Being weighed in the day before the fight. - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
General MMA Discussion Discuss King Of The Cage, Ultimate Challenge UK, and HDNet Fights as well as general mixed martial arts discussion.

Reply

Old 10-24-2011, 01:26 AM   #1 (permalink)
MMA Fanatic
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 64
EagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to all
Being weighed in the day before the fight.

Do people like how this is done? I don't like it at all.

I wasn't sure when this started...so I've done some research on it to find out.

It never made sense to me....but I knew that it obviously made sense to somebody or fighters would still weigh in shortly before the fight.

The research is boxing related....but MMA being a combat sport....I think they just followed boxings lead & run their sport the same way.

And the reason this happened....as when doing research on almost anything....had to do with money. I didn't write the following paragraphs....but I agree with them.

It slowly started being weaned out in the early to mid 80's though wasn't in full effect until the mid to late 80's. I think it's one of boxing's major problems actually and should be put back to what it was. Due to certain bodies, the ability to lose then regain massive amounts of weight allows them to drop down and gain unnatural advantages that have nothing to do with their natural size (ie. see Thomas Hearns; his natural size was an advantage but he weighed in exactly the same weight as his opponent on the day of the fight) advantage and any advantages in boxing skill.

It should be about the skill and any natural advantages they have in the same weight division. When one fighter can put on 20 pounds even though he's meant to be weighing in the same as his opponent at a certain weight limit it basically kills the entire point of weight divisions. When one fighter can fight at 147 yet weigh in for that 147 fight at 165 pounds it rather defeats the purpose of having the weight limit of 147 pounds. If you can't fight at 147 pounds then you shouldn't be there, you should be at 154, 160 or 168.

You get ridiculous fights like Gatti/Gamache which was for all intents and purposes a welterweight fighting a lightweight yet billed as two fighters in the same division. It does create an unfair advantage which should not have to be made up for by extra skills. Things should be equal when fighting in between weight limits. Then areas such as skill, speed, power and natural size and strength play the part they are supposed to. It's the entire reason weight divisions were put in place in the first place! To stop one fighter from fighting a guy 10, 15 pounds smaller. Great fighters don't necessarily need weight divisions but overall it's an incredibly important part of equal play sport which is being made a mockery of in today's boxing game.

You only need to look at certain fights today to see how wrong it can be. Nonito Doniare vs Someone Marquez was a classic example. Doniare was scary big compared to a genuine looking Flyweight and I doubt Donaire would have had any chance of getting to that weight without day before weigh ins with well over 24 hours to regain his strength and weight. He looked like a solid, natural lightweight fighting a solid, natural Flyweight and that's how it ended up....ie. with Marquez broken and beaten. It might have ended the same way but that's not at all the point.


Back to why this started....I also didn't write the following paragraphs.

Here's what I found:

Same-day weigh-ins got tossed by the wayside back in 1983, when Eddie Mustapha Muhammad came in overweight for a light-heavyweight unification match with Michael Spinks. Back in the day, this was a legit superfight with all the attendant hoopla.

Spinks refused to go through with the fight, even after Eddie proposed just making it a nontitle go. Spinks was pissed because, as he said, he sacrificed and trained hard to make the weight, and if Muhammad couldn’t bother to do the same, then screw it ...

The promoter, HBO, the alphabets and the commissions decided that in the future, all weigh-ins would be the day before, so that a cancellation like this would never happen again.

Another source:

After the Eddie Mustapha-Michael Spinks unification bout that didn't come off in 1983. Eddie weighed in at 180 & proposed they make it a non-title fight. Spinks told him where to go because he had sacrificed & lost the weight & felt Eddie should have also.

The fight was canceled & HBO & the Promoters were left holding the bag instead of raking it in for what was a super fight in it's day.

Shortly after that to protetct the promoters & networks the alphabets switched to day before weigh-ins for he "health" & "security" of the fighters.

Here’s yet another report:

Published: July 22, 1983
Eddie Mustafa Muhammad issued an apology of sorts yesterday for the cancellation of his light heavyweight title bout against the champion, Michael Spinks, last week.

