Is Matt Hughes still the most dominate WW ever? - Page 2 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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post #11 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 01:50 PM
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I was watching a ufc documentary on matt and it got me thinking. Ok yeah GSP beat him twice but when I look at the wins the two fighters had Matt were exciting dominate wins GSP on the other hand has been doing nothing but L&P his victories and not really dominating opponents.
Do you even watch the actual fights or have you just seen the majority call GSP a "LNP Fighter"

First of all, in all of GSP's title defenses only 3 of his fights have been wrestling heavy, Thiago Alves, Dan Hardy, and BJ Penn.

Now he finished BJ and made him quit on the stool, now I don't think a guy just quits on the stool after four rounds of being layed on, a guy quits on the stool after four rounds of getting pounded.

Thiago Alves fight, he tore his groin and actually out-struck Alves, one of the premier strikers at 170.

Dan Hardy fight, had Hardy in two real nasty submissions, a kumura and an armbar.

So really, GSP's only ever "Lay n Prayed" once and that was the Thiago Alves fight, he tried to finish Hardy twice, and he actually finished Penn. The Jake Shields fight was probably his worst fight and that's because he got poked in the eye time after time after time, hell GSP even knocked Shields down with a head kick and REFUSED to go to the ground, how is that "lay n pray"?

As for the original question, no Hughes is not the most dominant, it's GSP and will be GSP for a while.

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post #12 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 02:00 PM
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There's no doubt that Hughes has accomplished a lot in his time. I would have to say Georges is more dominant than Hughes just given the fact that he convincingly beat Hughes twice and holds one sided wins over fighters that Hughes has lost to.
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post #13 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 02:05 PM
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I think that is a reasonable question to ask, but I would have to side with GSP even if he retired today. Hughes was a very dominant fighter, and I'd probably say more entertaining and vicious than GSP. But in terms of dominance, I cannot overlook how consistently he completely shut down his opponents. His dominance comes from his control, and at that he is the very best in all of mma.



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post #14 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 03:24 PM
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I think that is a reasonable question to ask, but I would have to side with GSP even if he retired today. Hughes was a very dominant fighter, and I'd probably say more entertaining and vicious than GSP. But in terms of dominance, I cannot overlook how consistently he completely shut down his opponents. His dominance comes from his control, and at that he is the very best in all of mma.
GSP is just the first fighter who ruins everyone's gameplan. Oh you're a wrestler? Guess what, hes better, you can't take him down, now you have to strike with him and hes better at that too. Then you leave with Fitch-face.

Oh you're a striker? Well he will do a great job of mixing up TD's and strikes and you have no idea what to do. Good luck landing a significant strike.

Against GSP you just will never ever fight your fight. Hes the first to ever be able to do this.

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post #15 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 03:27 PM
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Do you even watch the actual fights or have you just seen the majority call GSP a "LNP Fighter"

First of all, in all of GSP's title defenses only 3 of his fights have been wrestling heavy, Thiago Alves, Dan Hardy, and BJ Penn.

Now he finished BJ and made him quit on the stool, now I don't think a guy just quits on the stool after four rounds of being layed on, a guy quits on the stool after four rounds of getting pounded.

Thiago Alves fight, he tore his groin and actually out-struck Alves, one of the premier strikers at 170.

Dan Hardy fight, had Hardy in two real nasty submissions, a kumura and an armbar.

So really, GSP's only ever "Lay n Prayed" once and that was the Thiago Alves fight, he tried to finish Hardy twice, and he actually finished Penn. The Jake Shields fight was probably his worst fight and that's because he got poked in the eye time after time after time, hell GSP even knocked Shields down with a head kick and REFUSED to go to the ground, how is that "lay n pray"?

As for the original question, no Hughes is not the most dominant, it's GSP and will be GSP for a while.
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post #16 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 04:33 PM
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GSP is the most consistently dominant.

Hughes had vastly more exciting fights and was a higher quality entertainer, as well as a great champion and #2 in the division easily, but as pure dominance goes, GSP is very good at controlling a fight to get an easy decision, he's the best point/decision fighter out there.
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post #17 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 04:45 PM
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GSP outstruck Thiago Alves.
He out wrestled Jon Fitch.
He TKOd and Subed Matt Hughes.
He brutalized BJ Penn.
He has a 9 fight win streak and a 7 fight streak as champ...


That is DOMINATION!

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post #18 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 06:56 PM
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GSP beating Matt Hughes twice has nothing to do with it, everyone passes their prime eventually. GSP is just so much more well rounded that the discussion is ridiculous, in any area of martial arts GSP would beat Hughes anyday. There's nothing Hughes is better at, Hughes lost more fights and rounds. Hughes is the second best WW ever, a distant second.
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post #19 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 07:27 PM
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Considering GSP destroyed him twice and I beleive broke his title defense streak I am going to have to say no. But he was very dominate.

GSP is way more well rounded. He went several fights without losing a round, sure Hughes finished guys, but I think the guys he beat were not as good as the ones GSP beat. Guys like Joe Riggs, an ancient Royce Gracie, Frank Trigg twice. They are a far cry from Kos, Fitch, Sheilds, ALves, Hughes twice, BJ Penn.
GSP all the way. He completely manhandled Hughes and was so much quicker- I'll never forget the expression Hughes' face after his last last fight w/ GSP, it was like "damn that was a nightmare!"
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post #20 of 61 (permalink) Old 06-21-2012, 07:50 PM
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GSP's win streak is 9 fights, of which he has a 70% decision rate. Since he started his title run, he's on an 84% decision rate. That is extraordinarily high for a champion in MMA. Keep in mind, this is against fighters that have been finished by other people, they aren't fighters that are simply too tough to finish - they have been finished, GSP did not do it.

Hughes, on the other hand, during his prime and his championship run, had a 75% finish rate (out of 13 fights no less), pretty much the exact opposite of GSP, including finishing GSP (a young GSP, of course), and easily had the more exciting fights. To put it into perspective, it's the same finish rate Anderson Silva has since he won the title (and the same amount of fights, 13), that's crazy.

I realize that a win is a win, and I have also already acknowledged GSP is the best WW in the sport's history at this point, just pointing this out because I don't want the "gap" between Hughes and GSP to be overrated, yes GSP is the best WW, but it's not by a huge margin, Hughes is damn impressive and has some damn good accomplishments, and a vastly superior finish rate than GSP has, I think that has to be counted for in such a debate.
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