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champbronc2 11-28-2010 03:30 PM

Boxing: The Most Underrated Discipline in Mixed Martial Arts
 
Would you all agree with what I wrote in my article?

I am an amateur boxer and feel very strongly on the issue.

Quote:

Whatever happened to wanting to see a guy get bashed in the face and knocked on his butt? It seems today maybe we have gone soft. More often, it may be the case that you hear someone say, "he needs a takedown to
win this round, and the fight. " Wrestling is a dominant skill, no doubt, but it seems that so many today are ignoring the art that has potential to end the fight the fastest: good old fashioned classical boxing.

Recently my boxing coach was forced to resign from my MMA gym. The politics behind it aren't important, but this action has inspired me to write on the underutilization of this fight discipline. As a boxer, it is very frustrating to see this happen. No, this is not an article concerning MMA vs. Boxing. This isn't about Randy Couture vs. James Toney. This is about the use, or lack thereof, of boxing skills within the sport of MMA.

Recently I attended a Muay Thai Kickboxing tournament. As an amateur boxer, with experience training in Muay Thai and Jiu-jitsu, I saw clear opportunities to score or finish the fight being missed. They were the type of opportunities that a classically trained boxer would have recognized and exploited. Want to be dominant in the ring? Learn classic boxing.

While watching these fights, I saw the participants backing up, leading to them getting caught on the ropes or in the corner. In boxing this is a cardinal sin. Your body goes backward, your punches go forward. The net force is much less when moving backward compared to the fighter stalking forward and punching forward. Great fighters do not retreat, but they circle and counter. The best opportunity you have to score points in any combat sport is while your opponent is trying to score against you. Very few fighters, outside of Chuck Liddell, have ever had much success scoring points while moving backwards in retreat.

Read more at:
MMANews247.com - Boxing: The most underrated discipline in Mixed Martial Arts

(Edited to provide a teaser for the rest of the article.)

HexRei 11-28-2010 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by champbronc2 (Post 1309821)
MMANews247.com - Boxing: The most underrated discipline in Mixed Martial Arts
Would you all agree with what I wrote in my article?

I am an amateur boxer and feel very strongly on the issue.

Are you sure Rashad Evans was a pro boxer? boxrec has no record for him and I don't see how he would even have time, given that he was a star collegiate wrestler right up to the time he started doing MMA in 2004 and it was only a year between his MMA debut and his appearance on TUF 2.


A couple of examples of accomplished (although not world class) pro boxers that are also successful MMA fighters would be Marcus Davis or Chris Lytle.

Sduff05 11-28-2010 07:19 PM

You make some good points, I have only recently started Muai Thai and haven't alot of experience in martial arts but I think you could be right here, MMA fighters could learn alot from training substantially in boxing they would notice opening that fighter who use kick knees and elbows might just miss cause there watching more of the body in saying that though I believe alot of top MMA fighters do train in boxing and with some of the best boxing coaches in the world.

I feel people are avoiding this post cause they feel its a MMA vs Boxing post which is what i thought it was and only opened it to see all the people ripping into it :) was glad i did though

oh . . just realized there more to the article :/

champbronc2 11-28-2010 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HexRei (Post 1309841)
Are you sure Rashad Evans was a pro boxer? boxrec has no record for him and I don't see how he would even have time, given that he was a star collegiate wrestler right up to the time he started doing MMA in 2004 and it was only a year between his MMA debut and his appearance on TUF 2.


A couple of examples of accomplished (although not world class) pro boxers that are also successful MMA fighters would be Marcus Davis or Chris Lytle.

I must have been mistaken. I was under the impression he was for some reason.

And Sduff05, yeah, this is in no way MMA vs Boxing. More of MMA with Boxing.

And classic boxing can help a lot in muay thai.

lazyfighter 03-06-2011 03:27 AM

I love boxing and I agree that its not used as much as it should be. But it shouldn't be about wanting to see a guy get punched in the face and knocked out.
Thats unforunately the attitude that imo makes the sport look bad.
I use what ever is going to work at that time. If I feel I need to take them down then thats what I will do. If I feel I can stand up with them then I'm more likely to box (my kicks are not exactly the best as Im tall for my class so my legs flail around ready for a single leg)

joey.jupiter 03-06-2011 09:32 AM

All I'll add in is that once you're wrestling in a match it can be hard to get away and then box. But you can in theory stop a boxer boxing by taking him down and wrestling. It's almost like a warm up I take it, even though how predominant it can be in a match.

tkoshea 03-07-2011 07:38 AM

I don't think boxing is under used or rated in mma at all.

Many (if not most) mma fighters have boxing coaches and had the striker skills and footwork of boxing to their game.

GSP the most notable recent addition, working with Freddy Roach (not to mention BElfort, Silva and Rampage all working hard on boxing)

The thing is only elements of the boxing discipline can be effectively used in an mma fight so I assume when people train their boxng skills they do so in a fashion that suits the type of fighting they will be undertaking, so it may not be overtly obvious when you watch a fight that someone is applying their boxing skills.

But this does not mean they are not and have not improved their punching techniques via boxing training because they have to also focus on factors such as low kicks and take downs all of which are alien to a pure boxer.

Sambo de Amigo 03-17-2011 09:27 PM

I disagree , i think boxing is equal with all other disciplines , wrestling is however rewarded to highly.

VolcomX311 03-29-2011 06:44 PM

I liked the article, but I don't know if boxing is necessarily underated, perhaps by fans, but I don't think by the fighters themselves. Cain, GSP, Edgar are three current champs that use or used classical boxing, GSP more so as of recent, but Cain and Edgar certainly merge their wrestling/classic boxing as their primary arsenal and BJ Penn supposedly banked his reign on his marvelous jab and counter punching. I believe Mir got into boxing quite extensively as well, as far as fighters that go beyond the general term of striking, but train in classical boxing.

Granted, leg kicks and TD's are an obvious threat to a boxing high guard, but wrestlers or people who tend to throw kicks also have a very low arm guard which makes them vulnerable to proper boxing. It's all give and take. Good article though :thumbsup:

RedRocket44 09-18-2011 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sambo de Amigo (Post 1382016)
I disagree , i think boxing is equal with all other disciplines , wrestling is however rewarded to highly.

This is because in 95% of instances, the wrestler has scored a takedown, and then scores additional points by controlling his opponent or thru GnP. Very few judges give fighters any points from their back unless they are threatening with multiple submission attempts and/or throwing some damaging 'bows from the bottom. Fighters need to be extremely active from the bottom to score points.

I don't think boxing is underrated -- it's just that boxing is still developing in MMA and we haven't seen very many world class boxers that can't be picked apart in some other area of the game. Once we see a world class boxer who can hold his own in all other areas of the game, we will then see how effective boxing is with 4oz gloves.

The stance alone plays a big role, and a pure boxer with a traditional stance is going to get taken down, or his lead hacked to death with kicks. Switch to a more square stance and the traditional boxer loses power in his hands -- it's simply a tough set of circumstances to overcome.

* and some have already mentioned, many fighters have boxing coaches. GSP showed us how effective the jab can be -- Kos eye was a train-wreck, and the weren't overly powerful jabs. Just well timed and well placed. I don't think we've seen the jab used that effectively before, and plenty of other fighters have heavy hands that can end the fight with one punch. If somebody like Bisping had half the wrestling skill as GSP, Kos or Lesnar, we would be in for a real treat.


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