The bout was cancelled after Mustafa Muhammad refused to take off 2 1/2 pounds to make the 175-pound weight limit. ''I realize,'' the boxer said in a statement billed as an apology, ''that had I made an attempt at losing the weight, my status in the boxing world would not have deteriorated as it has.'' When questioned, however, the fighter sounded less than contrite. ''I don't regret what I have done because I am a man of principle,'' he said, ''but someone has to apologize.'

Also:
The fight between Griffith and Benvenuti was outdoors at Shea Stadium, and they both weighed in the day of the fight. Benvenuti weighed 160 pounds and Griffith weighed 155 pounds. There was inclement weather that afternoon, and the fight got postponed to the next day.

The next day, they made them weighed in again, and Benvenuti weighed 159¾! and Emile weighed 154!

Here's what I found out about the Mancini/Kim affair in 1982:

Just so you know, Kim had to struggle mightily to lose weight on the days prior to the bout with Ray Mancini so that he could weigh in under the Lightweight's 135 pound limit, or, as they say in boxing, "make weight". Prophetically, he wrote the message "kill or be killed" on his Las Vegas hotel room's mirror only days before the bout.
EagleClaw29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 

Old 10-24-2011, 01:56 AM   #2 (permalink)
LONGHAIRED COUNTRYBOY
 
oldfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: NC.
Posts: 7,383
Blog Entries: 1
oldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Materialoldfan Is Future HOF Material
Good stuff, thanks for posting. I remember that fight but, i never realized the implications of it. I think you're right that MMA just followed Boxings lead on this without thinking it through. Then came the wrestlers who've been cutting weight their whole lives and screwed the system. I would strongly support same day weigh ins and an end to weight cutting.

Unfortunately I don't think it will happen until someone has a heart attack or dies. Then Dana will make it happen effortlessly.

here's a piece of an old article I like to post in weight cutting threads.

Quote:
In 1997, three college wrestlers made national headlines, dying within 33 days of each other. Coming from Michigan, North Carolina, and Wisconsin, these dedicated athletes died from the same cause: weight cutting. In all three cases, the students experienced dehydration resulting in hypothermia after they layered on clothes and did endless workouts in heated rooms. Unfortunately, they out-worked their bodies. The perspiration they produced cooled them to the point of hypothermia resulting in heart attacks and kidney failure, all common effects of extreme weight cutting.
__________________
oldfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2011, 02:30 AM   #3 (permalink)
BEWARE OF THE PENGUIN!
 
No_Mercy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 10,220
No_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF MaterialNo_Mercy Is Future HOF Material
Now I know why they implemented that. Always wondered why... Still am a proponent of doing the weigh ins the day of. That would dramatically change the entire landscape of things. Fighters would be fighting in their own respective weight classes. Simple as that.

I think everybody would shift up a notch except for Frankie Edgar and of course all of the heavyweights. That would also mean Rampage, JBJ, The Polish Experiment, Bader, and a few others would be forced to fight in the HW division...haha! Actually that would work and the SUPER HW division cut off would now be 245. It definitely would be a bit more fair.

I mean cmon look at Hughes vs Thiago Alves or Josh. Anthony Johnson vs most WWs, Gleison Tibau at LW, so on and so forth.

The reason I bring this up cuz after rolling with amateurs who weigh in 50+ heavier than me I realized that "if" they had the knowledge and same skill sets it would be extremely difficult to obtain any advantage. Translate that to pro MMA fights any distinct weight/strength difference gives a huge advantage.

I think Rich Franklin vs Forrest Griffin is a prime example. He's one of the few who's actually fighting in his own weight class and he's struggling.

I'd like to see this on a trial basis to see how it goes. If the fighter doesn't make weight take his entire purse. This isn't some barn yard show, you're a professional so they should act accordingly.
No_Mercy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2011, 05:29 AM   #4 (permalink)
Know what im sayin'?
 
"El Guapo"'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: England
Posts: 545
"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now"El Guapo" is on another level now
Don't really see why it would be implemented now considering is would mess up the title picture of every division (bar HW).

