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Mir can't understand backlash to provocative Lesnar comments

4K views 55 replies 32 participants last post by  gwabblesore 
#1 ·
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/ben_fowlkes/02/25/mir/index.html





Just becauseFrank Mirapologized, that doesn't necessarily mean he's sorry. It doesn't even mean that he knows precisely what he's supposed to be sorry for. Sure, he may have told a California radio station that he hates UFC heavyweight champBrock Lesnarand would like to "break his neck," making him "the first person that dies to Octagon-related injuries," but he's not convinced that the comment is really so incendiary, or even all that novel.
"When I got called in and they told me, 'Listen man, this is an issue,' I kind of had a smirk on my face the whole time," says Mir, who was quoted in a public apology for the remark on the UFC's Web site earlier this week. "I was like, you're kidding, right? This is a joke, right? I've heard people say that this is to the death. I've heard people say about an opponent, 'I'm going to kill him.' I heard Brock say he was going to put his hand up my rear end to pull out a horseshoe. I didn't hear anyone get too upset about that."
The man has a point. As uncomfortable as any comment about Octagon-related deaths might make some MMA fans who are already paranoid about the mainstream perception of the sport, Mir isn't the first prominent fighter to walk that road. Lightweight champB.J. Pennhas threatened to kill opponents before, or at the very least fight them until someone dies. Former light heavyweight champChuck Liddellrecently expressed a desire to endTito Ortiz's life when they meet for a third time, and that prompted no outrage.
In fact, in an interview prior to their rematch at UFC 100, Lesnar was quoted as saying that he was eager to "murder" Mir. What, exactly, is the difference between the two remarks, except that Mir was more specific with regards to method?
"No one's been able to explain it to me yet," Mir says. "I thought we understood that what we say on camera is part of the entertainment aspect of our sport and we kind of get a little artistic license. It's not like I said this to my neighbor, that if his dog shows up in my yard one more time I'm going to kill him. That would be bad. That's a problem. I didn't understand it, but hey, it came my way, I said it, and I can't cry about it now. I've just got to deal with it, I guess."
Dealing with it meant putting his name on the apology put forth by the UFC, which included an assurance from UFC presidentDana Whitethat Mir had "been talked to" and now "regrets what he said." That turns out to be about half true. If there's one thing Mir doesn't seem to regret lately, it's speaking his mind. Even when it brings criticism, the former UFC heavyweight champ is going to tell you what he really thinks.
Take his comments aboutCheick Kongobefore they met at UFC 107. Mir called Kongo's ground game one of the worst in the UFC's heavyweight class. When that drew heat from some fans, Mir refused to back away from the remark. He believed it, so why apologize for saying it?
"Any time you try to play to what you think people want you to be like, you're setting yourself up for disappointment," Mir says. "Some people are still going to hate you and some people are still going to like you, but if you're not even saying what you really think then they aren't even liking you for who you really are. If someone asks me a question, at least they can know that the answer I give is what I really think. Then, if they dislike me, at least they're disliking who I really am because I really did say that."
The same is true with the Lesnar situation, though Mir feels the need to point out, he doesn't literally want to kill Lesnar. No more than Penn wanted to killGeorges St. Pierre, anyway. The excessive rhetoric, that's just his way of getting a point across, he says.
If nothing else, the situation helps to illuminate the ways in which Lesnar has become Mir's white whale. With their series knotted at one win apiece, getting a rubber match has become almost an obsession with Mir, who said he became despondent upon hearing rumors that Lesnar's illness might end his fighting career before they ever got to meet again.
Even if Lesnar weren't the champ, Mir says, he'd be just as focused on getting a third fight with him. But that doesn't mean Mir is overlookingShane Carwin, who he'll be facing on Mar. 27 for the interim heavyweight championship. On the contrary, since the winner is tentatively scheduled to get the next shot at Lesnar, defeating Carwin is vital to his long-term plans.
"We all have our reasons for why we do things," Mir said. "It's like a guy trying to become the champion. It's not that his dream of becoming a champion is distracting him from the fight in front of him. It's just that those goals are part of his motivation. It's one more reason to go to the gym. For me, my goal of fighting Brock Lesnar again isn't distracting me, because I know I have to beat Shane Carwin and really beat him to get that third match with Brock. It's not that I'm not thinking about Shane, because I am. I'm also thinking about all the things that will come with that victory."
One of those things may be the chance to write the final chapter in his saga with Lesnar, but with that comes the possibility that the current champ may hold him to account for his words in painful and embarrassing fashion. To Mir, that's the beauty of being in the fight business. Opponents might not like what he has to say, whether he believes it to be true or not, but it's of little consequence once the cage door slams shut.
"If he thinks I'm wrong," says Mir, "he can prove it to me."



Thoughts???
 
#2 ·
making him "the first person that dies to Octagon-related injuries"

This is why I am offended by the remark.

