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post #11 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-02-2007, 05:44 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wukkadb
Ok, so your advice to avoid a TD is move out of the way diagonally and then push their head to the ground? I'm not trying to be a dick or anything, but you're just stating the obvious man.
Hmm, perhaps, perhaps not. But whether that's true or not, the technique calls for stiff arming the head and pushing it away -- not down. It yields a different -- and in my opinion, more favorable -- result than pushing down.

Still, I haven't come across too many people who use/know of the angle and pop. I'd imagine it would be most useful for strikers who really want nothing to do with the ground, since it doesn't force you into a grappling situation of any sort. Most of that demographic rely only on the sprawl ( and don't get me wrong, there is absolutely nothing wrong with sprawling. I use it much more than the angle and pop), but that significantly increases the chance of things ending up in a grapple (be it ground or clinch).

Anyways, I hadn't intended for this topic to become soley about the angle and pop. I was hoping people would throw in their favorite ways of defending takedowns -- you know, like a group conversation. Bringing that method up was just a conversation starter. I just described one way of doing it, which not too many people I've met know about.

In that spirit, do you have any favorite ways for defending against takedowns, wukkadb?

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post #12 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-02-2007, 05:52 PM
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What an incredibly one sided arguement. Thanks for the advice i'll try using it in my next sparring session instead of the sprawl. I can see how it would be an easy way of avoiding the clinch with a possibly larger but less swift opponent and setting up strikes.

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post #13 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-02-2007, 06:19 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Deadpool
What an incredibly one sided arguement. Thanks for the advice i'll try using it in my next sparring session instead of the sprawl. I can see how it would be an easy way of avoiding the clinch with a possibly larger but less swift opponent and setting up strikes.
My pleasure. I hope it work for you. But, I really want to move this discussion away from that one specific technique and back into the general topic of takedown defense. On that note, how do you like to do it? Or alternately, what do you usually like to do after a sprawl?

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post #14 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-03-2007, 02:47 AM
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I think the key to good td defense is having a good, hard sprawl, and having good BALANCE. There's a lot of technique as far as td defense is concerned but balance is really what separates the great from the decent. Watch Mirko Cro Cop vs Yoshida if you want an excellent example of great td defense/balance. Footwork is also essential, but I think a good, fast wrestler is going to get a hold of you the majority of the time. You need to be able to really drop your hips and drop all your weight on them. The key to a good sprawl is really weight distribution, balance, and speed. You have to be able to sprawl on cue, rest your dead weight on your opponent, and keep your balance. It's also important to try and get an underhook, especially if they only grab one of your legs.




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post #15 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-03-2007, 02:28 PM
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with anything in fighting you must know & understand both sides of the game.

so to answer you a good take down defence is you must first learn the things need to take someone down & viceverse, this will better help you understand the limitations of what the persons goal is.

you may be able to stuff a single or double, but if your attacked with a hip, shoulder, or sacracfice throw you may be going for a ride if you do not understand how these throws work.

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post #16 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-03-2007, 06:04 PM
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I think I've learned this technique in my old Karate/TKD class (yeah, they taught really useful things...not that point mumbo jumbo. The only problem with the class was that it was really really...not instense). I'm not going to act like a "fighting expert" (I'm far from it, really), but this method is actually pretty effective IMO. When your opponent goes for the takedown, you jump back at an angle, while at the same time grabbing onto his shoulders. Since he's moving forward, and you're in the air (at that very moment), you'll be moved with him without having to waste energy...all the while pushing him downwards.

I mean, that's what I think Kin was referring to. I could've interpereted wrong, though.
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post #17 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-03-2007, 06:19 PM
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Well, I do thaiboxing. I usually employ my 'Knee them in the face strategy'.

You may have seen Hermes franca steal my technique and use it to limited success against sherk.
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post #18 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-03-2007, 06:20 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainee
I think I've learned this technique in my old Karate/TKD class (yeah, they taught really useful things...not that point mumbo jumbo. The only problem with the class was that it was really really...not instense). I'm not going to act like a "fighting expert" (I'm far from it, really), but this method is actually pretty effective IMO. When your opponent goes for the takedown, you jump back at an angle, while at the same time grabbing onto his shoulders. Since he's moving forward, and you're in the air (at that very moment), you'll be moved with him without having to waste energy...all the while pushing him downwards.

I mean, that's what I think Kin was referring to. I could've interpereted wrong, though.
That's not quite what I meant. In the technique I mentioned, you're not really 'in the air.' Your feet barely leave the mat.

I'm gonna roll with someone later, so I'll see what happens if I jump backwards instead. I've never thought of doing that before. In my mind, it doesn't make much sense, but ya never know 'till you try.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNegation
Well, I do thaiboxing. I usually employ my 'Knee them in the face strategy'.

You may have seen Hermes franca steal my technique and use it to limited success against sherk.
I also like that move, but rarely get to do it, since most of my sparring partners are not down for knees to the face. Good one, though.

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Last edited by Kin; 08-03-2007 at 06:24 PM.
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post #19 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-03-2007, 10:58 PM
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Quote:
I'm gonna roll with someone later, so I'll see what happens if I jump backwards instead.
Well, you don't really jump backwards. You just lift your feet off the ground, so that your entire body moves with his, without a struggle (basically, he's pushing you backwards, while you're pushing him down). I mean, obviously, this won't work if you're backed up by a wall, but you have to be smart about what you do in a fight...and not attempt to jump backwards if there's a wall right behind you.
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post #20 of 26 (permalink) Old 08-04-2007, 12:22 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainee
Well, you don't really jump backwards. You just lift your feet off the ground, so that your entire body moves with his, without a struggle (basically, he's pushing you backwards, while you're pushing him down). I mean, obviously, this won't work if you're backed up by a wall, but you have to be smart about what you do in a fight...and not attempt to jump backwards if there's a wall right behind you.
Yeah, I ended up not being able to get myself to jump all that high, but I was off the ground. It did work actually. However, my sparring partner is awful at shooting... Mike123 beats me in Judo, but he like...tries to football tackle me and calls it a shot -- all bent over at the waist and stuff. But, yeah, the move you suggested sent him crashing to the floor.

I'll test it more extensively against someone who's better at shooting, when I get the chance.

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