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Old 08-29-2012, 05:33 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jonnyg4508 View Post
Sonnen had a hard cut to 185 the last 2 or 3 fights he had there. He is now going at it at 205 and I'm sure he will bulk up a little bit. At what? 35 years old I doubt he makes the move back to 185 even if Anderson retired in a year. If the cut was hard then it will kill him after he bulks up for 205.

I agree with your other point.

Weidman doesn't deserve a shot and frankly Silva shouldn't be that excited for that fight. But if that is what the UFC wants to do next I'm sure Silva will be ok with destroying 1 more MW before he goes after GSP.

I'm sure the UFC is as excited for a Weidman shot as Silva is. Unless it is a real good card that main event won't get people buying the PPV.

I want Anderson back on free TV!
We heard he had a hard cut against Bisping but that was it. He has never said anything about having a bad cut other then that. He actually cut like 20 pounds in 1 day if i recall correctly when he fought Anderson the second time. That isnt someone who physically cant make the cut anymore. Sonnen will be able to make MW if he wants till his 40s atleast. He will just have to be more pro active about it.
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:32 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SideWays222 View Post
We heard he had a hard cut against Bisping but that was it. He has never said anything about having a bad cut other then that. He actually cut like 20 pounds in 1 day if i recall correctly when he fought Anderson the second time. That isnt someone who physically cant make the cut anymore. Sonnen will be able to make MW if he wants till his 40s atleast. He will just have to be more pro active about it.
Look at Hendo. He didn't look as good at 185 as he got closer to 40. And he is smaller than Chael in my eyes. He can still make 185, but he doesn't want too.

The bisping one was a bad cut. And the Anderson 2nd fight was. He was asked how much more he had to cut and he said around 20 and said "it isn't fun. But I won't miss weight." Sure he makes 185, but it hasn't been that easy lately.

As he gets older it can only get harder. It can only be harder after he bulks up for 205.

Sure if he wants to he may be able to go to 185. But are we going to see Chael vs. Maquardt and Okami or are we going to see Bisping Chael? I'd bet more like Bisping Chael. He can't be the 2nd best MW forever. He isn't a spring chicken.
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Old 08-30-2012, 01:20 AM   #43 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jonnyg4508 View Post
Look at Hendo. He didn't look as good at 185 as he got closer to 40. And he is smaller than Chael in my eyes. He can still make 185, but he doesn't want too.

The bisping one was a bad cut. And the Anderson 2nd fight was. He was asked how much more he had to cut and he said around 20 and said "it isn't fun. But I won't miss weight." Sure he makes 185, but it hasn't been that easy lately.

As he gets older it can only get harder. It can only be harder after he bulks up for 205.

Sure if he wants to he may be able to go to 185. But are we going to see Chael vs. Maquardt and Okami or are we going to see Bisping Chael? I'd bet more like Bisping Chael. He can't be the 2nd best MW forever. He isn't a spring chicken.
Everybody is different and whats going on with Henderson has absolutely zero relevance to Chael Sonnen. (But btw i should mention that even Henderson has said he would fight at MW if it was for the title.) So he is still capable of making that weight if the motivation is there.

Ofcourse he said it isnt fun. Cutting 20 pounds in 1 day is never fun. Hell cutting that in 2 weeks isnt fun. But he said that Dolce said they are right on track and that he believes him and no matter what he will make weight so it isnt an issue. And why Dolce set it up that way is because he believes 1 day of "no fun" is better then 2 weeks of no fun. Hell 2 days before the fight Dolce said Chael had Popcorn chicken or Shrimp Chicken or something like that for lunch. So Chael will certainly be able to make weight for a long time if he can still at 35 get rid of 20 pounds in 1 night.

Well Bisping has ALWAYS been known for having great TDD.

I dont know what kind of Sonnen we will see and its hard to comment on that since he WORKED Stann, had a bad showing against Bisping who is a bad style for Sonnen (And Chael confirmed he actually had a bad weight cut that time around) AND then he fought Anderson which its pretty normal to lose to Anderson.

So i cant confirm if the Chael that fought Okami or Nate ever left or vice versa.

