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Has anyone else tried this?

2K views 17 replies 12 participants last post by  T-Clutch 
#1 ·
The first time I saw this, I thought it was one of those submissions that would never work if you tried it a thousand times, but I've been able to submit a few guys with it.

YouTube - Americana Armlock

Has anyone else tried to use it before? By the way, the link says Americana Armlock, but it's not the standard Americana.
 
#3 ·
The Americana using the legs off of side control. That's a good hold right there if your opponent forgets where their near-side hand is. It's not one that you'll hit too often on a more experienced guy, but it's usually largely available when you settle into the scarf hold/head-and-arm off of side control/kesa gatame position.

The reason why it's not seen too often against more experienced guys is two-fold:

1) Most experienced guys won't give you too much time to actually settle into that position. They'll be bucking, bridging and turning in order to create space and wiggle room. This doesn't give the top guy too much time to reach for the hold if they're concerned with maintaining control.

2) Once you try to control the bottom man's near arm to start working it from that position, your intentions become real obvious. If they hadn't started working actively yet, once you clue them in that you want their arm they'll start moving with a frantic sense of purpose. Some may even let you play with their arm to set you up for an escape. Once you're concentrating on the arm, you give up a post to use for control. That makes sweeping or escaping the bottom side of that position a lot easier.

Once you do get the lock with your legs, the results come pretty quick. Some of the holds I've seen involve locking the near arm with the legs in the Americana, and then reaching for the far arm for a Kimura or Straight Arm Bar. This creates the situation where the guy on the bottom starts tapping with their feet or yelling out "TAP! TAP!" because their hands are all tied up. :thumb02:
 
#4 ·
yes i have used that before i also use a variation of that by stepping on my opponets wrist for a straight arm bar, we call it ude hishigi ashi gatame(basiclly any foot to arm joint lock).. it is used with great success if you have a good scarf hold. good for gi and nogi.
 
#5 ·
I've tried it on the mat, but, realistically, I'd never use it in competition or on the street, it's too easy for someone to see coming and make it really hard to get. It just seems like a waste of time for me.

Some techniques are just flashy, some work. I have tried to avoid spending time on the ones that are too fancy. The technique looks tight, and controlling leverage looks really easy, but I just don't think the set up is practical. If I'm in that position, I generally go to chest-to-chest and attack the opposite arm or the throat, depending on which one is being defended.
 
#9 ·
its a good move never seen it before im going to start training it but i do know of a move from that same position where you use on of your legs and put their arn on top if and then use the other leg to pull it down but from that position i usually just put their arm in between my legs and reach over to the other arm and get them ina kimura even if they flip me over the hold is already in and they will tap
 
#10 ·
I've managed to pull it off against 3 people, but they were all white belts (like me) who I regularly submit.

I use it as 1 of 6 submissions from side control. I'm not so hot with terminology, but I think you'd call it a 6-lock flow.
1. kimura
2. americana
3. straight armbar
4. leg americana
5. have no idea what its called, but you pinch your opponents far-side arm between your chin and shoulder (thumb against your neck), step over their head, grip your own hand around their elbow, and pull their elbow in the wrong direction.
6. Wizzer on their near side arm, step over head, bend elbow the wrong direction.

I'm terrible with these descriptions. We don't use terminology in class so I only know how to show someone else, not describe it.

The point is, it is a low-percentage move, but if it's one of six, you have that option depending on what your opponent is doing with their arms.

When I've caught someone with a leg-americana it was because they were focusing on avoiding one of the other 5 submissions in my list. I quickly (very quickly) refocus on their near-side arm and get the leg-americana.
 
#11 ·
sove said:
1. kimura
2. americana
3. straight armbar
4. leg americana
5. have no idea what its called, but you pinch your opponents far-side arm between your chin and shoulder (thumb against your neck), step over their head, grip your own hand around their elbow, and pull their elbow in the wrong direction.
6. Wizzer on their near side arm, step over head, bend elbow the wrong direction.
The last two make no sense.

The other ones that you should learn, at least for later, are as follows (since I'm pretty sure they aren't what you mean):

1) Far side armbar (you probably only use the same side one, because you're a white belt, but the far side one is pretty cool)

2) Arms crucifix (awesome submission, though it's illegal in competitions, it's great for MMA and for the street, where it completely immobilizes your opponent)

3) Gi choke (it's a lapel choke that my instructor really likes, and it's also great because it sets up from the hammer lock position, or the position you get to right before setting up the armbar)

4) Kneebar (works great if you hook the knee and pass to a reverse mount once you know how to lock it up)

5) Guillotine chokes (great escape prevention) which you can see my piece on in my training log.
 
