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Punching yourself in the face to be able to take punches better.

19K views 30 replies 14 participants last post by  kantowrestler 
#1 ·
lol i know it sounds stupid but I heard alot of boxers use it.

obviously wearing their gloves and not punching full-out their hardest.

thanks.
 
#5 ·
Eh, it'd only help a little bit. I do it a bit myself, but it's just to get used to getting hit. I know it won't add to my chin stats or anything.
 
#6 ·
First, don't bump your threads. If people are interested, they will post, and that will bump them. It's pretty shameless. Also, I hate double posting, and technically it's something that an infraction can be issued for.

Second, I've seen guys do this, but it seems mostly like superstition to me. It doesn't seem to me that a chin is something that can be cultivated, like flexibility or strength. I suppose it's possible, but I'm not sure the brain particularly appreciates it. After all, the brain is an organ, not a muscle, and I'm not sure that the old adage "that which does not destroy me makes me stronger" really applies to the loss of brain cells.
 
#7 ·
You think it could work like bone hardening? I can punch a brick wall with some force behind it and not really feel it because I've been punching walls for a long time now.

Maybe you just tap your chin and hit it a bit everyday and maybe.. I dunno I'm curious.
 
#10 ·
All I know that usually when you took alot of punches in your lifetime, then when you get punched you generally get pissed off, or your blood starts to boil a little. You have that "he hit me? well I wanna hit him back." mentality going. You dont get scared, run and cover into the fetal position. Its a good example of the fight or flight brain response. If you are accustomed to it, you are more likely to just fight it. If you arent used to that situation then your instinct is to run. Again its like touching a hot stove. When you cant handle the pain, you pull back your hand almost the second you feel it. While others try to tough it out and see how long they can hold their hand on it, and can leave their hand longer than others. I know im just blabbering now, but you get the idea.
 
#11 ·
Punching yourself in the face is a good way to make your head go a little numb before a fight/sparring session I suppose.


But doing it to help what someone like Lesnar has won't work, because you don't feel out of control or attacked like you would if someone else was punching you. Bas Rutten has an excellent drill that was posted in a recent video to help with that, but you need a partner for sure.







To chime in on the Spoken/Iron Man debate, let's get some constants down:

  • can't increase, only decrease the nerves behind your mandible's resistance

  • actual integrity of jawbone plays no part in defending the nerve behind it, webbing and calcifying therefor ineffective

  • knockout due to jaw hitting nerves is not the same as knockout due to cranial trauma (much more likely to cause concussion)

  • knockout doesn't always cause concussion

  • concussions don't always result in unconsciousness


These are the three nerves of the jawbone:
Hyperglossal Nerve

Vagus Nerve

Glossopharyngeal Nerve



From this I think we can deduce that you can technically increase the strength (or thickness) of the skull, like you can with any bone. Doing so in traditional means however could actual cause concussions.

You can't increase your resistance to concussions, and you can't strengthen the nerves behind your jaw, and calcifying/webbing of the jaw would not increase resistance of said nerves.

You can increase your ability to take a shot and stay mentally collected, which could lead you to block or evade more effectively.



A description of concussions from WebMD:

The brain is made of soft tissue. It's cushioned by spinal fluid and encased in the protective shell of the skull. When you sustain a concussion, the impact can jolt your brain. Sometimes, it literally causes it to slosh around in your head. Traumatic brain injuries can cause bruising, damage to the blood vessels, and injury to the nerves.
http://www.webmd.com/brain/concussion-traumatic-brain-injury-symptoms-causes-treatments[/

And a further description
Your brain has the consistency of gelatin. It's cushioned from everyday jolts and bumps by the cerebrospinal fluid that it floats in, inside your skull. A violent blow to your head can cause your brain to slide forcefully against the inner wall of your skull. Even the sudden stop of a car crash can bounce your brain off the inside of your skull. This can result in bleeding in or around your brain and the tearing of nerve fibers.
http://www.cnn.com/HEALTH/library/concussion/DS00320.html



Something to note is that a "concussion" style knockout is usually one where the victim is still conscious, but heavily dazed.

In MMA an opponent is commonly knocked down with a hit that causes head trauma ("concussion" style hit), and knocked out by shots to the chin and subsequently the jaw nerves.

Examples of this:

  • Shogun vs Lyoto II

  • Junior dos Santos vs Gonzaga


However, some fights are stopped after the initial "concussion" type blow, opponent is down and disabled but not unconscious.

Example of this:

  • Marquardt vs. Maia


And then of course, some opponents knocked unconscious with only shot/s to jaw and the nerves behind it. We usually consider this a "clean" knockout. Less likely to cause a concussion, except when opponents head hits mat and causes subsequent head trauma. Unless that is the case, opponents appear to be fully unconscious and then fully conscious much quicker.

Examples of this:


  • Fedor vs. Arlovski

  • Franklin vs. Liddell

The former being a jaw/nerve knockout where the head hitting the mat caused further damage, the latter being a "clean" jaw/nerve knockout where the victim was conscious again almost immediately.



