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Old 01-21-2007, 01:53 AM   #1 (permalink)
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muay thai and bjj

sorry if this is in the wrong thread but i was wondering why everyone decides to train bjj and muay thai when they wanna start mma .there are alot of people becoming muay thai/bjj hybrids and i was just thinking that they should maybe broaden there training a little
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Old 01-21-2007, 02:21 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Muay Thai is a more comprehensive "striking" martial art than most, making it ideal for MMA fighters. For instance, Muay Thai teaches punching, kicking, proper clinch fighting and the use of your elbows and knees. Basically, you learn everything you need for a complete standup game.

Alternatively, you could learn boxing, and then separately learn Tae Kwon Do, Karate, or any art focusing mainly on kicks, and then practice "dirty boxing" (Elbows, clinching, etc.) on your own.

Personally, my first martial art was Tae Kwon Do. I really loved the sport and won all my state tournaments and was entered into the national Olympics (Was DQ'ed for breaking my hand in training pre-fight). I left shortly after my DQ and started to evaluate the sport, and realized it was FAR too heavily focused on kicking. Kicking is great, but it's not the "end all, be all" in a fight. So, I started learning boxing and have had to incorporate my boxing with my Tae Kwon Do knowledge. It's a bit messier than just learning Muay Thai, but you get a similar result. I'm glad I did though, as I greatly prefer a TKD kick over a Muay Thai kick.

As for learning Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, it follows the same basic principles for grappling. BJJ teaches simple but effective takedowns and an extremely comprehensive ground game. Many fighters turn to it because of how extensive it is. Not all fighters learn BJJ though. Fedor and Karo Parisyan trained Judo and Sambo. Guys like Matt Hughes and Sean Sherk are wrestlers who incorporated submissions into their wrestling technique.

By learning BJJ and Muay Thai, a fighter can expect to have a well rounded stand up game and a well rounded grappling game. Is it the only way to achieve those goals? No, but it involves studying only two martial arts as opposed to many.
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Old 01-21-2007, 09:49 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Muay Thai and BJJ are as the Man above said the 2 quickest ways to learn alround Good Striking and Grappling.

Peronally I started Boxing with my Dad as a child,in high School I got into the Wrestling Team.During High School I starting trying to Learn Muay Thai off Book sources,internet,Friends training in it and Regular Kick Boxing and so on until I actually found a Place to learn it at 19,I also Officially started training in Muay Thai just 2 months before BJJ.I'm 20 now.
In the Years Between all of this and after I Did alot of Heavy Sparring with Friends that studied Different Arts.I want to go Pro in UFC and Pride someday soon.....

Personally IMO and most MMA fighters TKD can be to flashy for MMA sometimes.The Muay Thai Round house and low Round House Kicks are Built For Power and are as fast as any Round house kick can be while still having power.TKD is not about power but style,Speed and Points(for competition).So a Good M.T. Round House kick will always be more Powerful and effective then a TKD Round house kick.Its just the physics behind it, a TDK Round house Doesn't use the Hip Movement and Body weight behind it the way a M.T. Round house kick does.Also your Typical Muay Thai stance(Very much liek the Boxing stance) has a much better Defensive Position just like Boxing and Would Make most TKD uneffective.Much like a Good Boxing Stance will stop most Round kicks to the head because the Defensive stance is already blocking the Upper Body Even though its a punching style a Boxer moving in on a TKD expert will murder him at close range and a long distance fight won't work to long on a regular boxer because all he has to do is close the distance and walking and blocking do that just fine,lol.As Long as a M.T. Fighter has good Take down Defence he is Perfect,of Course M.T. is nothing on the Ground.So BJJ is still the Best Ground game to learn.But learn both and your well rounded in a short amount of time.

Last edited by NewYorkKAB : 01-21-2007 at 10:04 AM.
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Old 01-21-2007, 03:15 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewYorkKAB
Muay Thai and BJJ are as the Man above said the 2 quickest ways to learn alround Good Striking and Grappling.

Peronally I started Boxing with my Dad as a child,in high School I got into the Wrestling Team.During High School I starting trying to Learn Muay Thai off Book sources,internet,Friends training in it and Regular Kick Boxing and so on until I actually found a Place to learn it at 19,I also Officially started training in Muay Thai just 2 months before BJJ.I'm 20 now.
In the Years Between all of this and after I Did alot of Heavy Sparring with Friends that studied Different Arts.I want to go Pro in UFC and Pride someday soon.....

