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Old 08-26-2012, 05:34 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I didn't know people were disputing Jones' right to refuse the fight, but I might have missed something across the 500 threads currently open on the issue. So I'll just focus on highlighting the parts of your argument that are subjective, without absolute fact and disputable.

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Originally Posted by Sauce1 View Post
I have been following this site for a while and mostly read comments. Once in a while I will add my two cents. Overall, I have enjoyed reading comments that are intelligent, respectful and informed. These conversations are about evidence, logic and facts.

With that being said, I am highly disappointed in what I have been reading this week. Lots of folks are placing way too much blame on JBJ for the cancellation of the event. They are speaking out of emotions and sometimes out of pure ignorance and hate. I am starting to wonder if these are the moments when closet racists and haters come out to spout their venom. I hope not but am starting to question that. Some of you are acting like he stole your lunch money.

With that being said, let us look at the FACTS. It is easy for you to sit behind your computer and criticize and bash JBJ. Fact number 1) MMA is a combative sport and these fighters need to look out for their safety. Chael is in the UFC and has fought some top competition. With such a short-time window for JBJ to prepare and study his game, he has every RIGHT to not accept the fight. This is simply a fact. Whether you like it or not is not the issue. Fact #2) The UFC and Dana white are trying to scapegoat JBJ and take NO responsibility for this mess up. They are the owners and promoters and need to be held responsible. If you do not feel they fully need to be, they need to be held on some level based on the FACTS. Fact number 3) JBJ had little to gain and much to lose from taking the Chael fight. He did not see it to be in his best interests and do you blame him? He is fighting to make a living and worked his butt off to become champ. He has the right to make decisions that he fits well with his interests. This is not slavery and he has rights as an employee of the UFC. Whether you like it or not does not matter because the FACT is that he has this right. Fact 4) JBJ is not solely responsible for the other fighters not being able to fight. This is just ridiculous. The UFC has to take some responsibility for this mess up and realize not to put all your eggs in one basket.

I can go on with many more FACTS but it amazes me how so many people on this forum seem to ignore these FACTS and just pout and complain. JBJ puts his safety on the line for your entertainment and this is how people act? This is really turning me off this sport. I thought fans were more mature and understanding that these fighters take serious risk and need to look out for a ) themselves B) their families and c) the fans and promotion. But for some reason, some of you are ignoring these FACTS and just complaining nonstop. Please grow up. Thanks
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Old 08-26-2012, 05:43 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by killua View Post
I didn't know people were disputing Jones' right to refuse the fight, but I might have missed something across the 500 threads currently open on the issue. So I'll just focus on highlighting the parts of your argument that are subjective, without absolute fact and disputable.
Hunter X Hunter??
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:09 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killua View Post
I didn't know people were disputing Jones' right to refuse the fight, but I might have missed something across the 500 threads currently open on the issue. So I'll just focus on highlighting the parts of your argument that are subjective, without absolute fact and disputable.
People are alluding to the idea that Jones should not have the right to turn the fight down. You can spin it how you like but that is my opinion. Regarding what you highlighted, I do not see how that discredits my points? I gave my opinion, along with the facts that are Irrefutable. I am not 100% objective in my responses and assume you are not as well.
Regarding my points, I numbered the facts purposefully. But let us revisit them shall we?

Fact 1 – JBJ had a very short-time window to prepare for Chael and has the right under his contractual agreement to not accept the fight.

Fact 2 – Dana has made no mention of the role that Dan Henderson, his company and any other parties played in cancelling the event (except JBJ). All he stated was that Dan was injured but placed no accountability on Dan or the UFC’s shoulders. For example, the time that it took for Dan to disclose his injury or the lack of preparation from UFC to deal with something like this to save the card. These are not opinions but facts.

Fact 3 – JBJ did not feel it was in his best interest to take the fight. You highlighted some of my thoughts on it but it still does not take from the relevance of the fact that JBJ is the champion and felt that it was not in his interest to take a fight on such short notice when he felt he had little to gain from it.

Fact 4 – The UFC is an organization, with contractual relationship with their employees and play a role when a whole event is scrapped. This is not a subjective opinion but based on common sense and fact.

