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Old 09-28-2012, 05:16 PM   #41 (permalink)

 
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Originally Posted by ClydebankBlitz View Post
I mean I was never a huge Guida fan, but I liked the guy and that fight kind of changed it for me. I only really liked him because of how he faught. If Chris Leben developed great wrestler and lay and prayed on his next opponent, I'd be disappointed like fuk. Like Guida, he's not a dominant fighter, but the reason to like them is because they were come forward wildmen who didnt seem to care about winning or losing, as long as they go to war every time. I suppose it can get to a fight and they might want to change it and finally become championship material, but when they make that decision they know that fans will be turned off from them. By your logic I should still be a big Tim Sylvia fan.

EDIT: There was a small chance that Diaz would be able to avoid being taken down and battered GSP on the feet. He at least had a huge advantage in the stand up and there was a tiny tiny possibility of a submission. Condit doesnt really have anything for GSP which is why the other fight looked more intriguing. I found it boring because no one got hurt. Diaz couldnt have cared less about the leg kicks or even the head kick. He was literally begging for more. Condit only got hit like 6 times in total with like two moments against the cage. Not enough action all round to me so I would consider the fight boring. Condit didnt show the stand up skills which he posseses in that one.
Time Sylvia had many bad fights not one, you give the guy the benefit of the doubt after one.

Diaz had no chance, his striking is overrated and lacks one punch power and he has little to no TD defense. The days of winning at the elite level off your back are virtually dead (unless your fighting Sonnen). Condit is the more unpredictable versatile striker and has a far greater chance of landing some kind of crazy flash knock out which is virtually the only chance either Diaz or Condit has.
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There in lies the difference.

Some people saw Guida as a REAL exciting guy. Some people like myself found him vastly overrated and more just a ball of energy rather than watching great skill out there. I never found his bouncing around style all that exciting. He moves alot, he throws a lot, he lands little. He beats up on crappy fighters. He usually gets tore up by good fighters. He sat on Pettis for a win. He ran away from Mayanrd in a loss.

I'm not saying all of his fights sucks. He has been in a couple real good ones. But not all people share the same view that his fights were breath taking before his last fight.

Opinions are fine. But don't assume everyone shares or shared yours.
I am not assuming everyone liked Guida before, I realize he had his haters before (everyone does) but find another person who openly admits to being a fan now. His bandwagon couldn't have gotten much emptier. Those who turned on him after one bad fight should be ashamed.
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:17 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ClydebankBlitz View Post
Surprisingly, I always found his stand up to be boring and his relentless wrestling to be exciting. I think his FOTY's don't really match up to some others but he was deinfntly someone I would be looking forward to watching, and to a slight degree I still do.
Yea, it is funny that in all of his FOTN's he lost. Or in the Nate Diaz fight he won by split, a fight I think he should have lost. When he gets beat up by an exciting fighter (Huerta, Diaz, Sanchez) he gets FOTN.
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:25 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Toxic View Post
Time Sylvia had many bad fights not one, you give the guy the benefit of the doubt after one.

Diaz had no chance, his striking is overrated and lacks one punch power and he has little to no TD defense. The days of winning at the elite level off your back are virtually dead (unless your fighting Sonnen). Condit is the more unpredictable versatile striker and has a far greater chance of landing some kind of crazy flash knock out which is virtually the only chance either Diaz or Condit has.
Saying Diaz has overrated striking is ridiculous. In the other thread you're trying to convince me that BJ Penn is one of the greatest yet Diaz absolutley smashed his face in with ease.

I agree with the off his back stuff, but anyone can pull a lucky submission off. The key thing was GSP's sub defence so I kind of ruled that out before the fight myself. He wouldnt be the favourite but there was a chance that he could have used his striking to keep enough distance and eventually beat GSP into submission (metaphorically of course?). To me, Condit is going to be relying too much on that "one punch KO" and is just going to get put on his back. He will try to sweep but GSP is one of the greatest for a reason. GSP will lay and pray to take all 5 rounds easily.

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Yea, it is funny that in all of his FOTN's he lost. Or in the Nate Diaz fight he won by split, a fight I think he should have lost. When he gets beat up by an exciting fighter (Huerta, Diaz, Sanchez) he gets FOTN.
Thats kind of why I liked Guida. He was a come forward go down swinging kind of guy. When he didnt do that against Gray, I felt let down you know.
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:26 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Toxic View Post
Time Sylvia had many bad fights not one, you give the guy the benefit of the doubt after one.

Diaz had no chance, his striking is overrated and lacks one punch power and he has little to no TD defense. The days of winning at the elite level off your back are virtually dead (unless your fighting Sonnen). Condit is the more unpredictable versatile striker and has a far greater chance of landing some kind of crazy flash knock out which is virtually the only chance either Diaz or Condit has.


