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Fedor's Legacy

7K views 93 replies 29 participants last post by  kantowrestler 
#1 · (Edited)
Le's face it, it's tarnished. Yes, he was the best HW in the world at a time when the HW div. was the joke of MMA. That's the only place he shined. He did beat some old school HW's from the UFC and elsewhere. But those HW's have proven to be, at worst pathetic, at best, 2nd tier (Nog is really the only one that comes to mind).

In reality, Fedor was at the top of the heap for a very brief time when the sport was still taking off and the HW's barely spreading their wings. What kept his reputation going so long was not beating great fighters, but a disgusting display of record protecting by his management company, himself and the mma media who puffed up his p4p ranking.

Just as it took a middle-aged LHW in Couture to expose the HW div., it took a 40 year old middleweight UFC cut to expose Fedor as perhaps the most overrated fighter in MMA history. Like it or not, that's his legacy. Was he good during his time? Yes. But he and his cohorts wouldn't stop there and paid the price.

He should have entered the UFC and taken his lumps by the best on the world. He probably would have even got past Couture before getting destroyed by a true HW. He still would have had a great legacy. But instead he took the low road, and unfortunately even that proved too tough to navigate.

Fedor is the most overrated fighter in MMA history.
 
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#2 ·
It's a bit harsh, but I'm going to place blame on Vadummy from M-1.

They would have killed it win lose or draw against Brock. In fact I think Fedor would have been the one to dethrone em.

Funny how things turn out...
 
#3 ·
i would not say tarnished i have watch alot of prides and almost all the ufc and fedor is one of the greats for sure he almost had henderson and got caught. Know i am pissed he did not go to ufc write away but maybe he did not feel like he could compete there, to say the least he is great and dan henderson is also great i think he was win or lose in the fedor fight. Ufc did a wrong thing and let go dan hendo henderson. bottom line in my opnion
 
#4 · (Edited)
He's overrated only in that the best HW ever in MMA thus far should not be considered greater than the best at other divisions.

He'll be number 1 for a while in that division until Cain overtakes him, but I think even 3rd P4P all time is generous.


Also describing Hendo as a "UFC cut" or "UFC washout", is ridiculous. He was still a beast even if he wasn't the absolute best. He just wanted to make a ton of money so he left to SF who'd pay him 750k per fight.

But he is old as hell and he is an undersized LHW...that much is actually true.
 
#6 ·
I think what is happening here is that MMA is starting to get past Fedor. We heard this story many times before. Men who were once dominant start to look less imposing. Best example would be Matt Hughes.
remember when he was the most dominant WW in the world. Now he is nowhere in the picture. Same with Chuck Liddell and Wanderlei Silva. One day it will probably happen to Anderson Silva and GSP.
 
#7 ·
I think what is happening here is that MMA is starting to get past Fedor. We heard this story many times before. Men who were once dominant start to look less imposing. Best example would be Matt Hughes.
remember when he was the most dominant WW in the world. Now he is nowhere in the picture. Same with Chuck Liddell and Wanderlei Silva. One day it will probably happen to Anderson Silva and GSP.
Unless they retire early, on a winning streak, it will happen eventually. Maybie sooner then later.
 
#9 ·
I imagine people will say the same of gsp and anderson some day. I've been following MMA for a decade. Fedor was the greatest fighter to have ever lived up until the later 2000s. He is still the most achieved fighter, greatest heavyweight to have ever lived. This will not change if he loses 10 more fights.
 
#11 ·
Thank you.

I got him at number 2 all-time with GSP creeping up on him. Fedor is just past his prime, and he has been on the decline for a while.

His record against Minotauro Nogueira, Mirko Cro Cop, Andrei Arlovski, Tim Sylvia, Mark Coleman and Kevin Randleman (the best HW in the world during his era) is 8-0-1.

He hasn't been "Fedor" since 2006. The past three fights only tarnish his legacy a bit IMO. I hope Anderson retires before he starts to lose it, because I don't know how many times I listen to people discredit an all-time great's career when he inevitably loses a step.
 
#14 ·
Most fans like myself wanted to see Fedor vs Josh Barnett but it wasn't Fedor or his manangement team who screwed that fight up.

I won't argue that Fedor, at times, fought lesser opponents but mixed in were top fighters like Mirko and Nog in their top prime. All of them beaten.

I really don't care how Fedor ranks on people's top P4P lists as I think they(P4P lists) are ridiculous to argue as they will never be resolved but I won't discount his careeer and win streak just because of his latest results.​
 
#17 ·
Fedor was the best fighter in the world for at least an 8 year period, and for all practical purposes went undefeated over a ten year span.

