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The difference between Ju Jitsu and BJJ?

3K views 23 replies 11 participants last post by  KillerG 
#1 ·
Hi all

Ok it's really hard where i live to find decent training places, i've been trying to find one that does BJJ and have managed to track one down 40 miles away, but just last week a centre opened up near me that taught regular Ju Jitsu. Everyone always seems to mention Brazilian Ju Jitsu over the regular version, what are the main differences between the two?

Many thanks for the help!
 
#2 ·
The traditional (or 'regular') Ju Jitsu is more like Judo (so I hear) as it is Japanese. Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is more ground based and modified by Helio. BJJ is more aggressive too and I suggest BJJ over JJJ anyday. Look around more as there could be some BJJ schools more closer.
 
#3 ·
Jujustu (or JJJ, Japanese Jujutsu) is different from BJJ in many ways. One thing is that the majority of the JJJ techniques won't transfer into the ring because they are combat techniques. There is also striking in JJJ but not all schools teach that. JJJ also has Katas (though they are 2 people instead of just one).

Basically, if you're going to do MMA don't start in JJJ. What you should try to find if you can't get BJJ is Judo. It transfers well into MMA and it is sport compatible, so just about everything will transfer into the MMA ring. Plus, I've heard people say that Judo adds a lot to the ground game because the rules in Judo make it so getting a submission while on the ground is limited in time so the judoka are more explosive at getting submissions.
 
#4 ·
From what I've read up on these two combative arts, they're similar, but very different. JuJutsu (JJJ) is more of a no-rule self-defense system. Anything is allowed, even biting, eye-gouging, hair-pulling, and stuff like that. JJJ practitioners focus on throws and some standard stand-up techniques, as well as some ground work. It's pretty balanced out, so you don't do particulary well in a particular situation. This could be a good and bad thing. Depends on the situation.

BJJ is a lot more focused on ground work. Some schools teach basic stand-up, but some don't. I think they don't focus on throws too much (maybe not at all). A lot of their joint locks are much more dangerous (or so I've heard) than those of JuJutsu's. It's more compatable with MMA, because it's all about submissions and your position on the ground, while JJJ is all about real combat.

That's the basic differences, to my understanding. I could be totally wrong though, lol. Hope I helped.
 
#5 ·
BJJ Boy said:
Normal JJ (Japense JJ) Is stand up, they throw and do wrist locks standing. BJJ (Brazillian JJ) Is grappling, youre on the ground choking each other and breaking limbs.


JJJ is a waste of youre life, BJJ is the best thing that will hapen to you.
Wow... I really don't know what to respond about this. I will say that the new breed of "MMA FIghting Elitists" that tout BJJ and MT as the end all/be all styles to train in are just as annoying and ignorant as the TMA marketers from the 2 decades preceding UFC 1.

I will only say this once: Look your shit up, before you spew ignorant crap like this. Maeda's style of Judo that he taught to Gastao Gracie was not the Kano methodology that became modern Judo. Maeda's style was older (Kosen Judo) that he dubbed Ju-Jutsu as it wasn't in a form readily practiceable by the masses. It was the literal form of JJJ. If that "waste of youre life" view was shared by Helio's father, then BJJ would not exist.
 
#6 ·
BJJ Boy said:
Normal JJ (Japense JJ) Is stand up, they throw and do wrist locks standing. BJJ (Brazillian JJ) Is grappling, youre on the ground choking each other and breaking limbs.


JJJ is a waste of youre life, BJJ is the best thing that will hapen to you.
JJJ isn't "a waste of your life" and BJJ isn't "the best thing that will happen to you" either. There are tons of submission arts that all work in MMA and in real life. I think you watch too much UFC though, since the majority of the people there train in Muay Thai and BJJ and that's about it. Other arts such as *****, Freestyle Wrestling, Greco-Roman Wrestling, Shoot wrestling, Judo, or more general Submission Wrestling all work well if the fighter is well trained in that art (and in some cases make modifications to their art, such as Greco-Roman Wrestling not giving their back to their opponent, which is supposedly common among that style of wrestling but that will easily lead to your downfall in MMA).

The thing is, JJJ isn't optimal for MMA but that doesn't mean there aren't things that will transfer from that art to the ring. I wouldn't train in it for sports since there are a lot of things you can't use in MMA, but that doesn't mean it is a waste of a life.
 
