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americanfighter 12-17-2011 11:44 PM

What is happening to patriotism in my country
 
I just had my graduation Thursday and am now headed to my MBA. At my graduation I notice something that was disturbing to me. Before the event the flag was presented and the national anthem was sang. In respect everyone is suppose to remove their hats and place their right hand over their hart. I imediately took off my graduation cap and held it over my hart. I noticed something though. It seemed that only less than a 4th of my graduating class had done so and tons of people in the stand that didn't put their had over their hart. What I remember and how I was raised was that whenever at an event and the national anthem is being sang before you take you d@m# hat off and put your hand over your hand over your hart and if you didn't that was a big deal. Do people really don't care anymore? It makes me sad to see my nation of proud people that support eachother and stand united move in this direction.

G_Land 12-18-2011 12:23 AM

It has a lot to how/where they are raised. As in schools. Some schools have to tip toe around the National Anthem in fear of getting sued..sad but true. Come on down to Al/Ms and you will see 5 year olds take their hats off and stand there during the Anthem. Even the bad ass kids running around with mud all over them. I can remember as a kid getting my arm pinched if I was talking or moving around during it....But then again the South is pretty damn Patriotic lol

Rusty 12-18-2011 12:57 AM

People are too self centered to care about anything but themselves nowadays. It's going to get worse in the coming generations as well. Every child today is told he/she is a special, unique, snowflake who gets a trophy for just participating and thinks the world revolves around them.

I can't listen to the Anthem without getting at least goosebumps if not teary eyed unless the singer is completely butchering it. It's a dead end road our country is going down:(

americanfighter 12-18-2011 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RustyRenegade (Post 1520333)

I can't listen to the Anthem without getting at least goosebumps if not teary eyed unless the singer is completely butchering it. It's a dead end road our country is going down:(

I do too

jaw2929 12-18-2011 02:27 AM

I hate that "hand over heart/remove hat" horse-shit. I'm GLAD to hear not everyone "obeys" what is "supposed to be done" - It's a melting pot, it's what this country prides itself on. Shit like that and the recital of the "pledge of allegiance" is all horse-shit. I feel it's progress, anytime a country can move AWAY from complete blind patriotism and move toward evolving and people thinking for themselves, is a good thing IMO.

M.C 12-18-2011 02:27 AM

Respect is earned, not given, no matter what it is.

A parent doesn't get respect unless he/she does a good job as a parent. Having sex and nature throwing you a baby doesn't = you get respect for being a dad or a mom, you must be a good parent and earn your right to have the respect that an actual good, real parent gets.

A country and the government is the same way. It must earn respect, respect is not thrown around to anything and everything "just because", it must be earned.

There are A LOT of people (just look on this board alone and you can find some) in this country that are not happy in many, many, many things that it is doing. They are not happy with the laws, with the way it is being run, with the people running it. Blind respect and patriotism is ridiculous, in my opinion, such things must have a reason and must be earned, a reason to be proud, other than just lucking out and by chance being born on a certain section of rock.

Not just that, but people are into so many things these days. From new tech (like phones, ipods, ipads, games, etc) to social outlets (which go hand in hand with tech) and these social connection things are actually making people think a lot more, opening them up to many different life styles and ways of thinking, therefore becoming much more independent and not accepting whatever praise/respect a government (or parent, for example) throws at them. They make up their own mind as to what to believe in/respect/give praise to. Again, respect is earned, not given away for free.

I don't care for the national anthem or any such thing, for a mix of all the above, and simply because I find blind respect/pride in anything to be utterly ridiculous, whether it be patriotic pride, the pride of a parent, taking credit for something you didn't earn, etc. I feel - everything - should be earned when it comes to respect/pride, and for me personally, I don't feel anymore proud to be an American than I would being a Canadian, or an Australian, etc, and I don't show those two countries respect and all that, the same way I don't America.

I pay my taxes which is the agreement from me to the state/country, to let me keep living here. I pay my due to them, I give them part of my hard earned money to keep their country going, and that is the level of my commitment to them, nothing more nothing less.

Anywho, that's my view on it.

jaw2929 12-18-2011 02:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M.C (Post 1520386)
Respect is earned, not given, no matter what it is.

A parent doesn't get respect unless he/she does a good job as a parent. Having sex and nature throwing you a baby doesn't = you get respect for being a dad or a mom, you must be a good parent and earn your right to have the respect that an actual good, real parent gets.

A country and the government is the same way. It must earn respect, respect is not thrown around to anything and everything "just because", it must be earned.

There are A LOT of people (just look on this board alone and you can find some) in this country that are not happy in many, many, many things that it is doing. They are not happy with the laws, with the way it is being run, with the people running it. Blind respect and patriotism is ridiculous, in my opinion, such things must have a reason and must be earned, a reason to be proud, other than just lucking out and by chance being born on a certain section of rock.

