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post #11 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 12:18 PM
 
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I find it so hard to partake in this discussion without stepping on people's toes as gun ownership and gun laws are very personal to people who have grown up with the right to bear arms.

I'm 25 years old and I've never know anyone who owned a gun for any other purpose than hunting or competitive shooting. And those guns had to be stored in safes in clubhouses and could not be brought home, ever.

My childhood girlfriend was stabbed to death at a halloween party at her highschool by a jealous ex (I was not dating her at the time and hadn't been for years) and at the time it broke my heart, still does. She was the only fatality but two guys were also stabbed, one in the throat and another in the chest, both survived. They were trying to pull him off of her (She was stabbed a total of 35 times in front of 60-70 people, some thought it was a gag with it being halloween and all).

My point is, even with this having happened in my life, I would still never, NEVER condone private citizens carrying guns. I know I'm from a totally different kind of society than most of you guys, I'm just trying to describe how alien the idea of having a gun on your person or in your home sounds to some people around the world.

And that's why this debate is so weird to me, because when I put my opinion out there I'm always shot down because I just don't realize how society works where you guys are at, and what is socially acceptable. It's facsinating and a little scary to me.

BTW I'm not trying to pass judgement here, just giving a different view on the idea of gun ownership




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post #12 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 01:44 PM
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I am with Budhi here I think a society where anyone can own a gun is crazy and terrifying. I find it ridiculous that people can honestly defend "I need a gun to defend me from guys with guns" argument and I find it incredible that the solution to say the tragic shooting in Connecticut is to "have guns in classrooms/arm teachers etc" opposed to actual gun control.

That said I live in a country where a few farmers own guns for hunting and that's about it (shops can't even sell knives other than silver cutlery ones here) and as much as I despise the gun culture in America I realise that it is just that, your culture and it is so engrained in society I think it is just the way it is over there and it won't ever change.

Do I think people should carry/own guns? Whole heartedly no. But America is past the point you could do anything about it even if you wanted to. I have no idea what the solution to shootings/gun related massacres is other than a better outreach programme for those with mental illness as I really doubt anything can be done about the guns themselves.


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post #13 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 05:33 PM
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In my opinion (being a gun owner), you should have to get a license to own/purchase a firearm, which involves a gun class(s), just like getting a drivers license. What it really boils down to though, is the parents. You sort of have an idea if your kid is troubled at a certain point, and it's your responsibility to then get a gun safe to keep them out. The cost of a safe is a big factor why most don't though.

I can go on a gun forum, hit the classifieds, and schedule to meet that person and buy the gun with cash, legally. This is one loophole that puts guns in the wrong peoples hands, and should be looked at.

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post #14 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 05:39 PM
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In my opinion (being a gun owner), you should have to get a license to own/purchase a firearm, which involves a gun class(s), just like getting a drivers license. What it really boils down to though, is the parents. You sort of have an idea if your kid is troubled at a certain point, and it's your responsibility to then get a gun safe to keep them out. The cost of a safe is a big factor why most don't though.

I can go on a gun forum, hit the classifieds, and schedule to meet that person and buy the gun with cash, legally. This is one loophole that puts guns in the wrong peoples hands, and should be looked at.
They would have to make it a legit class. My buddy recently took the class for a concealed license. He said it was a joke and the easiest class he had ever taken in his life. Then he sent in the paperwork and that was that.


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post #15 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 09:25 PM Thread Starter
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They would have to make it a legit class. My buddy recently took the class for a concealed license. He said it was a joke and the easiest class he had ever taken in his life. Then he sent in the paperwork and that was that.
I also took that class recently and it is a joke. Hopefully most of the people I was in class with will be too unconfident to pull their firearms, bystanders will be shot.

The main point that I wanted to make that most people seem to not understand is the amount of guns that will still be available even if the 1994 assault weapons ban is put back in to place. That's basically the least that will happen if anything imo.

If the AWB is reinstated there are still somewhere between 270,000,000 and 350,000,000 guns in america depending on which website you believe that will be perfectly legal. There have been over 16,000,000 background checks performed this year. Of those 16,000,000, many of them are for multiple firearm purchases.

This wiki link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal...lt_Weapons_Ban states that the ban didn't really do much if anything. Of course it is wiki so take with a grain of salt.

Basically the 1994 awb banned high capacity magazines and features of firearms that were more cosmetic than anything. No folding or collapsible stocks sold. They were still sold by the way they just needed some tinkering to make them function. Pins in the way, had to be bought in separate kits, etc...

This gun would be illegal

This one would not.

Illegal

Legal


Basically nothing besides confiscation will change anything about the gun culture in America other than the prices of weapons included in the ban. Prices will rise for pre ban weaponry but essentially nothing will change. If confiscation is their answer my bet will be that a civil war will break out.

The american citizens could arm the 2nd and 3rd largest armies in the world. I can't find a link for that statistic but I know I've read it somewhere. The citizens of the US are armed to the teeth.

I don't think it would be covered in the media much but there are alot of people that will return fire if someone comes to disarm them. If and when they do I'm sure they will be called murderers, rebels, etc...but they will be doing something that the 2nd amendment lawfully allows them to do.

I hope it doesn't come to that but the way the government and media attempt to group people by race, values, and political stance in an attempt to pit people against each other I wouldn't be surprised if it does.

Last edited by Budhisten; 12-22-2012 at 09:33 PM. Reason: Put large images in spoiler tags :)
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post #16 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 09:30 PM
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again mexico has banned guns for years and it has done beyond nothing because now its only criminals that have the weapons instead of people looking to defend themselves


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post #17 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 09:39 PM
 
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Problem is that there's a difference between trying to fix a weapon-dependent system and creating a new one without any weapons. That's why it's impossible to remove all weapons in the US in one swoop, it can and will never be done.

On the other hand introducing weapons into a society that has never had access to them would never work either. Everyone I know feel safer without a weapon in their home than they would having one.

And yes, I realize that a kitchen knife is a dangerous weapon, but so is a toothbrush according to many prisons




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post #18 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 09:44 PM Thread Starter
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again mexico has banned guns for years and it has done beyond nothing because now its only criminals that have the weapons instead of people looking to defend themselves
Although that should be the most effective argument I try to steer clear of that because naturally it leads to "well they should confinscate all of them" type of responses. Which if they knew anything would be completely retarded.

One thing that really chaps my ass is that the people that argue for gun control the most, know the least about firearms. The dumb skank that came out a couple days after this recent shooting who was more or less responsible for the 1994 ban claimed that the guns they are trying to ban again today are "much more powerful and lethal." This couldn't be further from the truth. The .223 semi auto is the same .223 semi auto they banned 20 years ago.
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post #19 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 09:47 PM
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post #20 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-22-2012, 09:49 PM Thread Starter
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Problem is that there's a difference between trying to fix a weapon-dependent system and creating a new one without any weapons. That's why it's impossible to remove all weapons in the US in one swoop, it can and will never be done.

On the other hand introducing weapons into a society that has never had access to them would never work either. Everyone I know feel safer without a weapon in their home than they would having one.

And yes, I realize that a kitchen knife is a dangerous weapon, but so is a toothbrush according to many prisons
You've never grabbed for a weapon when you thought you were about to be attacked? I find that hard to believe unless you've never felt in danger. I had a group of guys chasing me after I knocked some teeth out of one of their friends until they noticed that I had a tire iron and lost all interest. You've never, ever, ever, used a weapon for self defense Bud?
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