But i do know that if Anderson retires within the next 2-3 years that Chael would still be capable of making weight for 185. Its just science. Ofcourse considering that Chaels next couple years arnt riddled with injuries especially to the knees.
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Old 08-30-2012, 07:32 AM   #44 (permalink)
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What? They're not in MMA?

Hector Lombard? The same Hector Lombard who just threw a dud in his debut? Tim Boestch would be a much better fight, considering you know...he beat Lombard.

Rich Franklin? Washed up, not a contender anymore, it would look like a repeat of Griffin/Franklin.

Stann? I'm guessing you obviously haven't followed Weidman's career, well let me educate you, as a purple belt at the 2009 ADCC this guy went to points with Andre Galvao. I'm pretty sure he'd have no problem handling Stann on the ground, if Chael can sub him, you best believe Weidman can.

And Bisping? Well, this guy's never done anything ever to warrant a top ten ranking or title discussion. Same with Alan Belcher, just because he beat the grossly overrated Rousimar Palhares doesn't mean he's a contender. Palhares has always sucked.

And Vitor Belfort....whose he beat again at 185?
I was going for an exagurated "Not in the same league" thing haha.

Lombard was horrible in his last fight. But regardless of what I think of Weidman, beating Lombard when he's on his game is a massive achievement and directly warrents a title shot.

Franklin is still a contender. I obv think Weidman would beat him but it's a legit guy to get a win over. I agree though, would mimick Forrest/Franklin.

I couldn't give a fuk who Weidman beat in NDAA or NCAA or amatuer wrestling or whatever. Did he take many punches to the face during that fight? This is MMA. Pretty sure Stann clowns Anderson Silva in a wrestling match.

Bisping is still a very good fighter. He can strike with anyone really, and he showed a much better wrestling and grappling game than Anderson did against Sonnen.

Belfort beats anyone else at MW b/s AS

You're getting me wrong. I didn't say that Weidman doesn't win these fights. I just think that he's never beat anyone with any massive relevence. All of these guys would bring forward legitimate title contender wins.

Man, Weidman has some serious dickriders if people are willing to step on Belfort to get him over. How about he has more impressive fights before people start sucking him off.
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Old 08-30-2012, 07:39 AM   #45 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by TheLyotoLegion View Post
Cain Velasquez at 8-0 won the Heavyweight title, so will you and everyone else please stop bringing up experience? It's pretty obvious it doesn't matter if he's 9-0, outside of one fight he took on 11 days notice when he cut 32 pounds he's dominated everyone he's fought and he's finished everyone he's had a proper training camp for. Anyone who has seen his fights besides the Maia one knows he's a special talent and is the best fight for Anderson at 185.

I'm convinced half of this forum hasn't even seen Weidman fight yet and if they have, it's the Maia fight which isn't indicative of his true ability at all.
I'm a huge Cain fan but he fought through a relatively shallow HW division. He appeared an absolute monster and obviously beat Brock Lesnar (and whether you're a fan or not of Lesnar, we all know he was very fortunate to ever find himself heavyweight champion) and then Cain would go on to face real competition w/JDS and get knocked out in seconds. Maybe a bit of a freak contest but still.
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Old 08-30-2012, 07:59 AM   #46 (permalink)
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I'm a huge Cain fan but he fought through a relatively shallow HW division. He appeared an absolute monster and obviously beat Brock Lesnar (and whether you're a fan or not of Lesnar, we all know he was very fortunate to ever find himself heavyweight champion) and then Cain would go on to face real competition w/JDS and get knocked out in seconds. Maybe a bit of a freak contest but still.
I hate seeing this about Lesnar.

Min-Soo Kim (Throwaway first MMA fight)
Frank Mir (Former UFC Champion)
Heath Herring (Pride legend and former title challenger)
Randy Couture (Hall of Famer and Current UFC Champion. Coming off a FOTN and a FOTY)
Frank Mir (Interim UFC Champion)
Shane Carwin (12-0, Interim UFC Champion, 12 first round finishes)


I mean, that's his first 6 MMA fights. I challenge anyone to give me a better 6 consecutive opponents, let alone a better FIRST 6 opponents. 3 of those fights were against current [interim] champions. He lost by submission to a guy (in his prime) who when he was out of his prime submitted Noguieria.

