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MLS · 05-16-2008, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ex-bouncer

1st of all I said that tyson hip movement is a result of him moving with the punch and because he purposely torquing them. 2nd I never telegraph with your hands. lastly there is a truism in boxing and that is if you have to rely on power to win a match you've already lost the fight. Tyson's power comes from his forearms and triceps just look at them. as for Mayweather speed kills because it is power.

It's clear you have no idea what your talking about. You go tell any boxing training what you are saying and they will laugh because Tyson was KNOWN for his hip torque. How does Mayweather generate his power for his check hook by the way?

**IronMan** · 05-17-2008, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ex-bouncer

"To say that, for some reason, they don't strike with their hips is absurd. They also strike from their legs.

Watch this Tyson highlight, and tell me again that he's not moving his hips." Mike tyson is merely moving with the punches look at him punching the bag with the bulk of his fast punches coming via the triceps, try punching a bag while torking your hips a see for yourself how much speed you get.

Man, do you not understand that I actually do this stuff. Clearly you think I'm new to this, and that's a little disrespectful. Whatever.

If you really think that you generate power with your arms, going into a fight with a top tier boxer (even a good amateur) and do that. He'll laugh at you if you start throwing arm punches.

I've worked with guys like Ward and Cung Le. These are guys who say, over and over again, use your hips. Tyson says it in his training, and his coaches drilled it into him. Actually watch him fight.

If you want me to dissect the anatomy of the punch, that's fine. Really, though, you should just watch the National Georgraphic documentary on fight sciences (not the MMA one that they did, though that was good; the earlier one with Melchor Menor). They spend 3 minutes talking about how a boxer's power comes from his feet and his hips.

This isn't some basic technical disagreement, man. This is scientific, and it's not disputed. Nobody throws arm-punches, and the guys who think they can get KTFO.

ex-bouncer · 05-18-2008, 10:40 AM

No torquing the hips is a finishing move but how do you get there without getting your hips coiled thats called telegraphing. no good pro is going to be around long enough for you to do that. remember more fights are won on the feet than won on the gloves and lastly I don't worry about power I worry about getting hit. there is no wrong only learning.

**IronMan** · 05-18-2008, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ex-bouncer

No torquing the hips is a finishing move but how do you get there without getting your hips coiled thats called telegraphing. no good pro is going to be around long enough for you to do that. remember more fights are won on the feet than won on the gloves and lastly I don't worry about power I worry about getting hit. there is no wrong only learning.

There is wrong. Wrong is what gets you KTFO'd.

Look, watch how Fedor throws (always from the hips), watch how CroCop throws (same) and watch how Nogueira throws (again, the same). These are three guys who come from three totally different striking backgrounds, and the biggest consistency is the fact that they throw their punches off of their hips

You don't even understand how a punch coming off of the hips works. It's not about coiling them, it's about swinging them out from a neutral position. You're right that a pro-fighter would never coil his hips to throw some big looping punch (actually, you're technically wrong about that, too, because Chuck Liddell did it for years), but that's not what fighters do.

It's about moving into your strike with the hips, not twisting the strike up and then releasing it. Mayweather's "check hook" isn't wound up (it doesn't have the time to be), but it comes, pointedly and clearly, off of the hips.

ex-bouncer · 05-18-2008, 12:00 PM

1st rule of boxing never stand in front of the puncher, and don't play hooky with the hooker! it's better to paw than to crush. I don't care about power I care about getting hit because I aint gonna be around for the t off.

**IronMan** · 05-18-2008, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ex-bouncer

1st rule of boxing never stand in front of the puncher, and don't play hooky with the hooker! it's better to paw than to crush. I don't care about power I care about getting hit because I aint gonna be around for the t off.

It's that attitude that gets guys killed in MMA fights. You're so concerned about getting hit that you don't throw a serious punch, and your opponent gets more and more confident as you fail to sting him. You paw and he works you with jabs and leg kicks (both of which he puts his hips into), until he wears you down. Then you're too slow to get out of the way, and you get KTFO'd.

You have to hit back in a fight, man. You have to assert your dominance as a striker if you want to strike. You can't just paw and back away and expect to just dodge your way through a fight. It doesn't work like that. Your opponent is going to keep attacking.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't be worried about getting hit. I'm not even saying that it shouldn't be your first concern. If you have a glass jaw, then you should worry about getting hit.

You shouldn't sacrific your power by taking your hips out of punches. That only makes your opponent more willing to throw, more willing to hit you and gives him more control over the pace of the fight.

Guys like Chuck Liddell use their hips, they don't do that pawing bullsh*t, and they knock guys out by being great counter punchers. You can move and still use your hips into a strike. If you don't know how to do that, then you've got bigger issues.

recon6991 · 05-18-2008, 01:14 PM

ex-bouncer, this is a pretty cool video about power, some of its sumo wrestlers but its not to long, and it has rampage punching and explains where his punching power comes from... check it out

http://youtube.com/watch?v=jzYMX_3K_xE

taiwnezboi · 05-18-2008, 02:34 PM

Arm punches are just weak and are what people that don't know how to strike throw. Go watch Frank Trigg vs. Fabiano Iha, where Trigg is throwing arm punches and takes forever to KO the guy. Trigg even says himself on the Pride show on FSN that he was throwing crappy arm punches instead of using his hips, because at that time he didn't know how to strike.

**mmawrestler** · 05-18-2008, 02:41 PM

TKD has two different forms, they do tkd sparing and practical TKD, but knonestly TKD has THE BEST kicks of any martial art hands down, the rest of it is pretty useless

ex-bouncer · 05-18-2008, 04:14 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABZu5v2JPuE
watch Lennox Lewis get ko'd by Rahman look how just before he got hit he bent at the waist hoping to land a bomb just as he was bending Rahman throw the right and boom it was over. Your right that is the kind of attitude that gets one ko'd. larry holmes, Ali. I'm just gonna dance in the ring all night and flick my jab out there. styles make fights.

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