#7 ·
Ugh... Again, you are missing the point. Again, do some real research before you start making yourself look idiotic. I will excuse so much toward being young and not knowing better, but FFS we live in the time of the internet and the path to information is less than a few minutes and few clicks away.
 
#8 · (Edited)
Man, youre starting to piss me off. Im telling this guy not to waste his time on a pethetic martial art when it comes to fighting, if he wants a more non realistic martial art then he should go ahead and do JJJ, and yea im a kid but that no an excuse, i know about mma alot more then most people, when it comes to BJJ i know more then 90% of these forum people.
Let me make something clear to you: MMA is sport. When you train in MMA, you train according to the damn rules - for self-defense, it isn't too good. I mean, yeah, you could use it against a kid at your school. You could even show off with it - which you apparently do on the forums and in school ("lolz im the tough guy in my school. im invincible cuz i noe bjj. dont retaliate after this, or else, lolz").
You obviously have a superiority complex because your martial art is dominant in the UFC. That sort of mentality goes against the original principles of Mixed Martial Arts. Don't insult Onganju, he's one of the most helpful people at this forum, and the most knowledgable. He knows more than you'll ever hope to know, seeing as how you're single-minded and really damn stubborn.

Just to let you know, contrary to what people like you believe, there are traditional martial artists that'll destroy a MMA champion in a no-rules situation. Of course, these same styles are rendered useless in the ring, where there are rules. Who would you say is the better fighter - one who needs rules to protect him and use his style? Or the one who can fight in any situation and deal with any sort of attack?
So, please, grow up and open your mind..."be water, my friend..."
 
#9 ·
BJJ Boy said:
Man, youre starting to piss me off. Im telling this guy not to waste his time on a pethetic martial art when it comes to fighting, if he wants a more non realistic martial art then he should go ahead and do JJJ, and yea im a kid but that no an excuse, i know about mma alot more then most people, when it comes to BJJ i know more then 90% of these forum people.
That's laughable. If you know so much about BJJ, how comes you don't know how to get down to your weight class. =) (Which you shouldn't be doing at your age, anyways.) Part of martial arts is knowing your body, and you obviously don't.
 
#10 ·
BJJ Boy said:
Man, youre starting to piss me off.
Good. Then get yourself some real knowledge. Grow up and let your balls drop.
BJJ Boy said:
Im telling this guy not to waste his time on a pethetic martial art when it comes to fighting,
If that "pethetic" martial art didn't exist, neither would BJJ. Do you get my point now?
BJJ Boy said:
if he wants a more non realistic martial art then he should go ahead and do JJJ,
Or become a Pro-Wrestler. Guess what? He'd still end up in better physical condition and skill to be able to handle himself against 90% of the average people he would run into on a regular basis.
BJJ Boy said:
and yea im a kid but that no an excuse,
Exactly... Just because you are 13 do you think I'm going to be nice if you're being ignorant, or grossly stating stupid things?
BJJ Boy said:
i know about mma alot more then most people,
No you don't.
BJJ Boy said:
when it comes to BJJ i know more then 90% of these forum people.
Ummm... No you don't. Otherwise you would have an idea of BJJ's roots and history. There are a lot of people who practice here on the Forum (myself included) who have been on this earth longer than you. There are also a lot of people who may agree with you on a few things, but they aren't coming to your defense because you are posting your thoughts like an elitist, no-it-all douche. You know just enough to get yourself hurt, and that's worst than knowing nothing at all and being able to admit it.
 
#11 · (Edited)
I must commend you on your patience, Onganju. At times, I find it difficult to tolerate some of the ignorant diatribes from individuals on this forum who know virtually nothing about martial arts but instead act as if they know more than a Grandmaster.

This belligerent attitude that I see from these individuals is the antithesis of the majority of the teachings of martial arts which emphasize respect and discipline.
 
#12 ·
I'd love to see somebody who is trained in JJJ go against BJJ Boy and to put him in his place. JJJ, most schools, are trained to take down your opponent as fast as possible. They use more than wrist locks. They do just about all joint manipulations along with some chokes.

Like others have said, just because JJJ isn't suitable for the ring doesn't make it any less of an art. By your logic, Krav Maga and Systema are also wastes of time since they can't be used in the ring even though those are relatively easy to learn and can be brutal.
 
#13 ·
Mehh... This is just a forum. I keep myself sane by keeping it in perspective. It's really no big deal either way, and the personality types are in no way anything new to anything I haven't seen/read before.