#12 ·
IronMan said:
The last two make no sense.

The other ones that you should learn, at least for later, are as follows (since I'm pretty sure they aren't what you mean):

1) Far side armbar (you probably only use the same side one, because you're a white belt, but the far side one is pretty cool)

2) Arms crucifix (awesome submission, though it's illegal in competitions, it's great for MMA and for the street, where it completely immobilizes your opponent)

3) Gi choke (it's a lapel choke that my instructor really likes, and it's also great because it sets up from the hammer lock position, or the position you get to right before setting up the armbar)

4) Kneebar (works great if you hook the knee and pass to a reverse mount once you know how to lock it up)

5) Guillotine chokes (great escape prevention) which you can see my piece on in my training log.
:) Yeah, I almost deleted the post because I couldn't think of a way to describe them. I'm going to look through Bas Rutten's book to see if I can get a picture. The submissions really do exist. I swear.
 
#13 ·
Here are pictures of the two that "don't make sense."

I have learned far side armbars. I just looked it up. We've learned at least 3 far side armbars. (Far side armbar from knee on belly, far side armbar (quick armbar) from guard, and another that I can't find a picture or name for...) I use/attempt to use them regularly.

And I think that by straight armbar I was referring to a straight keylock.

It's great having people online who have knowledge enough to teach me something over the Internet. I can actually say that I learned something on MMAforum today!
 

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#14 ·
Kneebar... I like it. I have no idea how to set it up, but I'm going to look for an explanation somewhere, unless you'll be so kind as to hook me up with one of your easy to implement descriptions.

I only know knee bars from half-guard (bottom).
 
#16 ·
sove said:
Here are pictures of the two that "don't make sense."

I have learned far side armbars. I just looked it up. We've learned at least 3 far side armbars. (Far side armbar from knee on belly, far side armbar (quick armbar) from guard, and another that I can't find a picture or name for...) I use/attempt to use them regularly.

And I think that by straight armbar I was referring to a straight keylock.

It's great having people online who have knowledge enough to teach me something over the Internet. I can actually say that I learned something on MMAforum today!
The top one is just an inverted armbar. You can do it from guard too, if your opponent puts his hands above your shoulders. I've found it's particularly effective if he misses a punch.

The bottom one is Bas' variation of an armbar from sidecontrol. He's doing an elbow tuck armbar, which increases leverage, but makes it a little bit harder to get, because you're not hooking the elbow. His positioning is also pretty wierd on the technique, I'd never attack a submission from that position, but I'm not Bas.

Personally, I have found that both armbars, near and far side armbars, are really good, because most newcomers to jiu-jitsu and most MMA fighters who are just getting started don't think about them from that position, they are just worried about the shoulder locks (americana, Kimura, etc.) which also makes the straight, pinned version of the inverted armbar effective too.
 
#17 ·
IronMan said:
The top one is just an inverted armbar. You can do it from guard too, if your opponent puts his hands above your shoulders. I've found it's particularly effective if he misses a punch.

The bottom one is Bas' variation of an armbar from sidecontrol. He's doing an elbow tuck armbar, which increases leverage, but makes it a little bit harder to get, because you're not hooking the elbow. His positioning is also pretty wierd on the technique, I'd never attack a submission from that position, but I'm not Bas.

Personally, I have found that both armbars, near and far side armbars, are really good, because most newcomers to jiu-jitsu and most MMA fighters who are just getting started don't think about them from that position, they are just worried about the shoulder locks (americana, Kimura, etc.) which also makes the straight, pinned version of the inverted armbar effective too.
Now that I look at the bottom one, I see that the version I know is a little different. We do it with the elbow hooked.

These armbars also--almost--work against more advanced grapplers when they know that I'm a white belt. I won't say that I managed to submit a brown belt, but he was REALLY surprised that I knew far side armbars. I laughed... then he escaped and submitted me 4 times, but it was funny for a minute.

I guess my point in my posts is that having a series of 6 or more submissions at your disposal from side control increases your chance at locking in the submission that started this thread. I got a leg kimura again (I think that's 4 now) because I had my opponents far-side arm isolated and was defending against submissions on that arm. He was trying to free up his other arm, I quickly popped it into position, lifted his head, and it was over.

BTW... if anyone is interested, Bas' book is posted somewhere on this site. If you search for it you should be able to find it. I love it, but unfortunately, he doesn't name anything, so you may know 10 armbar variations, but you'll have no idea what they're called.
 
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