I am a fan of this sport, and I do not want it marred by a death in the octagon. Seriously, Frank, I understand statements like this, but the particular way it is worded with regard to the octagon is too far in my opinion.

It would almost be like a professional football player saying of a member of the other team "I hope I sever his spinal column, and he lays like a lump on the field of the superdome.

I don't know, maybe it's not a proper analogy, but that is why the comment angers me, although I do accept his apology.
 
#3 ·
I am not offended by anything Frank said.

I just thought it was a stupid way to describe how badly he wants to beat Brock.

This isnt really all that big of a deal. Frank has always showed great respect for his opponent in the cage, regardless of what he says to "hype" his fights.

Sometimes I think Frank is just trying to out-heel Brock.

A lot of people on MMA forums seem to take offense to almost everything he says. Frank isnt gonna be given a break for making stupid comments. Nor should he. But as I have said this isnt a big deal. He just said something stupid.
 
#5 ·
I disagree. What he said was calculated. I don't have any problem with it; in fact I give him credit for saying the right thing to cause a stir but I don't think this was some kind of stupid blunder. Frank Mir is one of the smartest guys in MMA. This was not an accident.
 
#10 ·
Sometimes I think Frank is just trying to out-heel Brock.
Exactly. Brock is a natural heel. That just him. Frank isn't this guy that he's trying to be. Frank's brain did this math:

1. Frank sees Brock being a heel.
2. Frank sees Brock sell hella PPVs.
3. Frank wants to sell hella PPVs.
4. Frank becomes a heel.

IMO, his heel act is totally unnatural, fake and ultra-transparent. That's not to mention that this fight already has a huge heel and doesn't need another one. At least for this fight, he should model his fake persona after Couture, who is always a face and always sells PPVs.

Also, I think Frank had better keep his focus on not getting KTFO by Shane Carwin. I think Mir crushes Carwin but only if he can stop dreaming of getting his face beaten in by Lesnar again.
 
#14 ·
So when Brock acts like a heel it's his natural persona and has nothing to do with marketing.... yet when Mir acts like a heel it 100% due to marketing and not really him?

Yeah okay. Excuses 101.

Truth of the matter that's Brock 'heel behavior' only came after Mir talked relentless trash about him and that Brock's UFC 100 antics don't have anything on Mir saying he wants to be responsible for the first octagon related death, making fun of Kongo's english, calling Nog an excuse maker, saying he would kick Brock in the guts while he was on his death bed, and saying Fedor was ducking the UFC.
 
#7 ·
I just wish people would drop this already.

Like I said a million times look at my sig. He said that about Kongo no one cared but when it's Lesnar it's a big deal. Are you a racist?

LOL see what I did there?^
 
#9 ·
What Mir said about Kongo isn't really quite the same as saying "the first person to die of octagon related injuries."

I don't want to come down too hard on Mir over it, because certainly, I understand hyping fights and putting other fighters in your sights.

I just wish that he had chosen a slightly different way to word it other than wishing for octagon related death, but it's not a big deal, just an unfortunate choice of words.
 
#8 ·
Mir should be embarrassed to continue this nonsense. This is just making him looking like more of a crazy stalker, something Brock already called him out on.

Whats really sad is that in Mirs mind he and Brock are arch nemesis's like Batman and the Joker, but in reality Brock thought his last name was Mur until very recently.
 
#13 ·
Frank Mur and Cock Lesnar are drinking a beer together right now laughing at all the internet geeks who take the hype seriously.
Maybe they are with Lyoto as well and drinking pee :)
 
#16 ·
The hypocrisy from Mir is breathtaking... and more than a little entertaining.

I have but 2 points:-

(1)suggesting nobody said anything regards Brock and his horseshoe out of bottom remarks is absurd. Brock got slaughtered in the press for his post UFC100 godzilla moment.

(2)Mir says fighters should be allowed some licence to be theatrical/c*untish in front of the cameras. He says, fighters should say how they feel rather than canned responses. I agree with him to be honest. BUT!!! Franky boy you swollen bag of smugness, thats EXACTLY what Brock was doing after the UFC100 fight. Anybody who suggests Lesnar "planned" to stick his finger in Mirs face and gloat is delusional. Brock was pumped because he just overcame him nemesis. The same nemesis who had been gloating him for months. I thought Lesnars tirade after UFC100 was one of the most raw and emotional outbursts Ive ever seen from a winning fighter. I LOVED IT. He just couldn't contain himself. He was doing exactly what Mir is SUGGESTING fighters should do : be honest and express how they really feel. I dont see why doing this directly after a fight is any worse than doing it for 2 months before?... Frank you knob! * hugs *
 
#18 ·
I dont know if I can speak for everyone in the UK and Europe, but I think Americans are way to easily offended, I was not offended by the comments at all, in fact I think his comments have been blown way out of per-portion simply because Americans as way to easily offended.

