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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-13-2006, 12:41 AM
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About the only sub you can go for under a mount is a kneebar or ankle lock. the best thing to do is just get out and fight for a better position in my opinion going for crazy leg locks from the bottom in that position is risky.
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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-14-2006, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by JawShattera
About the only sub you can go for under a mount is a kneebar or ankle lock. the best thing to do is just get out and fight for a better position in my opinion going for crazy leg locks from the bottom in that position is risky.
This depends on your level. You are only looking for subs on a basic level, which is fine and effective, because even most pros don't bother doing really challenging, risky stuff in the ring (because it's too easy to make a mistake and get decimated)

From the position there is also a RNC, but that takes a little while.

If you can lock down one arm and get the up there is a nice arm drag that, with the right torso rotation, can be turned into either an armbar, a keylock and a kimura. However, the up is really the most challenging part.



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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-23-2006, 04:15 AM
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Originally Posted by IronMan
"Position then submission"?

I know that this may sound rude, but you can submit a guy from anywhere. From every position in BJJ there is an escape and a submission, that's just the way it is.

Really, if you are in a mount I suggest a straight choke, put your forearm on his throat and just lean your weight forward so that he starts to choke. In gi grappling I actually grab the inside of his collar, which makes it alot harder to get my hand and my weight off of him.

The other really popular ones from this seem to be the keylock, which can be kind of complicated for a beginner, or you can swing around one of your opponent's arms and into a straight armbar.
you cant submit when your in some ones guard your only option is to pass the guard, so I guess you cant submita person from any where =X

at any rate I like using a bull dog choke because most people dont see that one coming.
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-23-2006, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmyz
you cant submit when your in some ones guard your only option is to pass the guard, so I guess you cant submita person from any where =X

at any rate I like using a bull dog choke because most people dont see that one coming.
Again, not to sound rude, but you're only looking for submissions on the level of a low-grade wrestler.

Submissions from in someones full guard:
Strikes (duh)
Kneebar
Heelhook
Canopener (a la Mark Coleman) easily escaped, but it works
Straight choke

I also have a few submissions specialized to work from guard, mostly just to loosen up my opponents hold. These include:

Specialized kimura
Specialized keylock (based on Aikido's "shiho nage" pin)
Specialized forward neck crank
Specialized ear-tug/reverse neck crank

Nice try, but if you think about it, you can finish a fight from anywhere.



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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-29-2006, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mrmyz
at any rate I like using a bull dog choke because most people dont see that one coming.
whats a bulldog choke?
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post #16 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-29-2006, 10:51 PM
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Originally Posted by MMAtt
whats a bulldog choke?
I assume he's just renaming what is, in BJJ, a straight collar choke. (a bulldog choke is an entirely different submission on a much higher level, and it is done FROM THE GUARD!) The steps for a collar choke are as follows:

1) Place your hands on the back collar of your opponent's gi so that your forearms are crossing their throat. If this is done in no-gi, you can grab the back, grab the clavicle, or press directly on the ground.

2) Apply downward force for a choke.

It's a basic choke, so it's pretty simple.

Here's a bulldog choke:

1) While in your opponent's guard, allow them the lift their legs up so that they are in a triangle position, they have both legs past your arms or their legs are in your armpits. My preference is to let them slide into what they think is a triangle, while I keep my arm close to my body and eventually pop it out, so that their legs are resting on my clavicle.

2) Control their legs by pushing down and forwards. Don't push their hips over their body, because then they roll over. Let their hips stay in front of them so that they have some control over you, but not much.

3) Apply force to the throat and push their legs towards their chest so they feel as though they are being crushed. It's a very uncomfortable position.

Note: The bulldog choke is an advanced submission, but not because it's effective. It is only used at high levels because it requires a massive amount of lower body strength to be able to maintain control of the legs and keep them in a tensed position without allowing them to just kick you back and prevent you from applying the choke or putting you easily into butterfly, full or half guard. Just generally, in my opinion, a bad choke against an even mediocre submission fighter or a good athlete.



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post #17 of 21 (permalink) Old 12-18-2006, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMan
I assume he's just renaming what is, in BJJ, a straight collar choke. (a bulldog choke is an entirely different submission on a much higher level, and it is done FROM THE GUARD!) The steps for a collar choke are as follows:

1) Place your hands on the back collar of your opponent's gi so that your forearms are crossing their throat. If this is done in no-gi, you can grab the back, grab the clavicle, or press directly on the ground.

2) Apply downward force for a choke.

It's a basic choke, so it's pretty simple.

Here's a bulldog choke:

1) While in your opponent's guard, allow them the lift their legs up so that they are in a triangle position, they have both legs past your arms or their legs are in your armpits. My preference is to let them slide into what they think is a triangle, while I keep my arm close to my body and eventually pop it out, so that their legs are resting on my clavicle.

2) Control their legs by pushing down and forwards. Don't push their hips over their body, because then they roll over. Let their hips stay in front of them so that they have some control over you, but not much.

3) Apply force to the throat and push their legs towards their chest so they feel as though they are being crushed. It's a very uncomfortable position.

Note: The bulldog choke is an advanced submission, but not because it's effective. It is only used at high levels because it requires a massive amount of lower body strength to be able to maintain control of the legs and keep them in a tensed position without allowing them to just kick you back and prevent you from applying the choke or putting you easily into butterfly, full or half guard. Just generally, in my opinion, a bad choke against an even mediocre submission fighter or a good athlete.
the bull dog choke im talking about is from the mount. Your mounted on some one and you place your pinkly knuckle on there trachia (sp?) and from there you slide your right arm under the back of there head and grab your wrist and you close it like a vice. Kinda like a guilitine
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post #18 of 21 (permalink) Old 12-19-2006, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmyz
the bull dog choke im talking about is from the mount. Your mounted on some one and you place your pinkly knuckle on there trachia (sp?) and from there you slide your right arm under the back of there head and grab your wrist and you close it like a vice. Kinda like a guilitine
Usually referred to as a frontal collar choke, but I can see how it gets that name.



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post #19 of 21 (permalink) Old 12-19-2006, 09:39 PM
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I hate how different people name different moves different things. Before I really got into BJJ my freinds kept talking amout the kimura and I was like wtf are these people talking about and then when they showed me it im like OHHHHH thats a ude garami.
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post #20 of 21 (permalink) Old 12-20-2006, 10:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmyz
I hate how different people name different moves different things. Before I really got into BJJ my freinds kept talking amout the kimura and I was like wtf are these people talking about and then when they showed me it im like OHHHHH thats a ude garami.
Yeah, sub names do get mixed up all of the time. It doesn't really matter as long as we understand what your talking about.



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