Not just that, but people are into so many things these days. From new tech (like phones, ipods, ipads, games, etc) to social outlets (which go hand in hand with tech) and these social connection things are actually making people think a lot more, opening them up to many different life styles and ways of thinking, therefore becoming much more independent and not accepting whatever praise/respect a government (or parent, for example) throws at them. They make up their own mind as to what to believe in/respect/give praise to.

I don't care for the national anthem or any such thing, for a mix of all the above, and simply because I find blind respect/pride in anything to be utterly ridiculous, whether it be patriotic pride, the pride of a parent, taking credit for something you didn't earn, etc. I feel - everything - should be earned when it comes to respect/pride, and for me personally, I don't feel anymore proud to be an American than I would being a Canadian, or an Australian, etc, and I don't show those two countries respect and all that, the same way I don't America.

I pay my taxes which is the agreement from me to the state/country, to let me keep living here. I pay my due to them, I give them part of my hard earned money to keep their country going, and that is the level of my commitment to them, nothing more nothing less.

Anywho, that's my view on it.


Could NOT have said it better myself. Glad to know I'm not alone on this. I hate that notion that "we are the greatest country on earth" horse-shit. Really? Why? Because people keep spouting the same thing over & over, so if it's repeated enough times... Well hell, it MUST be true then, right?

Wrong. The only way ANYONE can claim ANY country they live in is "the greatest country on earth" - is if they've had the opportunity to live in each country on earth, thereby making their claim to whichever country they chose to be the "greatest" hold some actual ****in weight and be a LEGITIMATE claim - it's all ****in opinion anyway. Otherwise to hell with that bullshit. Buncha ****in nonsense.

americanfighter 12-18-2011 03:14 AM

This isn't blind respect or patriotism. I am dissatisfied with the path the us has take over the past decade however the US is still my home the US has givin me freedom and I am what I am today because i live in the US. Again I am disatisfied with many events in the past decade however give back respect and will support it because of this and pay respect to the people that died for this nation. We need to work to try and get our leaders to get us back on the right track not abandon or disrespect it. Just because your father or friend goes off path and does something wrong you dont abandon and disown them you support and help them to get back on the right track.

M.C 12-18-2011 03:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by americanfighter (Post 1520397)
This isn't blind respect or patriotism. I am dissatisfied with the path the us has take over the past decade however the US is still my home the US has givin me freedom and I am what I am today because i live in the US. Again I am disatisfied with many events in the past decade however give back respect and will support it because of this and work to try and get our leaders to get us back on the right track. Just because your father or friend goes off path and does something wrong you dont abandon and disown them you support and help them to get back on the right track.

Respect is not only earned, but it's not forever. You can respect someone/something one day, and that someone/something goes and does something ridiculous, and now your respect for that someone/something has been diminished. Respect doesn't last forever.

An MMA example of this would be, some people may have respected Brett Rogers for going from nothing to a big Strikeforce fighter, maybe they respect him for making "something" of himself. Then, he goes and beats his wife, that respect is now lost.

America hasn't done anything since I have been born to earn my respect, why should I respect it? It's not giving me freedom, in fact, it's passing laws that take away my freedom, it's ending my freedom, it's stripping me of my rights and freedom, law by law, day by day. Am I able to walk around outside or stay inside and play a video game without issue? Can I use the bathroom and go to the store and buy food, or maybe sit at a bar and get some drink on? Sure, but if that's freedom, every major country in the world does this. Do we have freedom of speech? No, we don't, not anymore than most major countries. In fact, we have words that are illegal, and you can be fired for saying the wrong thing. You can lose your job for word. Freedom of speech has long since been gone, and is not a selling point for this country anymore, when you consider most major countries having roughly the same "freedom of speech".

Also keep in mind my other point, which was the ability to socialize around the world in seconds these days. People know so many different type of people and can experience/learn about so many types of cultures/countries/civilizations/thought processes/religions/lack of religion/and many more things, and because of this, people aren't needing to band together and confine in each other to be proud of something, or unite and become one group. They have access to so many view points and so many different things that they find meaning/respect in things that people 50 years ago had absolutely no idea about.

The world is growing up both technology wise and social wise, and the mindset of "I'm on this team!" is starting to fade, people are instead looking at the world as a whole with countless possibilities, and many are giving their respect/interests to those instead.

That's not to say you are wrong on your thinking or anything, I mean if you respect America and all this, I'm not calling your respect blind, you may have perfectly good reasons to respect America because of how you feel/think, my point about blind respect was just a single reason as to why I don't respect America personally and might be a reason why some others might not.

jaw2929 12-18-2011 07:28 PM

It certainly is a reason I DO NOT respect the country I live in, MC. americanfighter, the fact you were born in this country is just random happenstance. YOU may give "respect" to this country for whatever your reasons may be, and that's all well and good.

But to expect OTHERS who also live here, to do the same thing for the same reason's you do, is ridiculous and narrow-minded.

I'm glad to know things are progressing/technology and people's mindsets are evolving to think beyond the borders of the country they just so happened to be born in. There are several other countries I'd much rather live in, than this one. That's not to say I that I think america has nothing going for it, that's not true. It's just I don't feel this country is any better than any other major country in all honesty.


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