I took it when I first heard it for what it was, nothing more than pre-fight build up, and Mir shooting his mouth to put the spot light back on him hoping to get him a shot again at the title, thats still how I see it and I pay it no mind then as a still do now.

Well maybe its just me I am hard to offend, I dont even think I would be offended if Mir was to break Brock neck in a rematch never mind just saying it, so maybe I am a bad person to judge what is and is not offensive, so what the hell who cares what he said, lets see if he can do as he says before we all judge him.
 
#22 ·
Frank likes to talk trash, but he's just not good at it.

Saying that you plan to break someone's neck, making them the first person to die of octagon related injuries CANNOT be taken figuratively... Look up "murder" in the dictionary and there are many alternate definitions unrelated to actually taking someone's life.

Frank's a "smart" guy, I would've thought he could figure that out...
 
#25 ·
His comment definitely was more literal than figurative which is likely why it offended people and the other comments just seemed like hype or trash talk. Also, Mir has broken bones of opponents in the Octagon before so it's not really an impossibility that he could really kill someone.
 
#26 ·
...I can't see how Lesnar isn't a distraction considering he and Mir have the biggest rivalry. Mir is at a loss for words. "I know I have to beat Carwin and really beat him to get that third match". That statement there says he still is looking past Carwin for the third match. With Shane's insane punching power combined with a good game plan from Yoda, Mir's only hope for beating Carwin is to submit him, (If he can keep him down)- Gonzaga is a big dude with a heavy top game including serious Jiu Jitsu and he couldn't hold Carwin down. If Mir dares to exchange with Shane, Mir will take an instant nap...
 
#27 ·
This whole situation is funny, and Mir is probably thinking ''Haha, I got the innanet' goin nuts!''

I'll probably laugh if Mir loses to Carwin and Lesnar steps in the cage to laugh.
 
#29 ·
Gotta love Frank, everyone seems to have forgotten he still has to win a fight before he gets Lesnar in a rubber match.

I will die in a fit of laughter if he gets KTFO by Carwin after all this.
 
#35 ·
Who has Cawin beaten to make people all so sure he will own Mir???? Do you guys that are betting Carwn thin khe has better stand up than Mir??? He doesnt, he doesnt have better Jitz, all he has is wrestling that I doubt he is going to want to try against Mir??

This will def be alot of stand up, but Mir could easily find a slick sub and a quick end to the night but something like a gullotine isnt gonna work on Carwin, I WILL ADMIT THAT....
 
#36 ·
I agree with you 100%...

I even think that after the Brock loss, and on the road back to brock, game has been working on his TDD...it only seems logical.
 
#40 ·
You know, different words carry different meanings. Language is a social thing, and communication is in its core. If Mir wanted to say something else he should have used other words. In essence it wasn't "well worded" at all if he meant something else. Quite the opposite.

Most certainly not all told.
 
#39 ·
The difference is that Mir was quite serious and detailed that he wanted to actually kill another human being in a violent sport, and it wasn't like a figure of speech or an angry outburst.

It's different from Brock saying he would murder Mir, or dudes on this forum saying "Mir got totally murdered in that fight", or "That fight was a massacre". Duh, it's not literal, there wasn't actually a homicide committed or a nutjob spraying machine gun fire into the audience and creating a massacre. It's a figure of speech; we use exaggerations in speech all the time, but they're not literal.

It is different from whimsical quotes like "to the death" from BJ, because it's quite obvious he's not being literal either. He doesn't say with a calm voice "I plan on going into that fight and trying to punch GSP in the jugular, then fight the ref off and snap it. No seriously, I hate him enough to actually kill him." Again, what BJ said can be termed as "Bravado" and not literal.

It is even different from angry outbursts like Shamrock or Mike Tyson back in the day. You could tell they had anger management problems and they were angry outbursts. Maybe they meant it at the moment, but at least it was said in utter anger.

Mir's was different... he said it calmly, in a regular interview, literally, in great detail how he is so full of hate that he ACTUALLY wants to MURDER another human being because he is so petty about getting beat. This is human ego and jealousy taken to the max, like actual Tonya Harding level. Plus the dude is probably raging from the roids he's pumping to "get revenge". He is pathetic.
 
#41 ·
...Carwin put Gabe to sleep. Rogan best describes that Carwin fight. "You know what's really impressive about this? He overcame adversity before that KO. It was a short right hand. That is big power. When a guy can knock out a big guy like Gonzaga with a punch like that...that says alot...Mir really can only hope to survive the 1st round, drag it out a bit and try for a submission victory. Mir can box but not as good as Shane. I think Carwin will keep it standing and stuff any shots. Carwin will find his range early, catch Mir in an exchange and it's night, night Frankie!
 
#44 ·
I know and I really respect his Karate background, but I can't really see much of it either.. I really don't know, but I guess I see that coming, because of Mir's slowness. And after he bulck up to 260 now, I see this as an even bigger Problem for him.
 
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