Personally IMO and most MMA fighters TKD can be to flashy for MMA sometimes.The Muay Thai Round house and low Round House Kicks are Built For Power and are as fast as any Round house kick can be while still having power.TKD is not about power but style,Speed and Points(for competition).So a Good M.T. Round House kick will always be more Powerful and effective then a TKD Round house kick.Its just the physics behind it, a TDK Round house Doesn't use the Hip Movement and Body weight behind it the way a M.T. Round house kick does.Also your Typical Muay Thai stance(Very much liek the Boxing stance) has a much better Defensive Position just like Boxing and Would Make most TKD uneffective.Much like a Good Boxing Stance will stop most Round kicks to the head because the Defensive stance is already blocking the Upper Body Even though its a punching style a Boxer moving in on a TKD expert will murder him at close range and a long distance fight won't work to long on a regular boxer because all he has to do is close the distance and walking and blocking do that just fine,lol.As Long as a M.T. Fighter has good Take down Defence he is Perfect,of Course M.T. is nothing on the Ground.So BJJ is still the Best Ground game to learn.But learn both and your well rounded in a short amount of time.
In addressing your comparison of TKD kicks vs. Muay Thai kicks, I'll have to disagree. See: Roundhouse kick - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As you can see there, both Muay Thai and TKD kicks involve both hip and body rotation. The main difference between the two is that Muay Thai uses more momentum, whereas TKD kicks are more focused on the rotation and "snap" motion at your knee. Muay Thai takes less leg strength to achieve more power (As it has much to do with weight and rotation), but it also is easy to read and spins you completely around if you miss. If someone who is experienced in kicking see's it coming, they're going to wait for the rotation and catch your back.

For that reason, I prefer the TKD kick, as you can kick and miss without losing your position. You can also get plenty of power behind it - Currently I've sent 2 opponents home with dislocated arms and one with 3 separated ribs through his pads. Through leg training and proper rotation and snap technique, you can learn to kick extremely hard without losing your position or getting off balance. The balance along with the exaggerated motion are big qualms I have with a MT kick, as well as the fact that a MT kick has you on the ball of your support foot (Making it extremely easy to just push the guy over if you can avoid the kick).

Your point about TKD teaching poor stance versus anything but another TKD opponent is very valid though. I agree completely. TKD focuses very lightly on protecting yourself from boxing techniques, whereas MT incorporates boxing, dirty boxing and kicking into its techniques. That is why I stated that MT is the faster way to go in learning MMA standup.

For me, I had to learn TKD to kick, boxing for proper hand work, and then had to personally work the two together. I've come out with a finished product that I'm pleased with, and was glad to do it as I enjoy the TKD kick, but learning just Muay Thai would have saved me a lot of time. =)
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Old 01-21-2007, 05:33 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Funny... I break down the differences between the two kicking styles in this thread here. I've dabbled in both, so it should be pretty accurate.

Truth be told, one of the biggest reasons why MT styles of kicks are more prevalent than TMA kicks is that they are just easier to learn.
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Old 01-21-2007, 06:01 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onganju
Funny... I break down the differences between the two kicking styles in this thread here. I've dabbled in both, so it should be pretty accurate.

Truth be told, one of the biggest reasons why MT styles of kicks are more prevalent than TMA kicks is that they are just easier to learn.
Actually, to be quite honest, many of the comparisons I made were drawn directly from your well-written thread. =) For those who are unfamiliar with the two styles, that thread is an excellent breakdown between the two. Repped by the way, that thread is excellent.
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Old 01-21-2007, 07:56 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Just to simplify what most of the people on this thread have already said:

Muay Thai is the only style that will really teach you how to use every striking weapon available in MMA. That is you hands, legs, knees and elbows. It's not an easy thing to master, but the basic principles definitely take it a step farther than a style that only teaches one or two weapons, like boxing or TKD.

BJJ is widely considered to be the most efficient submission system. Alot of guys who are great at muay thai take it not so that they can submit people, but so that they don't get submitted. In MMA today you need to know how to at least defend submissions and how to work on the ground, even if you're a standup fighter, and BJJ is a great way to learn that.

Hope that was helpful.
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Old 01-22-2007, 05:24 AM   #8 (permalink)
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ok i was just wondering what everyone thought personally i train both of these but i also train in another more mma styled adaption of them both its good training with muay thai/bjj but i would recomend throwing in an occasional session in something different
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