Every fighter's skill level eventually declines and Fedor is certainly no exception there.

Chuck Liddell will be remembered as the greatest UFC LHW of his era; his string of losses at the end of his career does not detract from this fact.

Michael Jordan's stint with the Wizards was goofy; it does not affect his legacy.

A string of consecutive losses does have a bearing on a fighter's legacy if they occur in a fighter's prime years (late 20's, early 30's for example).

Fedor turns 35 this year, so a decline is not unexpected.
 
#20 ·
I don't know if it hurts Fedor's legacy. I think it puts it in perspective. It kind of depends on what you mean by all time great. Does that mean domininant in their time or a head to head in their prime matchup. A similarity could be drawn with boxing. Take Jack Dempsey, one of the first major champions in boxing. He is still considered an all time great, but his size and speed could compete with that of the top HWs like Lennox Lewis or Evander Holyfield. However on an all time greats list he would definitely be ahead of them.

Fedor's legacy is that he was the best HW of the PRIDE era. Yes he was protected after the fall of PRIDE and that may hurt him somewhat. I don't think he will go down as the greatest fighter of all time or even the greatest HW, because mma is still so young. The sport simply passed Fedor by. Ali lost 3 out of his last 4. Two were to less than stellar opponents in Berbick and Spinks. Most fighters fight too long. A very few walk away when they should.
 
#25 ·
Hit the nail on the head. Nobody remembers Joe Lewis' or Alis losses unless it was a war. The losses at the tail end of their careers never really get noted as the fighters are on the decline.

As for Fedor, I really don't care what peoples personal opinions of him are, he is without doubt, one of the greatest ever. Top 3. Easy. Just because the level of opponent has grown stronger while Fedor has got older doesn't mean anyone should think anything less of him. Its called progression. How can anyone really expect Fedor to be undefeated all his career when MMA is progressing and developing so fast?

I think a couple of people mentioned fickleness. Its f*cking epidemic in the world of a MMA fan. People will be hanging of a certain fighters balls one month, next month the same fans will be denouncing the fighter, claiming him to be a 'can' or whatever. I don't think its gonna change. I think its down to each individual fan. Nobody wants to be wrong. Everyone wants to appear knowledgeable. Thats why minds change so often. People are too worried about other peoples opinions.
 
#21 ·
Fedor Legacy is in his own time period, anyone who shits on it is no real mma fan. The sport of mma has grown, when looking back 20 years from now you place fedor like u go other athletes on his own. Fedor is the greatest fighter out of the pride, chuck was the great lhw of the early 2000's. You leave it as what it was just like any other sport. You have the goat anderson silva who is like Jordan, then you have the older guys who are like russels, wilt,etc. For example in the nba people hold bill russel as an all time great but facts are if he was in his prime, shaq would kill him. Just as chuck in his prime would have possibly get beat by shogun,machida, and Jon jones. You don't discredit chuck, its just the sport has grown. Fighters will only get better and better.
 
#22 ·
I dont think his legacy is in question, he was the best heavyweight for a good ten year period. His MMA age has cought up with him now, hes had a lot of wars.

In terms of the 'Best ever' no man will surpase the brilliance of Rob Emerson and why so many try is beyond me.
 
#24 ·
while yes he did win most of his fights, when i look at his record, i only see 8 or 9 really challenging high quality fights, people say AA and sylvia werent crap when he fought them, but they were cans after, and are cans now. whos to say they weren't cans when he fought them after all? not to mention the fact he never went to the ufc, and has now lost to 2 people who were either cut, or wanted too much money for the ufc's taste and a bigfoot, i didnt believe he was the best when he hadnt lost since a doctor stoppage, and i certainly dont believe he ever was the best now.
 
#27 ·
The guy is 34. People talk about these three losses as if they shouldn't count as he's too old and past it. But 34 really isn't old for a fighter. We see alot of guys just starting to fight at 30. He's done very well in his career up until this point, so his legacy will remain, he was the best HW for a set period.

But for those saying he's the best HW ever then that has no logic behind that. Seeing as he's already lost to two HW's they are surely better than him?
 
#29 ·
Fedor is one of the best ever, no tarnish to his legacy whatsoever....so what? he lost after a decade of dominance and is suffering from what EVERY fighter will eventually come across....the decline of their dominance and/or deteriaton of their skills.

He's still the guy who survived getting slammed on his head and won, the guy who beat CroCop, Big Nog etc etc etc. some of those fights are part of MMA legend...

...just my view...and I don't even like the guy!
 