It just pains me to see when someone else puts them in much bigger position than they are. It's also a trend that I see all too often now that anything associated with "Traditional Martial Arts" is too easily deemed useless.
 
#14 ·
Onganju said:
Mehh... This is just a forum. I keep myself sane by keeping it in perspective. It's really no big deal either way, and the personality types are in no way anything new to anything I haven't seen/read before.

It just pains me to see when someone else puts them in much bigger position than they are. It's also a trend that I see all too often now that anything associated with "Traditional Martial Arts" is too easily deemed useless.
Here's a question: wouldn't Muay Thai be considered a TMA? I say that because the art itself is fairly old. I know Kyokushin Karate could be considered one and it can be just as brutal as Muay Thai, depending on the level you're at.
 
#16 ·
Zapatista said:
Here's a question: wouldn't Muay Thai be considered a TMA? I say that because the art itself is fairly old. I know Kyokushin Karate could be considered one and it can be just as brutal as Muay Thai, depending on the level you're at.
Considering it's roots go back further than many of the widely accepted TMA's, yes. However many people don't even look that far into a Martial Art. Hell, most are more concerned about if they get belts or not and how fast they can get them. I would realistically consider modern Muay Thai as a more sportative Martial Art, just like Boxing, Wrestling, Judo or Submission Wrestling.
 
#17 ·
Onganju said:
Considering it's roots go back further than many of the widely accepted TMA's, yes. However many people don't even look that far into a Martial Art. Hell, most are more concerned about if they get belts or not and how fast they can get them. I would realistically consider modern Muay Thai as a more sportative Martial Art, just like Boxing, Wrestling, Judo or Submission Wrestling.
Would you consider Muay Thai a TMA if you learn it in Thailand? The only reason I ask is because it is a lot more spiritual and there's more than just the competitions in Thailand.

But ya, there are some really awesome TMAs, just look at internal arts such as Tai Chi, Qi Gong and Yoga (not power yoga, but other schools such as Hatha Yoga).
 
#18 ·
Zapatista said:
Would you consider Muay Thai a TMA if you learn it in Thailand? The only reason I ask is because it is a lot more spiritual and there's more than just the competitions in Thailand.

But ya, there are some really awesome TMAs, just look at internal arts such as Tai Chi, Qi Gong and Yoga (not power yoga, but other schools such as Hatha Yoga).
No... Not really. The reason being is that in Thailand, they'd teach you Muay Boran instead if you were looking for its more "traditional" form. The Wai Kru, the music, the ritual of sealing the ring are definitely traditions tied closely to Muay Thai, but I think that is more indicative of Muay Thai's prominent role in Thai culture in general. You have to keep in mind that MT is the National Sport of Thailand and over 90% of the male populace has practiced it and trained at some point in their lives. MT is more important to the Thais than Baseball is to Americans.

I think most don't give TMA's enough credit. Furthermore most don't look into them deeper than what they see on TV, the Movies, or in the Cage/Ring. There is a large part of the Martial Arts that many people neglect away from gaining their next belt or winning their next tournament. Everyone wants to know if they can kick high, break things or make someone fall into uncosciousness. Not everyone considers learning how to avoid having to use what they learn in the first place. In that regard, if that is all that we strive for, what makes any Martial Art any more noble or worthwhile than Soccer or Bowling?
 
#19 ·
Having tried both JJJ and BJJ I have to say that I prefer BJJ by a mile due to the more physical aspects of the training. Whilst JJJ does have a lot of effective moves, the training methods I encountered always invloved training with a passive opponent - The total opposite to 'alive' BJJ training we do at SBG Aberdeen. Also, at the JJJ class I attended, there was no sparring allowed 'due to the destructive nature of the moves' which is bullshit as long as everyone who trains uses common sense when doing submissions.
 
#20 ·
The reason being is that in Thailand, they'd teach you Muay Boran instead if you were looking for its more "traditional" form.
I've read in various places that it's very hard to find a place to learn Muay Boran, even in Thailand. Most schools claim to teach Muay Boran, but they actually teach Muay Thai (or so I've heard).
I mean, in my opinion, it is a traditional martial art...people just changed it to be sport-friendly - like Karate, or other sport-TMA's. I dunno, I'm not too familiar with all of this sport vs real use stuff.

I think most don't give TMA's enough credit. Furthermore most don't look into them deeper than what they see on TV, the Movies, or in the Cage/Ring.
*Nods* Yeah, most people (including myself a while back) thought that if a MA does not work in the ring, it will not work in the streets. Of course, now I'm not such a dunderhead. Lol.