I am a proponent of same day weigh-ins but this shit needs to be sorted out way back when the UFC started and had weak rosters.

You say people have a massive advantage in size by cutting, well the people who are fighting at their actual weight should cut to the division below if they feel size/strength to be a major issue. I mean weight cutting is part of the sport now, literally 95% of the division cut like 5-10 pounds at least, just gotta roll with it really.
__________________


2012 FFL Team : Hector Lombard, Jake Shields, Demian Maia, Ed Herman, George Sotiropoulus
"El Guapo" is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2011, 06:45 AM   #5 (permalink)
Sleepy
 
Hawndo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 2,136
Hawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound GreatHawndo Is A Pound 4 Pound Great
I read an article from a doctor, it was specifically about MMA (Think it was the "that's a killshot" dude from Deadliest Warrior)and he said why from a medical perspective you HAVE to have day before weigh ins. He felt people would just cu the same amount of weight resulting in fighters simply fighting dehydrated. I tried finding the article but failed so I'm doing this from memory until I find it.

He argued this limits the fluid in the brain and any shots taken to the head will cause a significant amount of damage to the brain, resulting in easier knockout as the brain is smashing against the skull without the fluid cushion it usually has. It also results in serious long term damage (like pugilistic dementia).

I was all for same day weigh ins until I read it, really wish I could find the article.
__________________

Thanks to Leakler for the sig
Hawndo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2011, 10:35 AM   #6 (permalink)
MMA Fanatic
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 64
EagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to allEagleClaw29 is a name known to all
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawndo View Post
I read an article from a doctor, it was specifically about MMA (Think it was the "that's a killshot" dude from Deadliest Warrior)and he said why from a medical perspective you HAVE to have day before weigh ins. He felt people would just cu the same amount of weight resulting in fighters simply fighting dehydrated. I tried finding the article but failed so I'm doing this from memory until I find it.

He argued this limits the fluid in the brain and any shots taken to the head will cause a significant amount of damage to the brain, resulting in easier knockout as the brain is smashing against the skull without the fluid cushion it usually has. It also results in serious long term damage (like pugilistic dementia).

I was all for same day weigh ins until I read it, really wish I could find the article.
While reading your reply I noticed the line about "pugilistic dementia" & it reminded me about a guy that had this so badly after his boxing career that it was very sad.

The guy is...was...Jerry Quarry. I know that I'm older than the average posters here & many will never have heard of this guy.

He was a very tough Irish American white fighter. He was a top notch heavyweight when the USA had all the best heavyweights...what ever happened to that?

The days of Ali, Frazier, Norton, etc. And he fought them all. His only drawbacks was that he was light (usually fought at around 200 pounds), he cut easily, & he was in the era of Ali, Frazier, Foreman....& lost to them all while beating almost everybody else.

After boxing he was unable to feed or dress himself & had to be cared for by relatives. He had 3 brothers & 2 of them were boxers & both of them also ended up with "PD". Only the brother that didn't box avoided it.

If anybody is interested in reading some more about Jerry Quarry......http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Quarry
EagleClaw29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2011, 03:22 PM   #7 (permalink)
The Title Guy
 
kantowrestler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Orange, California
Posts: 11,155
kantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By Allkantowrestler Is Beloved By All
The thing is wrestling has always had weight cuts for much before that 1982 incident. However, wrestling is not as high impact. They actually instigated same day weigh-ins cause of weight cutting related deaths.
__________________
The Emoticon Guy
kantowrestler is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On

VerticalSports
Baseball Forum Golf Forum Boxing Forum Snowmobile Forum
Basketball Forum Soccer Forum MMA Forum PWC Forum
Football Forum Cricket Forum Wrestling Forum ATV Forum
Hockey Forum Volleyball Forum Paintball Forum Snowboarding Forum
Tennis Forum Rugby Forums Lacrosse Forum Skiing Forums
Copyright (C) Verticalscope Inc SEO by vBSEO 3.3.2
Powered by vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2009 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.
vBCredits v1.4 Copyright ©2007, PixelFX Studios