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Old 02-17-2007, 04:08 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BJJ Boy
Also, the thing with judo is, a 13 year ol kid with judo experience canot tap out a 40 year old with no experience cuase strengh has alot to do with it, but in bjj the guy can be a body builder and you can be 10 and still tap him out 5 times in 4 minutes.
Bullshit, that is complete rubbish. You've really shown your ignorance now. You sound completely brainwashed.

Plus, you're BJJ history is really bad. Kimura choked him out and snapped his arm.

Last edited by Foon : 02-17-2007 at 04:10 PM.
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Old 02-17-2007, 04:45 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BJJBoy
Um, Helio won against Kimura, Look at this video YouTube - Judo VS Jiu-Jitsu you can see that the newpaper says victory for Helio Gracie.


Also if you look at this Helio Gracie: Judo vs Jujitsu article, you can see that kimura out wieght Helio and was much much taller.




Also, the thing with judo is, a 13 year ol kid with judo experience canot tap out a 40 year old with no experience cuase strengh has alot to do with it, but in bjj the guy can be a body builder and you can be 10 and still tap him out 5 times in 4 minutes.
Do you even study martial arts? You sound like a Rickson Gracie fan on f*cking crack. Sit back for a second and read this:

Helio Gracie is listed by old records in Kokodan (the governing body of Judo) as a 3rd degree blackbelt in Judo.

If you are trying to imply that strength has absolutely nothing to do with winning in a BJJ competition (or is so much overshadowed by skill) than why do almost all BJJ schools do conditioning? If strength is not a factor than why would a fighter waste his time with pushups, situps and pullups when he could be training technique?

This is the end of a commentary on the match between Masahiko Kimura and Helio Gracie:


Quote:
Originally Posted by wikipedia.org
Finally, thirteen minutes into the bout, Kimura positioned himself to apply a reverse ude-garami (arm entanglement, a shoulderlock). Gracie refused to submit, even after his arm broke, forcing Kimura to continue the lock on Gracie's broken arm. At this point, Carlos Gracie, Helio's older brother, threw in the towel to end the match to protect his brother's health. In 1994, Helio admitted in an interview that he had in fact been choked unconscious earlier in the match, but had revived and continued fighting.
But that's not all:

Quote:
As a tribute to Kimura's victory, the reverse ude-garami technique has since been commonly referred to as the Kimura lock, or simply the Kimura, in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and, more recently, mixed martial arts circles.
If you knew anything about the history of martial arts you would avoid going to "Helio Gracie v Masahiko Kimura" as a way of saying that Gracie JJ is better than Judo. Every judoka who has ever competed in combat grappling or vale tudo knows that story and they know that Kimura spent the entire match basically kicking the crap out of Gracie.

Look, do your homework, or don't show up to class. Enough said.
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Old 02-17-2007, 09:33 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMan
Do you even study martial arts? You sound like a Rickson Gracie fan on f*cking crack. Sit back for a second and read this:

Helio Gracie is listed by old records in Kokodan (the governing body of Judo) as a 3rd degree blackbelt in Judo.

If you are trying to imply that strength has absolutely nothing to do with winning in a BJJ competition (or is so much overshadowed by skill) than why do almost all BJJ schools do conditioning? If strength is not a factor than why would a fighter waste his time with pushups, situps and pullups when he could be training technique?

This is the end of a commentary on the match between Masahiko Kimura and Helio Gracie:




But that's not all:



If you knew anything about the history of martial arts you would avoid going to "Helio Gracie v Masahiko Kimura" as a way of saying that Gracie JJ is better than Judo. Every judoka who has ever competed in combat grappling or vale tudo knows that story and they know that Kimura spent the entire match basically kicking the crap out of Gracie.

Look, do your homework, or don't show up to class. Enough said.
Man, dont worry, i know alot about Helio and how he even started BJJ. And whats with this forum and people harrasing me.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:25 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Old 02-17-2007, 11:55 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Man, dont worry, i know alot about Helio and how he even started BJJ. And whats with this forum and people harrasing me.
Alright, I'll answer that question. And don't take any offense by it, it's the truth.
This here is a MMA forum (hence the URL "www.mmaforum.com"). By what you post, you don't get the point of MMA. It's obvious you think that BJJ is the be-all/end-all of grappling - the rest of the forum (and the world) don't agree. You claim that BJJ is superior to other arts, when it really isn't. Just because it sometimes is prefered by ring fighters, doesn't mean it is the greatest art of all time and a baby who learns it could submit half the world. There are other grappling arts that are on its level, some of them go even beyond what BJJ teaches.

What I'm trying to say is, be open-minded. A Judoka can win a fight against a Jitsuka, and vice-versa. It does depend on the person, not the art, especially if the two arts are almost alike and related. (I'll agree that BJJ has an advantage over stand-up arts, but it doesn't mean the BJJ practitioner's victory is ensured over someone who practices Aikido).
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Old 02-18-2007, 01:17 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainee
Alright, I'll answer that question. And don't take any offense by it, it's the truth.
This here is a MMA forum (hence the URL "www.mmaforum.com"). By what you post, you don't get the point of MMA. It's obvious you think that BJJ is the be-all/end-all of grappling - the rest of the forum (and the world) don't agree. You claim that BJJ is superior to other arts, when it really isn't. Just because it sometimes is prefered by ring fighters, doesn't mean it is the greatest art of all time and a baby who learns it could submit half the world. There are other grappling arts that are on its level, some of them go even beyond what BJJ teaches.