If you truly want to make it sound like an opinion, then we can go in circles with this and play the game of ‘what is the truth’, ‘what is a fact’. I provided my thoughts, as well as the facts. That is usually a common occurrence when folks create threads.

Last edited by Sauce1 : 08-26-2012 at 06:24 AM.
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:10 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Hunter X Hunter??
Yes, and while that's probably a more interesting discussion than this thread, the mods might disagree.

Is it still going? It's been a few years now since I've checked.
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:21 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Yes, and while that's probably a more interesting discussion than this thread, the mods might disagree.

Is it still going? It's been a few years now since I've checked.
Well the last episode ended with right before he "Found" his father. And the show stopped there. Having read alot of the manga


BUT there is a new Hunter X Hunter called "HunterXHunter(2011)" that is basically the DBZ KAI version of HunterXHunter. I am fingers crossed hoping that they go further this time but its too early to tell since they are maybe at best half way through. So itl be a while before it gets to that portion of the show.

And yeah you are right. But the mods are pretty nice about these things. This is a forum for people to get together and talk,discuss and a post or 2 to talk about something friendly isnt going to bother them.

But if we keep going then it might

If you want to ask anything else feel free to message me. I have no problem discussing good animes like Hunter X Hunter. I actually think it is my favorite next to good ol DBZ
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:25 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sauce1 View Post
People are alluding to the idea that Jones should not have the right to turn the fight down. You can spin it how you like but that is my opinion. Regarding what you highlighted, I do not see how that discredits my points? I gave my opinion, along with the facts that are Irrefutable. I am not 100% objective in my responses and assume you are not as well.
Regarding my points, I numbered the facts purposefully. But let us revisit them shall we?

Fact 1 – JBJ had a very short-time window to prepare for Chael and has the right under his contractual agreement to not accept the fight.

Fact 2 – Dana has made no mention of the role that Dan Henderson, his company and any other parties played in cancelling the event. All he stated was that Dan was injured but placed no accountability on Dan or the UFC’s shoulders. For example, the time that it took for Dan to disclose his injury or the lack of preparation from UFC to deal with something like this to save the card. These are not opinions but facts.

Fact 3 – JBJ did not feel it was in his best interest to take the fight. You highlighted some of my thoughts on it but it still does not take from the relevance of the fact that JBJ is the champion and felt that it was not in his interest to take a fight on such short notice when he felt he had little to gain from it.

Fact 4 – The UFC is in organization, with contractual relationship with their employees and play a role when a whole event is scrapped. This is not a subjective opinion but based on common sense and fact.

If you truly want to make it sound like an opinion, then we can go in circles with this and play the game of ‘what is the truth’, ‘what is a fact’. I provided my thoughts, as well as the facts. That is usually a common occurrence when folks create threads.
I have no problem with people providing their opinion, but it appears that you do given the purpose of this thread you created.

The main problem I have with your arguments is that you are presenting facts that no one is disputing, then linking them, poorly, to the actual argument people are having.

Jones does not have to take the fight /= Jones should not take the fight.
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:35 AM   #17 (permalink)
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@killua

I have no issues with folks giving their opinions as well. But I do have an issue when it comes to blatantly hating on fighters that risk their safety for us fans. I find that disrespectful and immature.

Also, I am presenting the facts to provide a clear picture that this issue is much bigger than Jones. As you highlighted, there have been many threads about this and it is getting annoying. Many of them have been filled with Jones bashing. If you want to try and simplify my argument, without providing reasoning...well, you have that right. However, I feel I provided a more in-depth argument than making the error of > "Jones does not have to take the fight /= Jones should not take the fight".
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:58 AM   #18 (permalink)
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I dunno. I think the majority of those complaining, including myself, are just simply disappointed that Bones didn't take the fight.

I don't consider Jones at fault for the card being cancelled at all. That's not his responsibility.

But damn it... he had a chance to shut Chael Sonnen up and refused. Only reason I can think of is he was worried he might lose. This is what's disappointing more then anything.
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:59 AM   #19 (permalink)
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1 - nothing in here is 'new' information, its all stuff that could go in one of the other jones threads.

2 - Opinions, passed off as facts, are still just opinions.

Thread closed.
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