Lyoto Machida: "Jon Jones Has Big Holes in His Game" - Page 2 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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Old 09-30-2012, 01:47 PM   #11 (permalink)
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There's no shame in admitting that Anderson Silva has sub-par take down defence. He more than makes up for it with a great submission game. To act as though Chael Sonnen is the only man to take Anderson down and control him from the top is inaccurate. Henderson, Lutter, and to a lesser extent, Okami all managed the same. People who work to take Anderson down are likely to be successful. Whether or not they get submitted is another story.
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Old 09-30-2012, 01:48 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I don't see any noticeable flaw on Anderson's game, I see a noticeable worst part among other superb parts in his game. If we both agree we are speaking about his wrestling, it's not a flaw to be under Chael Sonnen for your whole life. Everybody stays under Sonnen... It's to compare the worst of Anderson with the best of Sonnen.






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His TDD in general is pretty bad, as seen in thhe Hendo and Lutter fights aswell. It's the key stand out weakness for him, but unless you have the ground skills of say Sonnen or GSP you won't be able to hold him on the ground long enough for it to be a big moment.

EDIT: Pretty much what Canadian Psycho said, although it's well seen that I don't rate his submissions quite as highly.
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Old 09-30-2012, 01:49 PM   #13 (permalink)
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You mean the hole Jones' arm formed that your head fit nicely into when he choked you into unconsciousness with that standing guillotine? That hole??
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:08 PM   #14 (permalink)
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He covers his deficiencies well therefore nobody has been able to truly exploit it with finality.

Machida won the battle standing. Then his opponent adapted in the second round and changed the course of the fight instantly.

Rashad has t-rex arms in comparison to Stretch Armstrong so he kept it standing the entire five rounds.

Rampage got toyed with. Actually won money on this fight. Anyone who knew the fight game knew he was cannon fodder. Probably had the least chance of winning. Simply way too slow.

Shogun if he practiced the heel hook/ankle locks may have been able to put em in danger.
*His (LHW title holder) entire leg is a weakness. One chopping leg to the thigh/knee area could hurt em and catch his attention. That is why he constantly uses leg kicks because he doesn't want to get hit there although it's very easy for him to grab it and land a takedown.

It takes a fearless fighter with massive amount of confidence (beginning and end) to defeat the current LHW title holder. I'm enjoying this because he is the final boss character that you meet in every video game. Think Tyson's Punch Out or Shao Khan.

For now I say Cormier and "maybe" Lyoto or Shogun because he never loses a rematch.
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:09 PM   #15 (permalink)
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...Actually they aren't big holes. Bones is starting master and control his distance, reach & timing. Not to mention his unstoppable ground n' pound. Jon over-commits with his spinning elbows and all but maintains the distance control and sticks to the gameplan. You get inside, Jon rips elbows. He's faced a little adversity and pulled through. Vitor's wicked armbar and Lyoto's bodykick is about it. Jon's frontleg sidekicks are wicked. They have a nice snap on them. Great technique. More effective and powerful than Machida's. Lyoto must have forgotten about eating his own medicine by getting dropped with a big straight left by Jones. That was the beginning of a quick end for Lyoto. Once Bones is in top position, he is so completely dominant. His slicing elbows and punches have so much leverage. Trying to figure out those holes is the question of the day.

Food for thought: Since leverage is one of Jon's key attributes, I bet if Stephan Struve locked in a super-tight armbar like Vitor did, Jon would have been submitted.
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:16 PM   #16 (permalink)
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^I said the same thing in another thread about a fight with Struve. If Struve locked in that armbar, the fight would have been over. People are saying Vitor let go of the hold but it was simple enough that Jones just managed to lift him and get out of the hold using his reach well. Struve's big ass legs would have kept it on, and then you have the fact that Struve would have attacked MUCH more.

Jones said he is now doing BJJ so he might patch that up, but right this second his biggest gap is def his sub defence and how much he engages against a submission guy on the ground. Can Machida even do anything to utilize that?
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:10 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Yeah Lyoto, Bones getting caught in an unforeseen sub from a guy who has never shown an interest in being a submission artist is a HUGE HOLE! Or, it was a fluke that nobody could have expected?

Anyways, Bones is a freak of nature, so I don't think he'll be getting caught like that again. And to whoever still thinks Machida won a round, only 1 judge agrees, while 2 thought Bones won, so BONES WON THE ROUND!!![IMG] Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/IMG]
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:10 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canadian Psycho View Post
There's no shame in admitting that Anderson Silva has sub-par take down defence. He more than makes up for it with a great submission game. To act as though Chael Sonnen is the only man to take Anderson down and control him from the top is inaccurate. Henderson, Lutter, and to a lesser extent, Okami all managed the same. People who work to take Anderson down are likely to be successful. Whether or not they get submitted is another story.
He doesn't have subpar takedown defense he has above average takedown defense. Chael is basically the only guy who got at least half of his shots on Andy almost everyone else only got him down off of flying knees. Okami, Maia, and Marquardt all had a lot of trouble getting him to the ground.
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Old 09-30-2012, 05:49 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by duckyou666 View Post
Yeah Lyoto, Bones getting caught in an unforeseen sub from a guy who has never shown an interest in being a submission artist is a HUGE HOLE! Or, it was a fluke that nobody could have expected?

Anyways, Bones is a freak of nature, so I don't think he'll be getting caught like that again. And to whoever still thinks Machida won a round, only 1 judge agrees, while 2 thought Bones won, so BONES WON THE ROUND!!!
Just because the judges think so doesn't mean it really happened.

Plus the guy who filled in that form doesn't even know how to spell guillotine.
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Old 09-30-2012, 05:57 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Yeah Lyoto, Bones getting caught in an unforeseen sub from a guy who has never shown an interest in being a submission artist is a HUGE HOLE! Or, it was a fluke that nobody could have expected?
Vitor pulled guard so it was pretty obvious he was going to go for a sub. Jones engaged and got caught. That's a pretty big hole and against a better submissionist he might not have been able to avoid it as well. Vitor also didnt continue the attacks. He tried to "hide" the sub instead of threatening with it and thats why he got beat so badly. Against a high level submission fighter Jones probably would have got caught again.

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He doesn't have subpar takedown defense he has above average takedown defense. Chael is basically the only guy who got at least half of his shots on Andy almost everyone else only got him down off of flying knees. Okami, Maia, and Marquardt all had a lot of trouble getting him to the ground.
I disagree. To me, everyone who's really went for a takedown on him got it. Lutter and Hendo didnt have any issues getting him down there. Anderson only showed decent TDD in the second round of the Sonnen fight to me.

This is like his submission game to me. If you say Anderson has a weakness, someone is quick to jump up and say he doesnt. Anderson has pretty weak TDD and isn't great off his back. He's still the greatest of all time.
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