What I'm trying to say is, be open-minded. A Judoka can win a fight against a Jitsuka, and vice-versa. It does depend on the person, not the art, especially if the two arts are almost alike and related. (I'll agree that BJJ has an advantage over stand-up arts, but it doesn't mean the BJJ practitioner's victory is ensured over someone who practices Aikido).
the gracies have the mind set of bjj is the best.... the gracies are not doing to well since people have learned to fight on the ground...
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Old 02-18-2007, 03:28 AM   #27 (permalink)
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I know that this has laready been touched, but if you look at this picture:

You will notice in subscript written above the main newpaper article heading is the portugese word "moralmente" meaning that they were declaring that Helio had won a "Moral Victory" over Masahiko Kimura. Helio lost to Kimura but gained a moral victory by not tapping out, that's the truth. In fact, they named the reverse/under-arm ude-garami the "Kimura" to honor him. It isn't called that by co-incidence.

Now, I'm glad that as a young person you've found something to become attached to and that's obviously your focus. But I am going to let you know this right now:

It is not the only martial art in existance. It is not the end-all/be-all of martial arts.

Your youth and singularity of purpose is admirable, but it's also made you ignorant of other things that may be contrary to what you may want to consider. Again, just because you are young doesn't mean I'm not going to call you out on something that is plainly wrong. On that same note, if you are correct on something, I'll give you your props.

But please stay away from comments like this:
Quote:
Also, the thing with judo is, a 13 year ol kid with judo experience canot tap out a 40 year old with no experience cuase strengh has alot to do with it, but in bjj the guy can be a body builder and you can be 10 and still tap him out 5 times in 4 minutes.
Look: If I gave the kids in "3 Ninjas" Jiu-Jitsu gis instead of Ninja Uniforms, do you think I'd be convinced any more at how "close to reality" that movie would be? Hell no. Just consider this: No Martial Art is going to turn any one into a superman, and I don't care what part of the globe it comes from.

Case in point: Do you know how many surviving "Iron Skin/Iron Shirt" Kung Fu practitioners exist now a days? The answer: None. They all died from gunshot wounds.

Even if you don't completely agree with the others on the forum, at least take a second to consider that some of the others may have a valid point. Okay?
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Old 02-18-2007, 08:20 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onganju
I know that this has laready been touched, but if you look at this picture:

You will notice in subscript written above the main newpaper article heading is the portugese word "moralmente" meaning that they were declaring that Helio had won a "Moral Victory" over Masahiko Kimura. Helio lost to Kimura but gained a moral victory by not tapping out, that's the truth. In fact, they named the reverse/under-arm ude-garami the "Kimura" to honor him. It isn't called that by co-incidence.

Now, I'm glad that as a young person you've found something to become attached to and that's obviously your focus. But I am going to let you know this right now:

It is not the only martial art in existance. It is not the end-all/be-all of martial arts.

Your youth and singularity of purpose is admirable, but it's also made you ignorant of other things that may be contrary to what you may want to consider. Again, just because you are young doesn't mean I'm not going to call you out on something that is plainly wrong. On that same note, if you are correct on something, I'll give you your props.

But please stay away from comments like this:

Look: If I gave the kids in "3 Ninjas" Jiu-Jitsu gis instead of Ninja Uniforms, do you think I'd be convinced any more at how "close to reality" that movie would be? Hell no. Just consider this: No Martial Art is going to turn any one into a superman, and I don't care what part of the globe it comes from.

Case in point: Do you know how many surviving "Iron Skin/Iron Shirt" Kung Fu practitioners exist now a days? The answer: None. They all died from gunshot wounds.

Even if you don't completely agree with the others on the forum, at least take a second to consider that some of the others may have a valid point. Okay?

Fine, i still think BJJ is the ultimate Martial art.
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Old 02-18-2007, 08:29 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Then that's how you faulter. We're getting pretty sick of your BJJ nuthugging. I've been doing Judo since a VERY young age, you don't see me talking like it's the best eva!!!!!1111!!1111

Quote:
Originally Posted by BJJ Boy
And whats with this forum and people harrasing me.
Nobody is, you do it to yourself. You give as much as you take.
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Old 02-19-2007, 12:35 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BJJ Boy
Fine, i still think BJJ is the ultimate Martial art.
then your an idiot. All martial arts have their streghnths and their weaknesses if bjj was so great then all of the better bjj practitioners wouldnt cross train in judo.

Im a true martial artist I practice various martial arts regularly. Boxing, Kick Boxing, Karate, Judo, JJ its all good you have to broaden your horizons. Its pretty dumb to go into a gun fight with only one bullet in the chamber
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