I am not assuming everyone liked Guida before, I realize he had his haters before (everyone does) but find another person who openly admits to being a fan now. His bandwagon couldn't have gotten much emptier. Those who turned on him after one bad fight should be ashamed.
I don't agree that Condit has a better chance. Diaz has much better BJJ. Has more cardio. Has better hands. Condit's TDD is JUST AS BAD as Nick's, but he has much less skill off his back. Nick could also get in GSP's head a little, where Condit won't. I think Nick has a WAY better chance than Condit. But again, opinons...

The term "haters" is such a dumb fad. It is so over-used and cheesy. Anytime a guy disagrees with a person or just doesn't care for them they are called "haters".

"this is for my haters"

What haters? People can't accept that someone doesn't like them so they call them a "hater". Such a cheesy phrase.

You won't find many now beause people don't find it noble or respectful to try and steal a fight. Same with Condit. People don't care for guys who go out and try to cheat the system. Make it look like you are doing a lot and really be doing nothing. People don't find that respectable. People who loved Guida loved him for being tough and relentless. Not afraid and going backwards.

Why does Diaz have a legend of fans even if he messes up? But guys liek Condit and Guida lost so many fans because of 1 fight? Because Diaz is real and not into the points game. He isn't trying to fool judges. He is trying to fight you and beat you.

The general public isn't as stupid as many think. They understand the difference between a competitor and a fighter. And they generally respect fighters more.
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:32 PM   #45 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jonnyg4508 View Post
Why does Diaz have a legend of fans even if he messes up? But guys liek Condit and Guida lost so many fans because of 1 fight? Because Diaz is real and not into the points game. He isn't trying to fool judges. He is trying to fight you and beat you.
This is how I was trying to put stuff.

Nick Diaz, Nate Diaz, Chris Leben, Stephan Bonnar, Wanderlei Silva, Big Nog etc.

These guys will always have fans because they go out there and do what they always will. There is a difference between adapting and becoming a different fighter. Nog might look to strike with Mir but look to sub Lesnar, but regardless, it's still going to be Nog. I respect a guy that loses and stays the fighter I always liked than someone who wins and becomes a different and less entertaining fighter.
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Old 09-28-2012, 06:52 PM   #46 (permalink)

 
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Originally Posted by ClydebankBlitz View Post
Saying Diaz has overrated striking is ridiculous. In the other thread you're trying to convince me that BJ Penn is one of the greatest yet Diaz absolutley smashed his face in with ease.

I agree with the off his back stuff, but anyone can pull a lucky submission off. The key thing was GSP's sub defence so I kind of ruled that out before the fight myself. He wouldnt be the favourite but there was a chance that he could have used his striking to keep enough distance and eventually beat GSP into submission (metaphorically of course?). To me, Condit is going to be relying too much on that "one punch KO" and is just going to get put on his back. He will try to sweep but GSP is one of the greatest for a reason. GSP will lay and pray to take all 5 rounds easily.



Thats kind of why I liked Guida. He was a come forward go down swinging kind of guy. When he didnt do that against Gray, I felt let down you know.
Diaz only beat Penb cause Penn showed up out of shape. The first round when they were fresh Penn was clearly the better fighter in every facet of mma For all Diazs fighter vs athlete talk Diaz only beat BJ because he was the more conditioned athlete.


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Old 09-28-2012, 06:56 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Diaz only beat Penb cause Penn showed up out of shape. The first round when they were fresh Penn was clearly the better fighter in every facet of mma For all Diazs fighter vs athlete talk Diaz only beat BJ because he was the more conditioned athlete.


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Old 09-28-2012, 07:00 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Diaz only beat Penb cause Penn showed up out of shape. The first round when they were fresh Penn was clearly the better fighter in every facet of mma For all Diazs fighter vs athlete talk Diaz only beat BJ because he was the more conditioned athlete.


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When does Penn show up in shape?

He lit Penn up for 2 out of 3 rounds. He took Penn's best shot and didn't flinch much. He TAUNTED Penn and put his hands down!

Hahahaha, I like Penn, but his huge fans are funny as hell.

Diaz beat him beause he is the better MMA fighter at the point when they fought. His striking is VERY goood. It is GREAT when if you factor in chin and recovery. Diaz tuned Penn into a bloody mess in a 3 round fight. Diaz is the best striker Penn has fought since Machida.

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Old 09-28-2012, 07:06 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Nah but forreal Penn was going to KO Diaz if the referee wasn't bised and the bell didnt ring a few seconds too early and Dana White wasnt cheating and the weather was better and Diaz hadnt been high and his face could withstand the punches better and the cage was a bit smaller and the floor was more spongey and Shandella wasnt at ringside.

Penn beat Diaz!
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Old 09-28-2012, 07:09 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Nah but forreal Penn was going to KO Diaz if the referee wasn't bised and the bell didnt ring a few seconds too early and Dana White wasnt cheating and the weather was better and Diaz hadnt been high and his face could withstand the punches better and the cage was a bit smaller and the floor was more spongey and Shandella wasnt at ringside.

Penn beat Diaz!
What does any of this absolutely retarded spiel have to do with Guida dropping to FW?
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