mixed Martial Arts is), it was specific moves that Bruce Lee took from different martial arts and combined into his one system.

If you're looking for just fitness and self-defense, I'd suggest something along the lines of Hapkido and possibly Krav Maga, but definitely not boxing. Boxing (and to some extent Western Kickboxing) are horrible, in my opinion, for self-defense since for boxing you are taught to keep your hands up and protect your head with your hands (which have huge gloves on them), but when you're in the real world it is very hard to protect your head when you are bare-fisted. BJJ is always a good option too.

The reason I say that you should try out Hapkido is this: it covers strikes (both kicks and punches) and blocks. It also covers throws and some joint manipulations (especially small joint manipulations). So basically, if you have a good teacher, you can go to one place to train for your self-defense art which saves money. If you want to do boxing and BJJ (which doesn't make much sense to me if you don't want to compete in MMA) then you have to pay on average twice as much and travel to (possibly) two different places to train, which eats up time.

Okay first off Hapkido is totally gay and completely useless in real life situations and secondly if you're not intelligent enough to know that having solid boxing skills is one of the best forms of self defence and an absolute must in MMA then you should log off permanently and cram your keyboard up your ass. And you certainly shouldn't be giving anybody any advice.

Douche-bag.
 
#43 ·
Mr. Bungle said:
Okay first off Hapkido is totally gay and completely useless in real life situations and secondly if you're not intelligent enough to know that having solid boxing skills is one of the best forms of self defence and an absolute must in MMA then you should log off permanently and cram your keyboard up your ass. And you certainly shouldn't be giving anybody any advice.

Douche-bag.
When did I say boxing wasn't good for MMA? I simply said training in boxing and BJJ together isn't necessary if you're not planning on competing because there are arts out there that teach sufficient enough to be able to defend on the ground and stand up. Since we are talking strictly self-defense here, there are more options than just boxing that can work for a person. Arts such as Kenpo or Kyokushin Karate can work just as well as boxing or kickboxing in defending oneself. Remember, most people aren't trained in fighting so you don't have to be a black belt to successfully defend yourself (unlike in MMA).
 
#44 ·
While box is great for defense it is limited mainly to punching defense while what Zap said was there are other arts, more tradational ones that not only have great punching defense but have more defensive options in regards to takes downs kicks and such.

At least that is what I got out of what he said. My opinion on that kinda matchs right upI've studided a little boxing plus a whole slew of tradational arts, all I really got out of boxing was a bit more emphisis on avoiding punches to the fac it was things I already knew. just stressed more, as a punch was all a boxer needs to worry about. I am am more along the lines that more can be learned from a solid Tradational MA when it comes to defense that would carry over more to MMA, Like Tang Soo Do, or ishnryu or some such hard form.
 
#45 ·
Zapatista said:
When did I say boxing wasn't good for MMA? I simply said training in boxing and BJJ together isn't necessary if you're not planning on competing because there are arts out there that teach sufficient enough to be able to defend on the ground and stand up. Since we are talking strictly self-defense here, there are more options than just boxing that can work for a person. Arts such as Kenpo or Kyokushin Karate can work just as well as boxing or kickboxing in defending oneself. Remember, most people aren't trained in fighting so you don't have to be a black belt to successfully defend yourself (unlike in MMA).
I agree with Bungle. Hapkido, Tae-Kwon-do, Aikido and Judo are from the "-Do" (literal translation - form) school of eastern martial arts .. they are concerned more with the beauty of the form of martial arts and it's spiritual and personal development aspects. Read simply, they suck for real fighting. The "-Jutsu" (literal translation - technique) forms of martial arts are the actual warrior styles made for more practical application. So yes, Hapkido sucks. And don't even get me started on Krav Maga.. ugh, what a dumb choreographed "I do *this* reaaaal slow and you do this *hiiiyaaaa*!" piece of crap martial art. In the heat of a real fight you don't have time for most of that shit. And they advertise it as this super-dangerous form of dirty no-holds-barred fighting because of the eye-gouges and groin kicks they teach. Big f'in deal... anyone can do those given the opportunity, you don't need years of training to pull those dirty tactics off, just an opening.

Kickboxing and boxing may have a slight flaw of conditioning use of big gloves for blocking, but with minor adjustments in style to account for that, they are still the most powerful forms of striking in MMA today (along with muay thai). Almost all top mma fighters nowadays train in those styles to some degree. When has anyone seen a professional Hapkido mma fighter??
 
