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Old 11-22-2012, 04:47 AM   #1 (permalink)
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So, I hear this alot in my neck of the woods and alot of people say that someone with just 1 Month of BJJ could submit the average person (or hurt them on the "street"). Does anyone think this is a good number? BJJ doesn't prepare you to get smashed in the face and while I love MMA and train, I'm not so convinced that your average MMA fighter could run through just anyone on the street (that has never trained in any martial art or discipline). My main reason is this: there is no feeling out process like we tend to see in sanctioned fights (and no rules). Any thoughts?
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:15 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by FBrown View Post
So, I hear this alot in my neck of the woods and alot of people say that someone with just 1 Month of BJJ could submit the average person (or hurt them on the "street"). Does anyone think this is a good number? BJJ doesn't prepare you to get smashed in the face and while I love MMA and train, I'm not so convinced that your average MMA fighter could run through just anyone on the street (that has never trained in any martial art or discipline). My main reason is this: there is no feeling out process like we tend to see in sanctioned fights (and no rules). Any thoughts?
It depends on how many lessons that person has had during that one month period. I would say you probably only need 5 lessons, with prior knowledge of MMA/BJJ, to easily defeat an 'average' person off the street.

Also, BJJ does prepare you for getting hit in the face!!!!!

BJJ is a Martial Art of self defence, every martial art prepares you for getting hit in the face.

You give 'a feeling out process' as your reason as to why an average MMA fighter couldn't run through an average person on the street? This is complete nonsense buddy. There would be no need for a feeling out process, an average MMA fighter would crush anyone of similar size who hasn't had any training. Now if your talking about someone who has had only 1 month of BJJ/MMA training, taking out some random on the street, then the result would be the same.

You train MMA? Then either you're lying, delusional or trolling. If you are completely innocent then I hope my post has helped you.
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:24 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Sounds like you need to hit up this guy:

http://www.mmaforum.com/mma-smacktal...ng-should.html
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:28 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Sounds like you need to hit up this guy:

http://www.mmaforum.com/mma-smacktal...ng-should.html
Saw that coming.
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Old 11-22-2012, 05:10 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
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It depends on how many lessons that person has had during that one month period. I would say you probably only need 5 lessons, with prior knowledge of MMA/BJJ, to easily defeat an 'average' person off the street.

Also, BJJ does prepare you for getting hit in the face!!!!!

BJJ is a Martial Art of self defence, every martial art prepares you for getting hit in the face.

You give 'a feeling out process' as your reason as to why an average MMA fighter couldn't run through an average person on the street? This is complete nonsense buddy. There would be no need for a feeling out process, an average MMA fighter would crush anyone of similar size who hasn't had any training. Now if your talking about someone who has had only 1 month of BJJ/MMA training, taking out some random on the street, then the result would be the same.

You train MMA? Then either you're lying, delusional or trolling. If you are completely innocent then I hope my post has helped you.
1. BJJ doesn't prepare you for that. If you train BJJ somewhere where you're getting hit in the face when you're rolling then get your money back.

2. Every martial art prepares you for that? No.

3. I've seen a few top notch MMA guys get their ass beat by someone with no prior MMA experience or any martial art at that. Didn't Don Frye get beat down in a hotel lobby? Ever heard Nick Diaz talk about getting his ass beat? And please no one say "they aren't top notch guys." They were/are professional fighters and that's what this discussion is about. All I'm merely saying is that fighting in the octagon and on the street IS two different things. If you put me in a triangle, who is to say I won't just bite off your balls? That kinda thing.

4. No, I'm not lying or trolling or anything. I simply asked a question but alot of people like to look tough on the forum by "calling people out" like that. Either way, I don't train on a full time basis but yeah I train and have had a couple of amateur fights (5 to be exact).
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Old 11-23-2012, 02:52 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Sounds like you need to hit up this guy:

http://www.mmaforum.com/mma-smacktal...ng-should.html
I concur. TK is a specialist when it comes to utilizing his combat expertise.

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Saw that coming.
He should open his own dojo. How many applicants you think he'll have.

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1. BJJ doesn't prepare you for that. If you train BJJ somewhere where you're getting hit in the face when you're rolling then get your money back.

2. Every martial art prepares you for that? No.

3. I've seen a few top notch MMA guys get their ass beat by someone with no prior MMA experience or any martial art at that. Didn't Don Frye get beat down in a hotel lobby? Ever heard Nick Diaz talk about getting his ass beat? And please no one say "they aren't top notch guys." They were/are professional fighters and that's what this discussion is about. All I'm merely saying is that fighting in the octagon and on the street IS two different things. If you put me in a triangle, who is to say I won't just bite off your balls? That kinda thing.

4. No, I'm not lying or trolling or anything. I simply asked a question but alot of people like to look tough on the forum by "calling people out" like that. Either way, I don't train on a full time basis but yeah I train and have had a couple of amateur fights (5 to be exact).
These topics are always fun. We've all been involved in little skirmishes. I'm sure you have as well. A pro fighter doesn't mean he can win 100% of the times, simply means he has a higher chance of winning and or survival based from his cage/Octagon experience. Look up Rickson Gracie, Roger Huerta, Overeem, Bas, Chuck Liddell, War Machine, and Faber + TUF alumni crazy dude who both survived movie style rumbles in Bali and Thailand respectively.

Martial arts is about respect and discipline. Try out a class and you'll gain a whole new perspective.
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Old 11-23-2012, 04:05 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by No_Mercy View Post
I concur. TK is a specialist when it comes to utilizing his combat expertise.