The last example I can think of is the combination of the two styles of knockouts, the ones which affect the nerves and the one from head trauma. This is usually from a straight punch that both jars the head and lands flush on the jaw.

Examples of this:

  • Carwin vs. Gonzaga


That's one of the only examples I can think of, and perhaps the reason for the unique devastation of this knockout. Gonzaga was both instantly unconscious but also dazed for a long period of time, a result possibly from the jaw nerves shutting the fighter down instantly and the head trauma keeping him out longer.



Other notable links:

Repetitive Head Injury Syndrome

Sports Related Concussions


I hopes this helps guys and I know I at least learned a little bit while researching and posting.
 
#13 ·
Some green for Khov for doing the medical background. This is good for me since I don't know that much about the medical aspects of training. I rely on smart people who I trust to tell me what improves functions in the body effectively.

From this I think we can deduce that you can technically increase the strength (or thickness) of the skull, like you can with any bone. Doing so in traditional means however could actual cause concussions.

You can't increase your resistance to concussions, and you can't strengthen the nerves behind your jaw, and calcifying/webbing of the jaw would not increase resistance of said nerves.

You can increase your ability to take a shot and stay mentally collected, which could lead you to block or evade more effectively.
This is what I find really significant (though obviously you can't make claims like this without the background work that you did) because it basically asserts that there is one major factor that can be improves, and that's the ability to recover quickly and keep fighting.

That, though, can't be improved by punching yourself in the face. There is no good reason, as far as the data you presented, to believe that this is an effective training method. That's good to know.
 
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#24 ·
i do it all the time and i can take hits a bit better, i disagree that it cant benefit you though because i was hit with a hook to the chin and then an uppercut with 16ounces in training and i took it pretty well compared to maybe how i used to have taken it.
 
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#25 ·
I know what you mean. At this point though I've been training so long that I'm used to getting punched. I'm not really flinchy and I know I can take a solid hit and be okay so I'm wondering if that's more mental than chin durability. Maybe both...? I've gotten a concussion before but I never got knocked out or put on wobbly legs. I don't know why, I think I have a good chin.
 
#28 ·
Thought I'd just add something to this thread.

Firstly, well done to Khoveraki for spending a good bit of time reading up on everything and posting. Though I feel some of what you've written can be clarified a wee bit.

The three nerves you have given as an example are not in the jawbone (mandible) but are Cranial Nerves which branch out from the Medulla and though they have distributions around the mandible, none are actually located within it. The only nerve located within the body of the jawbone is the Inferior Dental Nerve - which is a branch of another Cranial Nerve - the Trigeminal.

However, as these nerves exit from the Medulla, they are linked to the brainstem - and it is injuries to this area which can result in a knockout. Not being hit directly on any of these nerves.

The actual intricacies of a knockout (such as how the brain shuts down and consciousness is lost when it happens) are still relatively unknown, though hitting a 'nerve' in the jaw will most definitely not cause any form of unconsciousness. This arises from trauma to brain cells or the brainstem. The reason that getting hit in the jaw results in more knockouts than hits elsewhere is because it is a loose projection attached to the bottom of the head and a hit here results in the mandible accelerating quickly, and thus a sharp rotation to the head, causing direct or indirect trauma to the brainstem or a sudden jolt to the brain, which can accelerates so fast it hits the skull before the cerebrospinal fluid which protects it can act as a shock absorber - thus resulting in brain trauma, and loss of or a decrease in consciousness/awareness.

You can increase bone density in the mandible through bone hardening (cortical remodelling), though you have correctly pointed out that no amount of trauma to this area through punching oneself will help stop a knockout. What would help stop a knockout however would (as pointed out by Slapshot) be to keep your chin tucked, as well as having the jaw closed tightly. Strong neck, masseter and temporalis muscles would aid this (along with a good mouthguard and being fit enough not to gas and leave your mouth hanging open during a fight!), and this would help ensure any blows to the jaw would ensure the head is not rotated too quickly, and the tension in these muscles being released on point of impact, would help absorb some of the blow from the strike.

Hope this helps.
 
#29 ·
Good IDEA! I would start immediately :thumb02:


i do it all the time and i can take hits a bit better, i disagree that it cant benefit you though because i was hit with a hook to the chin and then an uppercut with 16ounces in training and i took it pretty well compared to maybe how i used to have taken it.
I love it when the children pretend to train
 
#30 ·
Thank you d3rkk that was a great clarification and really helped. Nice to have someone of your specialty and level weighing in. :thumbsup:


I found this part especially interesting because so many of us here have wondered, fruitlessly, if strengthening any muscle could truly help in preventing a knockout:

Strong neck, masseter and temporalis muscles would aid this (along with a good mouthguard and being fit enough not to gas and leave your mouth hanging open during a fight!), and this would help ensure any blows to the jaw would ensure the head is not rotated too quickly, and the tension in these muscles being released on point of impact, would help absorb some of the blow from the strike.



I think this is turning into one of the more informative threads on MMAF.
 
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