Lesnar always had multiple massive holes in his game, and the guy couldnt take a hit at all, but you can't say he didn't rise to the occasion. He was given a bullshit title shot at 2-1, and proved that he deserved it by winning it, avenging his only loss and beating a dude who's knocked out all 12 of his opponents in seconds. Lesnar deserves respect for it.
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Old 08-30-2012, 08:09 AM   #47 (permalink)
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I hate seeing this about Lesnar.

Min-Soo Kim (Throwaway first MMA fight)
Frank Mir (Former UFC Champion)
Heath Herring (Pride legend and former title challenger)
Randy Couture (Hall of Famer and Current UFC Champion. Coming off a FOTN and a FOTY)
Frank Mir (Interim UFC Champion)
Shane Carwin (12-0, Interim UFC Champion, 12 first round finishes)


I mean, that's his first 6 MMA fights. I challenge anyone to give me a better 6 consecutive opponents, let alone a better FIRST 6 opponents. 3 of those fights were against current [interim] champions. He lost by submission to a guy (in his prime) who when he was out of his prime submitted Noguieria.

Lesnar always had multiple massive holes in his game, and the guy couldnt take a hit at all, but you can't say he didn't rise to the occasion. He was given a bullshit title shot at 2-1, and proved that he deserved it by winning it, avenging his only loss and beating a dude who's knocked out all 12 of his opponents in seconds. Lesnar deserves respect for it.
Frank mir
Heath Herring
Randy Couture
Frank Mir
Shane Carwin

Akiyamas 5 fights in a row.

Alan Belcher
Chris Leben
Michael Bisping
Vitor Belfort
Jake Shields


Akiyama had a tough run too. Depending how you look at it either one can be more impressive. Todays times Akiyamas opponents are surely having better careers then Lesnars. But i guess you have to look each opponent at the time they fought one another.

But one big difference is

Brock was successful with his run. Akiyama on the other hand lost more of those fights then he won. I think the only fight he won was against Belcher which i think if they fought now Belcher would take the win home with a finish.
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Old 08-30-2012, 08:27 AM   #48 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SideWays222 View Post
Frank mir
Heath Herring
Randy Couture
Frank Mir
Shane Carwin

Akiyamas 5 fights in a row.

Alan Belcher
Chris Leben
Michael Bisping
Vitor Belfort
Jake Shields


Akiyama had a tough run too. Depending how you look at it either one can be more impressive. Todays times Akiyamas opponents are surely having better careers then Lesnars. But i guess you have to look each opponent at the time they fought one another.

But one big difference is

Brock was successful with his run. Akiyama on the other hand lost more of those fights then he won. I think the only fight he won was against Belcher which i think if they fought now Belcher would take the win home with a finish.
Yeah I knew making the challenge of "With 5/6 wins" would be unfair haha.

Doing the brackets thing I did

Alan Belcher (5-3 in UFC)
Chirs Leben (Complete warrior, but never a contender)
Michael Bisping (Mixed success, since has become somewhat a contender)
Vitor Belfort (UFC and Pride legend. Former UFC Tournament winner and Champion).
Jake Shields (Former Strikeforce Champion. 2 Loss Streak)


I would still rank Brock's a lot higher because his fights were all surrounding championships. But that was a hard ass run for Akiyama I didn't know of...
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Old 08-30-2012, 08:28 AM   #49 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SideWays222 View Post
Frank mir
Heath Herring
Randy Couture
Frank Mir
Shane Carwin

Akiyamas 5 fights in a row.

Alan Belcher
Chris Leben
Michael Bisping
Vitor Belfort
Jake Shields
Gotta remember though, that those were Brocks first fights in MMA! A baptism of fire if ever there was one. Not to mention his next 2 fights being against Cain and Overeem. No wonder he quit!
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Old 08-30-2012, 08:37 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Gotta remember though, that those were Brocks first fights in MMA! A baptism of fire if ever there was one. Not to mention his next 2 fights being against Cain and Overeem. No wonder he quit!
Yeah I cut out the 5/6 wins and the first 6 fights to make it a fair challenge for someone to step up to lmao.

And yeah, Cain and Overeem to follow up? Insane. I left them out because thats when he went down, but if you count Akiyama's losses, you have to add in two of the best HWs ever to cap it off.
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