#46 ·
Liddellianenko said:
I agree with Bungle. Hapkido, Tae-Kwon-do, Aikido and Judo are from the "-Do" (literal translation - form) school of eastern martial arts .. they are concerned more with the beauty of the form of martial arts and it's spiritual and personal development aspects. Read simply, they suck for real fighting. The "-Jutsu" (literal translation - technique) forms of martial arts are the actual warrior styles made for more practical application. So yes, Hapkido sucks. And don't even get me started on Krav Maga.. ugh, what a dumb choreographed "I do *this* reaaaal slow and you do this *hiiiyaaaa*!" piece of crap martial art. In the heat of a real fight you don't have time for most of that shit. And they advertise it as this super-dangerous form of dirty no-holds-barred fighting because of the eye-gouges and groin kicks they teach. Big f'in deal... anyone can do those given the opportunity, you don't need years of training to pull those dirty tactics off, just an opening.

Kickboxing and boxing may have a slight flaw of conditioning use of big gloves for blocking, but with minor adjustments in style to account for that, they are still the most powerful forms of striking in MMA today (along with muay thai). Almost all top mma fighters nowadays train in those styles to some degree. When has anyone seen a professional Hapkido mma fighter??
you are a fool to think judo is in the same class as aikido, or hapkido.
i have done aikido (yoshinkai) and have sparred with my friend that does hapkido so i can say they are diffrent from judo in many ways.. what have you studied to make you say any of these styles are not up to par for a fight? in a fight i feel comforable using judo. i belive most guys on this list feel the same as me...

Judo MMA Database

i also belive dave camarillo, ufc coach from aka. would agree with me, as judo being a very good part of fighting...
 
#47 ·
Liddellianenko said:
I agree with Bungle. Hapkido, Tae-Kwon-do, Aikido and Judo are from the "-Do" (literal translation - form) school of eastern martial arts .. they are concerned more with the beauty of the form of martial arts and it's spiritual and personal development aspects. Read simply, they suck for real fighting. The "-Jutsu" (literal translation - technique) forms of martial arts are the actual warrior styles made for more practical application. So yes, Hapkido sucks. And don't even get me started on Krav Maga.. ugh, what a dumb choreographed "I do *this* reaaaal slow and you do this *hiiiyaaaa*!" piece of crap martial art. In the heat of a real fight you don't have time for most of that shit. And they advertise it as this super-dangerous form of dirty no-holds-barred fighting because of the eye-gouges and groin kicks they teach. Big f'in deal... anyone can do those given the opportunity, you don't need years of training to pull those dirty tactics off, just an opening.

Kickboxing and boxing may have a slight flaw of conditioning use of big gloves for blocking, but with minor adjustments in style to account for that, they are still the most powerful forms of striking in MMA today (along with muay thai). Almost all top mma fighters nowadays train in those styles to some degree. When has anyone seen a professional Hapkido mma fighter??
There's another thread that is talking about this type of thing. You're equating MMA with the real world, which is completely false. MMA teaches you to fight against 1 enemy and 1 enemy only. Some of the traditional arts teach how to deal with more than 1 (you may not destroy all of them, but you'd get farther than with MMA). The chances are too, that in a self-defense situation (which this thread is all about) there is a chance that the attacker will have a weapon. Boxing or Muay Thai isn't going to help you and will get you in trouble. The traditional arts (such as Hapkido, even though it's more modern than others) teach how to disarm the attacker and then take down the person.

Also, you won't see a Hapkido person do MMA for a couple reasons. 1.) Most traditional arts stress that the student isn't supposed to make money off of their training (with the exception of teaching) 2.) the person most likely to take Hapkido isn't the type of person that would want to get into MMA, if they wanted to they would do something else 3.) If you've seen anything other than UFC you'd realize that there are tons of traditional martial arts that are used in MMA. There are a lot of people who started (or still train) in Karate, TKD, Judo and others who do really well. Just look at K1 and you'll see traditional arts aren't bad. 4.) MMA has rules that restrict certain things whereas the self-defense arts have no rules. In real life, there are no rules. Sure you say that you can just "learn" or do the stuff in the heat of the moment when emotions kick in, but if you train heavily with the MMA rules you'll naturally revert to what you have trained in. That's what Krav Maga does. They teach a strike and repeat it until it is natural as a reflex, so when you need to fight you'll naturally know what to do.

Traditional arts aren't bad, and a lot of them are better at self-defense than the main arts of the UFC.
 
#48 ·
Why does everyone think boxing is so bad for self defense? I everyone says this stuff about how you can't block in a street fight like you do in boxing because of the big gloves (yet people except Muay Thai and kickboxing even though they almost always use gloves).