But yeah, JJJ is good for real life use, but I wouldn't really recommend it only because most JJ schools don't have live-sparring - which BJJ schools do. I mean, BJJ isn't ideal for self-defense, but when are you ever going to use "advanced grappling" in a street fight. It's not like BJJ/JJJ masters run around mugging people. Lol.
 
#21 ·
Alfromsleep said:
Having tried both JJJ and BJJ I have to say that I prefer BJJ by a mile due to the more physical aspects of the training. Whilst JJJ does have a lot of effective moves, the training methods I encountered always invloved training with a passive opponent - The total opposite to 'alive' BJJ training we do at SBG Aberdeen. Also, at the JJJ class I attended, there was no sparring allowed 'due to the destructive nature of the moves' which is bullshit as long as everyone who trains uses common sense when doing submissions.
In actuality that isn't a new practice by any stretch. In fact, the one thing that made Kano's approach to training so "revolutionary" at the time was that he encourage randori saying that it was vital for the mastery of the art. Even then, there are techniques that are taught but not allowed in randori or competition like the Dakiage (high hip lift/powerbombing an opponent in gaurd), or Kawazugake (single-leg entanglement throw/russian leg-sweep). BJJ does the same with a large variety of Neck Cranks, Heel Hooks, and Compression locks like bicep and calf slicers.

However, if the teacher of the art is willing to make an effort to begin applying techniques in a live setting they would probably be able to figure which JJJ can be used regularly in randori. Obviously a lot of wristlocks, fingerlocks (a favorite of mine), eye-gouges and groin attacks wouldn't be readily available for normal sparring, but you would still be better off with that over nothing. It really is symptomatic of the training method over anything specific to the actual style.

Trainee said:
But yeah, JJJ is good for real life use, but I wouldn't really recommend it only because most JJ schools don't have live-sparring - which BJJ schools do. I mean, BJJ isn't ideal for self-defense, but when are you ever going to use "advanced grappling" in a street fight. It's not like BJJ/JJJ masters run around mugging people. Lol.
Exactly... Most schools do not. It would be the same thing if you went to a "Cardio Kick Boxing" place over a full blown Kick Boxing or MT gym. All the more reason to be picky with the places you choose to train at.
 
#22 ·
Onganju said:
Wow... I really don't know what to respond about this. I will say that the new breed of "MMA FIghting Elitists" that tout BJJ and MT as the end all/be all styles to train in are just as annoying and ignorant as the TMA marketers from the 2 decades preceding UFC 1.

I will only say this once: Look your shit up, before you spew ignorant crap like this. Maeda's style of Judo that he taught to Gastao Gracie was not the Kano methodology that became modern Judo. Maeda's style was older (Kosen Judo) that he dubbed Ju-Jutsu as it wasn't in a form readily practiceable by the masses. It was the literal form of JJJ. If that "waste of youre life" view was shared by Helio's father, then BJJ would not exist.
THANK YOU!!!!!! for this post because in sick of people dissin traditional ju jitsu its not all stand up it just not ground based like BJJ
 
#23 ·
Trainee said:
But yeah, JJJ is good for real life use, but I wouldn't really recommend it only because most JJ schools don't have live-sparring - which BJJ schools do. I mean, BJJ isn't ideal for self-defense, but when are you ever going to use "advanced grappling" in a street fight. It's not like BJJ/JJJ masters run around mugging people. Lol.
Some JJ schools don't do live sparring, but it really depends on the individual instructors. There are alot of younger, up-and-coming JJ instructors that are starting to teach the more practical applications of JJ.

I definitely see what you're saying, though. It's not really built for streetfights nearly as much as it's built for BJJ competition and other MA grappling competitions.

I will say this, though, I have used grappling in streetfights a few times and Ill take traditional JJ, just because I don't have to go to the concrete. A standing armlock works just fine.
 
#24 ·
JJJ i guess would be preferable if you are learning a MA for basic self defense, fun and fitness kind of thing. Im currently learning that now. Its excellent for a "drunken brawl", you'd have them on their ass and break their arm in 5 seconds.

But for ring/cage work it has to be BJJ. its more focused on that type of fighting, and good for it as long as you have stand up skills as well, but not so great for street fighting if there is more than one person, it teaches a lot of ground work and thats not good if their friend can kick you in the head.
 
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