#30 ·
....so what? he lost after a decade of dominance and is suffering from what EVERY fighter will eventually come across....the decline of their dominance and/or deteriaton of their skills....
I'm so thankful Henderson exposed this myth. His legacy will be a decade of ducking (maybe half a decade to be fair), rather than a decade of dominance.
 
#32 ·
He can't be a Guy that gave us exciting fights? His record is really not that great if your looking at it to validate him as a legend. Truth be told his record is little padded IMO but I enjoyed every fight I've seen which is more than I can say about gap or Silva and to me that's enough.
 
#34 ·
I think thats just human nature but I've been training hard and have not had a lot of time to hangout here. Been trying to get myself in fight shape.

Anyway I have nothing but respect for Fedor and his accomplishments the only fighter I can't stand is Sonnen.
 
#36 ·
My only beef with Fedor is avoiding the best and not going out like he should have. Liddell Couture Hughes even the beloved Shamrock went out like champions. They fought the best until they were no longer the best and the best passed them up. They never attempted to protect their records. Fedor could have done this. He would have had my respect.

Who's Sonnen?
 
#38 ·
MMA fans are becoming just as fickle as boxing fans.

Lose a fight or two and all of a sudden he's 'overrated' or 'he was never that good in the first place' :rolleyes:

Has Fedor declined? Yes.

Has the sport passsed him by? possibly....

Is it time for him to hang up his gloves? IMO, yes.

But get the **** outta here with all the 'overrated' 'not that good' bullshit. Fedor is the greatest HW of his era, hands down.
 
#49 ·
Come on guys if your really going to take the negative road on fedor's legacy and bright up that his past was a joke etc. You might as well bring everything that happen in the past in mma in to dispute. Fedor is a legend leave it as that, if your going to let his 3 fights lost in recent memory put an astrik on his entire career you might as well do the same to even great fighter from the pass.

At the end of the day, Fedor,wandy,big nog,chuck,bass,gracie,etc are all mma legend and all have great legacy in the sport. Just leave the past in the past and move on. Don't let the future affect the pas, because deep down we all know any old school legend could not hang with the guys today.
 
#59 ·
You can't water down his wins with a size argument, Fedor himself is a natural cruiserweight and IMO should fight at lw.

He didn't duck anyone in pride and to me m1 was the issue with matchmaking. He's a legend not for what he is doing now or where he's ranked in today's mma but for what he did in pride.
 
#63 ·
I think respected and overrated must be distinguished. Randy was hardly the best heavyweight, but respected by all... in the same way Fedor's humility and fight ethic is respected by all. All those who consider him invincible AND those who consider him to be way overrated, are off the mark. The guy is a legend the same way, Mirko, Randy, Wanderlei and Hendo are... I think trying to say who the bigger legend is, is where the fail comes along. Its a bit like trying to say which supermodel is hotter... stupid, but one thing must be taken for granted... we all eventually lose that edge.
 
#65 ·
I think respected and overrated must be distinguished. Randy was hardly the best heavyweight, but respected by all... in the same way Fedor's humility and fight ethic is respected by all. All those who consider him invincible AND those who consider him to be way overrated, are off the mark. ....
So would you admit he was slightly overrated?

For me it's been crazy following this guy over the years waiting for him to prove his ranking. As well as all the trash talking that went on for him. As far as I'm concerned, he never earned his ranking in the last 5 years. Before that, yes, he was the best HW. There are 5 or 6 guys in the UFC that would have beaten him in the HW division. And I think there were also a few LHW's that would have also. Regardless, fighters should have to prove their rank, and not get rewarded for staying away from the top promotion.
 
#66 · (Edited)
Of course! I never disputed this. But this thread is not about that. It's about a fighter who ducked the best for years to protect his record. none of the above mentioned did that. That's the difference.

What bugs me is the straw man that's continually put forth that this is about losses at the end of a career. (notice the moronic post below mine)
 
#71 ·
OP you should seriously quit it already. You talk about Fedor and his ridiculous fans? Kind of hypocritical considering you're trying to slander him.

He never ducked anyone, that's just plain nonsense. You said he was irrelevant since 2006... he fought 2 ex UFC champs that 'were' (key word) ranked then.

Barnett was the only other big name he would have fought then (if it hasn't been for his partaking in a banned substance).

Fans like you make everyone else really look bad because of your negativity, lack of knowledge and disrespect to a legend.
 
#78 ·
For the last time Fedor ducked nobody...who did he duck some ufc guys? I bet if any of those dude was in strikeforce he would have fought them. He did not duck anybody in pride, he did not duck anybody in strikeforce. If he had won against big foot it would have been him vs the reem.
 
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