People forget one major thing about boxing, you learn how to strike too. When does blocking really become a big factor in a street fight? When you get attacked on the street you can either run, or hit back, blocks are not a big factor in a street fight because it is just too quick, but you can slip a punch and counter (which boxing focuses a lot on). In boxing you focus a lot on fast and powerful combinations and that can be lethal on the street. I'm telling you right now if a skilled boxer is attacked on the street he will unleash such a fast and powerful combination and drop the guy before he even knows what hit him.

And what is this shit about disarming people with knives and all that? If your getting attacked by a knife, get out of there as fast as possible, and if you can't then kick him in the nuts and try and parry the attack with one hand and use the other to start the combination. Who is really going to stand there and try and disarm the guy? This isn't Hollywood. If you are really afraid about knives and guns, carry your own.

This is a great article about a boxer who went to a traditional martial art class for self defense, and I think this would be a good read for some of you guys looking for self defense.
Your Top Source For Boxing Training Advice
 
#49 ·
CashKola said:
Why does everyone think boxing is so bad for self defense? I everyone says this stuff about how you can't block in a street fight like you do in boxing because of the big gloves (yet people except Muay Thai and kickboxing even though they almost always use gloves).

People forget one major thing about boxing, you learn how to strike too. When does blocking really become a big factor in a street fight? When you get attacked on the street you can either run, or hit back, blocks are not a big factor in a street fight because it is just too quick, but you can slip a punch and counter (which boxing focuses a lot on). In boxing you focus a lot on fast and powerful combinations and that can be lethal on the street. I'm telling you right now if a skilled boxer is attacked on the street he will unleash such a fast and powerful combination and drop the guy before he even knows what hit him.

And what is this shit about disarming people with knives and all that? If your getting attacked by a knife, get out of there as fast as possible, and if you can't then kick him in the nuts and try and parry the attack with one hand and use the other to start the combination. Who is really going to stand there and try and disarm the guy? This isn't Hollywood. If you are really afraid about knives and guns, carry your own.

This is a great article about a boxer who went to a traditional martial art class for self defense, and I think this would be a good read for some of you guys looking for self defense.
Your Top Source For Boxing Training Advice
Boxing may have fast and powerful combinations but so do other arts. Kenpo for example, has very fast combinations that are just as strong as a boxer's, but Kenpo also teaches more than just punches (with kicks and some styles teach some joint manipulations too). Some Kung Fu styles also focus on speed too. There isn't just one perfect art for self-defense, there are tons that are good for different people. I'd prefer to learn self-defense from an art that is a self-defense art and not a sport, but that's just me.
 
#50 ·
Zapatista said:
Boxing may have fast and powerful combinations but so do other arts. Kenpo for example, has very fast combinations that are just as strong as a boxer's, but Kenpo also teaches more than just punches (with kicks and some styles teach some joint manipulations too). Some Kung Fu styles also focus on speed too. There isn't just one perfect art for self-defense, there are tons that are good for different people. I'd prefer to learn self-defense from an art that is a self-defense art and not a sport, but that's just me.
True.. and another thing no one seems to have mentioned is the individual doing the art from or style or whatever. What works for one person might not work for another . When I worked as a bouncer there was nothing in MMA that would have really helped me in some of the situations. AS a bouncer you were not allowed to throw a punch until one was thrown at you, though it was mazing how hard you could bring someone down with out throwing a puch, and most of what I used I learned from tradational martial arts. like Judo, Karate, Tang soo do, Ninjitsu Jujitsu and others. GRanted there were a few take downs I did that were just as home in an MMA ring as they are in tradational MA there was no ground and pound. It usually ended up in a controling joint lock or submission, again acceptable in MMA but learned in a tradational sense. SO yea SOme MMA is applicable in real life. But the tradational art fors have been around for decades and centuries for a simple reason. They still have applications in the real world. Plus MMA is taken from tradational MA its not a whole seperate thing. With out Tradational MA there would be NO MMA. MMA is just a sport application of what has been learned for hundreds of years in tradational styles.
 
#51 ·
Krav Maga, some BJJ and Muy Thai is good 2. Some basic elements of boxing like slipping punches, how to throw a proper punch etc. are good but in a street fight some of the techniques taught to boxers will get ur ass kicked. For an example ik a few kids in my school that think there all bad ass cuz they take boxing and try bobbing and weaving during a fight only to get a knee to the face which by the way is very painful. Try looking for self defense based martial arts classes that are based on self defense in real life situations but also incoporate some Martial Arts as well.
 
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