Classical ju jitsu vs Submission grappling article - Page 2 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
Grappling Technique Grappling discussion area.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-10-2006, 01:12 AM
True Grappler
 
IronMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New York City, New York
Posts: 6,222
                     
My qualification to judge the lock comes not as a practitioner of Daito Ryu Jujitsu and Aikijujitsu forms (which are pretty much straight grappling), it comes as someone who has been in alot of armlocks from men who know alot more about classical jiu-jitsu than I do. What I learned from feeling those techniques makes it very clear that these ones are being done badly, at least according to most schools of traditional japanese thought (which is what they are saying it is).

I am not saying that the combat techniques are uneffective in the context of whatever Ryu they may be from (and I am sure that the master who instructed this has credentials), but this is simply not the style of the many forms of classical jujitsu I have encountered, and that includes styles that aren't mine.



Sig by Toxic

Barnett - Toquinho -Werdum - "Nurmie"
Z. Gurgel - Morango - Rocha - Tiequan
IronMan is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-10-2006, 04:10 PM
Banned
 
JawShattera's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,785
     
submission grappling is more effective in my opinion as it uses the best techniqeu's from many styles and you can use a variety of techniqeus from all different styles that you may be better at than relying purely on classic bjj.

if you know some of the best wrestling and judo takedowns you can choose the takedown from a variety of sytles that is most effective for you where as if you rely purely on bjj you dont really have that option. In sub grappling you are more able to custimize your style to whats fits you best as a grappler.
JawShattera is offline  
post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-10-2006, 05:16 PM Thread Starter
1 2 3 Blast Off!
 
TheSuplexor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,972
                     
Quote:
Originally Posted by JawShattera
yes i agree you must add boxing, judo and muay thai to complete the unstoppable art that is:

brazilian bo-judo thai
no need wrestling, not judo.

boxzilian wrest-thai
TheSuplexor is offline  
post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-10-2006, 06:51 PM
True Grappler
 
IronMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New York City, New York
Posts: 6,222
                     
While wrestling may be quicker and easier to learn, there are things that you can do with high level Judo that will decimate a good wrestler. Karo's throws that lands guys on their necks are amazing, especially when you look at how small and physical un-incredible his is. (Not to say that he's not strong, but he's not compared to alot of wrestlers)

In order to do real damage with a wrestling slam you have to be as strong compared to the rest of your weight class as Randleman, Hughes or Sherk. There's too much emphasis on brute force for it to be really good without some kind of other style backing it.

Why are you limiting yourself to the "good" takedowns and throws? There are situations I have been in where I've had to use something like a reverse gi-choke-hip throw, which is something that would definitely make the cut on that list, but because of the situation and the way my opponent reacted to the throw I would normally use I had to try it. My opinion:

Learn as much as you can, because if you know a little bit of everything, your prepared for anything.



Sig by Toxic

Barnett - Toquinho -Werdum - "Nurmie"
Z. Gurgel - Morango - Rocha - Tiequan
IronMan is offline  
post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-11-2006, 07:55 AM Thread Starter
1 2 3 Blast Off!
 
TheSuplexor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,972
                     
Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMan
While wrestling may be quicker and easier to learn, there are things that you can do with high level Judo that will decimate a good wrestler. Karo's throws that lands guys on their necks are amazing, especially when you look at how small and physical un-incredible his is. (Not to say that he's not strong, but he's not compared to alot of wrestlers)

In order to do real damage with a wrestling slam you have to be as strong compared to the rest of your weight class as Randleman, Hughes or Sherk. There's too much emphasis on brute force for it to be really good without some kind of other style backing it.

Why are you limiting yourself to the "good" takedowns and throws? There are situations I have been in where I've had to use something like a reverse gi-choke-hip throw, which is something that would definitely make the cut on that list, but because of the situation and the way my opponent reacted to the throw I would normally use I had to try it. My opinion:

Learn as much as you can, because if you know a little bit of everything, your prepared for anything.
true, judo is probably more about leverage. and attacking your opponents top half limbs, i think...and wrestling is both leg attacks and upper body and can be more easily transferred to mma because nothing to grab onto and don't have to change the attack....and you can throw anyone or pick anyone up by getting your hips lower. although power does come into play....and karo is not by any means weak...so a little of judo and wrestling is good...but wrestling if you can only have one
TheSuplexor is offline  
post #16 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-27-2006, 02:38 PM
Lightweight
 
LV 2 H8 U's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NC
Posts: 1,692
                     
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublelegtakedown
no need wrestling, not judo.

boxzilian wrest-thai
Wrestling is a great place to start. It teaches many basics needed for more complex techniques that styles like Judo and BJJ employ.
It also teaches some bad habits that have to be "unlearned" when becoming an MMA practitioner. Things like leaving your head out for a guilottine and extending arms to far for leaverage.
All in all though it's a great teacher of balance and body position. When I was young I trained at a summer wrestling camp and the coaches sometimes blindfolded us before we sparred. This was a great exercise in awareness.

Last edited by LV 2 H8 U; 12-27-2006 at 02:40 PM.
LV 2 H8 U is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome