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Old 10-04-2007, 06:34 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Defense against shoot

I have never wrestled so excuse my ignorance but do you have any other way of defending against a shot by sprawling (in wrestling/grappling context, not mma)

And by the way in mma why do we never se someone try to strike against to avoid the shoot? I imagine a good knee could do the job, but I dont remember seein it.....
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Old 10-04-2007, 07:16 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Well i dunno the answer to the first part of the question or statement... but to the second part about just sticking your knee up and not seeing it done lol... watch Sherk V. Franca at UFC 73 Stacked... at the start of all 5 rounds almost when sherk shoots for the take down franca hits a knee square in sherks face lol... but sorry can't help with the first part i've never wrestler the only grapplin i done is muay thai shit
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Old 10-04-2007, 10:05 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I wrestled throughout my high school career and I can tell you that the best way to defend a takedown is to sprawl, other than that the next best thing to try and to is sidestep the shoot and go for the back. I guess you could also try and grab a shoulder lock but that is not recommended.
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Old 10-04-2007, 11:53 AM   #4 (permalink)
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The options you have for defending a shoot depends greatly on the distance between yourself and the opponent.

If they're shooting from the outside, you could post your hands against his head and angle out. Or you could drop levels and post your forearms against his collar to 'block' the shot. You could underhook an arm to prevent him from getting a good grip on you, while throwing your hips back... Or, you could do a full sprawl.

When he leg-dives from the clinch, you can sprawl, sprawl, or get dropped. Underhooking an arm is still a viable maneuver, but its useless without the sprawl.

If he's already grabbed you, you can only sprawl with all your might... Force your hips back and your legs out of his grasp. But, more than likely, if he's grabbed you, you're already on your back. =[

(Tangent: I remember when I mentioned angling out to defend a shoot, I got some flak for it from someone... I recently bought that Mixed Martial Arts: The Book of Knowledge by BJ Penn, and he advocated something very similar. Hopefully, we can agree that he knows more than all of us, and that he's correct.)

As for the knee, people try it. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. However, if you REALLY dont want to be on the ground, kneeing isn't the best option. That's because, while you'll probably damage the other guy, you're handing him your leg.
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Old 10-06-2007, 11:43 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fullcontact
... do you have any other way of defending against a shot by sprawling (in wrestling/grappling context, not mma)
Do you mean that you want to learn a tactic other than sprawling?

Or do you want to learn to do other things from a sprawling position?

As far as looking for something to do other than sprawling, there aren't many options unless you are vastly superior than your opponent. If you don't employ some form af a sprawl, chances are you will be taken down.

But, once you sprawl, that's where your options lie. A three quarter nelson is an excellent tool to utilize. Applied properly, you will:
  1. Control your oppopnents' head.
  2. Tie up one of his arms.
  3. Keep him from grabbing you with his other arm.
Also, there are variations of the three quarter nelson that allow you to put your opponent directly to his back and pin him by eliminating him from bridging.

Look into the three quarter nelson and sprawl DEEP.
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Old 10-14-2007, 02:48 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fullcontact
I have never wrestled so excuse my ignorance but do you have any other way of defending against a shot by sprawling (in wrestling/grappling context, not mma)

And by the way in mma why do we never se someone try to strike against to avoid the shoot? I imagine a good knee could do the job, but I dont remember seein it.....
Guys get kneed in the face shooting all the time. James Irvin vs. Terry Martin is a good example of that.

The best way I can think of from a grappling standpoint is a rolling sweep with double underhooks. When your opponents shoots you drop your center of gravity lower than his, get the underhooks and roll over your back. Almost like a lower, more dynamic suplex.

There are also armdrags, the guillotine choke and a handful of flying armlocks that work. Still, sprawl is the most basic technical move and is a pretty solid setup for any technique you're trying to land.
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Old 10-14-2007, 03:37 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMan
Guys get kneed in the face shooting all the time. James Irvin vs. Terry Martin is a good example of that.

The best way I can think of from a grappling standpoint is a rolling sweep with double underhooks. When your opponents shoots you drop your center of gravity lower than his, get the underhooks and roll over your back. Almost like a lower, more dynamic suplex.

There are also armdrags, the guillotine choke and a handful of flying armlocks that work. Still, sprawl is the most basic technical move and is a pretty solid setup for any technique you're trying to land.
Heck a good sprawl is one of hte most basic defenses. Not always the easiest.. but one of the most effective.

To borrow from Bruce Lee.. Fighting is dynamic. Constantly changing and never exactly the same. What works one time may not work again. All you can do is react with what feels most natural for you. Practice a few moves until they feel natural.. next time someone shoots in.. YOu will just do what feel best for that situation.
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