He should open his own dojo. How many applicants you think he'll have.



These topics are always fun. We've all been involved in little skirmishes. I'm sure you have as well. A pro fighter doesn't mean he can win 100% of the times, simply means he has a higher chance of winning and or survival based from his cage/Octagon experience. Look up Rickson Gracie, Roger Huerta, Overeem, Bas, Chuck Liddell, War Machine, and Faber + TUF alumni crazy dude who both survived movie style rumbles in Bali and Thailand respectively.

Martial arts is about respect and discipline. Try out a class and you'll gain a whole new perspective.
Yeah they're definitely a fun discussion and I totally agree, being a pro fighter does increase your chances but I hate when people say "oh he'd roll through anyone on the street like it wasn't shit." And I have tried I class lol, I've been doing BJJ for 2 years and Muay Thai for a tad bit longer along with Wrestling/Boxing. I love it but I also still know people personally who don't train that I'd have an extremely tough time with. Got any links in regards to the fights with Chuck, etc? Would love to hear more about them and what all went down
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Old 11-23-2012, 04:56 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I always thought if a BJJ guy triangled a guy in a street fight 1 of 2 things could happen.

1 - the other guys friends would stomp all over him.

2 - the other guy would pick him up and slam him into the concrete.
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Old 11-23-2012, 06:42 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FBrown View Post
1. BJJ doesn't prepare you for that. If you train BJJ somewhere where you're getting hit in the face when you're rolling then get your money back.

2. Every martial art prepares you for that? No.

3. I've seen a few top notch MMA guys get their ass beat by someone with no prior MMA experience or any martial art at that. Didn't Don Frye get beat down in a hotel lobby? Ever heard Nick Diaz talk about getting his ass beat? And please no one say "they aren't top notch guys." They were/are professional fighters and that's what this discussion is about. All I'm merely saying is that fighting in the octagon and on the street IS two different things. If you put me in a triangle, who is to say I won't just bite off your balls? That kinda thing.

4. No, I'm not lying or trolling or anything. I simply asked a question but alot of people like to look tough on the forum by "calling people out" like that. Either way, I don't train on a full time basis but yeah I train and have had a couple of amateur fights (5 to be exact).
1. Isn't the whole point of learning self defence/martial arts is to avoid getting hit in the face. To protect yourself?

2. Please tell me a martial art that allows you to get hit in the face while attempting a technique.

3. Really? Please elaborate. Oh, and I agree that street fighting and MMA are two different things. Its just that if you're an MMA fighter, as No Mercy said, you stand a much higher chance then if you're untrained. And there probably wouldn't be much need for a feeling out process. I won't talk about my experience because it could be bullshit for all you know but I do, mostly, know what I'm on about. If Diaz or Frye got beatdowns its beacuse of one of these reasons, the other dude was trained, bigger, or there were more of them then the fighter in question.

4. Its cool you're not a troll or anything. We get a few on this forum. I wasn't 'calling you out' or any bullshit like that. lol, don't bother with crap like that. Don't even recall ever having an argument on this forum. Debate yes, disagreements, of course. No calling out, flaming, or any other random Message Board hokum.
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Old 11-23-2012, 01:19 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FBrown View Post
1. BJJ doesn't prepare you for that. If you train BJJ somewhere where you're getting hit in the face when you're rolling then get your money back.

2. Every martial art prepares you for that? No.

3. I've seen a few top notch MMA guys get their ass beat by someone with no prior MMA experience or any martial art at that. Didn't Don Frye get beat down in a hotel lobby? Ever heard Nick Diaz talk about getting his ass beat? And please no one say "they aren't top notch guys." They were/are professional fighters and that's what this discussion is about. All I'm merely saying is that fighting in the octagon and on the street IS two different things. If you put me in a triangle, who is to say I won't just bite off your balls? That kinda thing.

4. No, I'm not lying or trolling or anything. I simply asked a question but alot of people like to look tough on the forum by "calling people out" like that. Either way, I don't train on a full time basis but yeah I train and have had a couple of amateur fights (5 to be exact).
I agree with part of what you are saying.

I don't feel like BJJ, by itself, will fully prepare you for unarmed combat. Don't get me wrong, it puts you at a huge advantage considering how easy it is to control untrained guys in grappling situations, but you're right to say that most BJJ practitioners are unprepared for strikes. That being said, some are just tough mofos who can just tank through tough shots. Also, while there definitely are exceptions to this, most untrained people don't hit very hard.

It's also true that there probably wouldn't be a feeling out process, due to the hectic nature of a street fight. That's where it comes down to high good the trained guy's fundamentals are. If you train in a striking art and have a good foundation, you should be able to hit harder than an untrained guy and generally be in a position and/or posture where he cannot hit you back very hard.

At the end of the day, the winner of a striking duel is determined by who can hit harder, who can hit more/who can take more hits, and who can avoid getting hit.

If you factor in proper mechanics for striking, the trained fighter should have the advantage in power, though there are freaks out there who just naturally pack a punch. The trained fighter should be landing more, via combinations. The trained fighter should be more durable, since his body and mind are conditioned to taking punishment. And with his footwork, head movement, head positioning, and proper fighting posture, the trained fighter should take significantly less damage.

The advantage would certainly go to the trained fighter, if he has the fundamentals ingrained. Of course, anything can happen, so it's not a guarantee. That being said, the odds heavily favor the guy who has put in work at the gym. However, it takes time for all of these things to be ingrained. 6 months - a year of regular training might afford someone this advantage. 4 classes....no.

Also, it is LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE to bite someone's nuts if you're in a remotely proper triangle.
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