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Old 11-21-2012, 11:09 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jonnyg4508 View Post
What exactly is GSP going to do when he advanaces position anyway? GnP him out? No. Sub him? No. I mean that would actually be a good gameplan for SIlva if he does get taken down. Let GSP advanace and maybe even go for a sub and it gives Silva room to get up. Instead of sitting in guard all fight. I think Anderson will just engolf GSP with his elite guard defense.

Anderson would play around with GSP because he would even be less worried about a devistating shot or sub than more guys.
I disagree but would like to hear exactly why you think this, elaborate please, and if thats the case, how would you suggest GSP go about his gameplan? Just curious.
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:19 AM   #32 (permalink)
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as evans said, it comes down to whether or not GSP's able to get through the striking and get it down to the mat. Silva is more than able to catch GSP on the way in with basically anything he fancies.

GSP, in all his bouts, has proven, if not superior striking (pretty much anyone), at least close enough to equivalent (Condit, to whom I'd probably give a good chance in a kickboxing match against GSP)

but I believe Silva's striking and timing is on a much higher level, they probably have the same kind of gap in wrestling, but to GSP's advantage.

the thing is, the bout starts standing.

if GPS steps up his striking (and we're talking hollywood-ish step, like big, big time), he may get a few opportunities to take it to the mat.

I think Silva didn't really mind going on the mat with Sonnen and didn't really respect his game that much, he just wanted to make a good show with his 1st round then get it over with, which he did.

GSP definitely has what it takes to control silva on the ground, I believe that firmly. But what would become his TD offense/timing against someone as unexpectable as Silva, he can punch, kick, elbow, knee, whatever he fancies from virtually any position and situation, and land exactly where he wants. I'm not sure GSP could read his game well enough to accurately time takedowns.

The only plan for GSP is to go for Sonnen's plan, but GSP's smaller and probably less strong too, maybe even too conservative to really take the chance. So there's a good chance to see a frozen GSP here too.

if GSP can take AS down, he can take the fight home with an UD, we may even see silva breaking, GSP will play it safe for sure, this coming from a GSP huge fan.
if he can't, he'll get KO'd or TKO'd in the early rounds.

he should fight hendricks first, just to get some more octagon time (all hendricks has is a puncher's chance, but GSP will be ready for it all day)
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:23 AM   #33 (permalink)
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I disagree but would like to hear exactly why you think this, elaborate please, and if thats the case, how would you suggest GSP go about his gameplan? Just curious.
Its never the best idea to just let fighters advanace position. But fighters all the time open up doors for sub attempts, just so they have room to get up or counter. GSP even said that is what Condit was doing, almost baiting him into trying to sub him.

I just think it may be a go to plan if it comes down to it. Better to lose that way then have a guy sit in guard and get "top points" and win a decision.

But this is all being said from my point of view. And I don't see GSP as a threat to finish Anderson at all. No matter how long he is on top or what positions he moves too. Side, full mount, north south. Some people may think he has a better shot at finishing than I do.

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Old 11-21-2012, 11:31 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jonnyg4508 View Post
Its never the best idea to just let fighters advanace position. But fighters all the time open up doors for sub attempts, just so they have room to get up or counter. GSP even said that is what Condit was doing, almost baiting him into trying to sub him.

I just think it may be a go to plan if it comes down to it. Better to lose that way then have a guy sit in guard and get "top points" and win a decision.

But this is all being said from my point of view. And I don't see GSP as a threat to finish Anderson at all. No matter how long he is on top or what positions he moves too. Side, full mount, north south. Some people may think he has a better shot at finishing than I do.
I see what you mean. It would probably make the fight more excting too! But surely the closed guard is the best way to get a sub off your back. So wouldn't Silva try to stop GSP passing guard? The only reason Anderson would allow GSp to pass guard would be so he can scramble. OK hes got more of a chance finishing the fight onhis feet, obviously, but is he not more vulnerable to takedowns? Thus giving GSP more points? I think Silva should just try to avoid the takedown and KO GSP. Condit connected so I'm sure The Spider can find a way.
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:32 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by PheelGoodInc View Post
I've held this opinion for along time. I still do. I think GSP wipes the floor with Silva... regardless of the size difference.

It's not a matter of fighter preference. It's a style matchup. GSP has the wrestling, sub defense, and cardio to win the fight.
You sound more confident than GSP himself.
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:39 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jonnyg4508 View Post
You are right Maia wouldn't toss GSP around like that. But you have to ask why he was able to do that when Chael is a real good wrestler none the less?

My reason is because Chael isn't going for a TD or going forward. He was afraid to to death to be on the ground. So weakly clinched. He probably thought Maia was going to pull guard. That TD is more or less a matter of Chael not being ready for it and sucking so bad on the ground.

GSP would never get tossed like that because in a clinch he would be dropping down for a TD. He isn't as afraid. Who knows though, in that same scenario perahps GSP would get tossed. He hasn't fought a guy like Maia was back then...a guy looking for subs and one of the best at doing it from his back and all areas. BJ was a top guy. Shields was a top guy and more a position wrestler/BJJ. Condit was never going to pull guard or do anything too nuts. When you are in the clinch as a wrestler and are hesitant to use your bread and butter for fear of the ground...you tend to get owned.

1 time getting taken down like that vs. an odd fighter like Maia shouldn't automatically mean he isn't an elite wrestler.

I didn't say he wasn't an elite wrestler - he is - I said that there is no way he is the very best wrestler in the game.

Not just that take down alone, but I also referenced the Michael Bisping fight, where for the majority of the fight Bisping was actually pressing Chael up against the fence and controlling him there. You think GSP would allow that? GSP would take a guy like Michael Bisping down at will and hold him there.

Not only that, but the statistics also don't work in Chaels favour. Sonnen has a 59 percent take down success rate and a 71 percent defense rate. In comparison to GSP who completes 78 percent of his take downs and has an 88 percent take down defense percentage. Quite a significant difference there. Official UFC statistics:
http://uk.ufc.com/fighter/chael-Sonnen
http://uk.ufc.com/fighter/georges-St-Pierre

The best MMA wrestlers in the game are GSP and Jon Jones. Whilst Chael Sonnen is certainly an elite wrestler, he's not even close to being the very best, there's a big difference. He's probably top five though.

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Old 11-21-2012, 11:47 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by GrappleRetarded View Post
I didn't say he wasn't an elite wrestler - he is - I said that there is no way he is the very best wrestler in the game.

Not just that take down alone, but I also referenced the Michael Bisping fight, where for the majority of the fight Bisping was actually pressing Chael up against the fence and controlling him there. You think GSP would allow that? GSP would take a guy like Michael Bisping down at will and hold him there.

Not only that, but the statistics also don't work in Chaels favour. Sonnen has a 59 percent take down success rate and a 71 percent defense rate. In comparison to GSP who completes 78 percent of his take downs and has an 88 percent take down defense percentage. Quite a significant difference there. Official UFC statistics:
http://uk.ufc.com/fighter/chael-Sonnen
http://uk.ufc.com/fighter/georges-St-Pierre

The best MMA wrestlers in the game are GSP and Jon Jones. Whilst Chael Sonnen is certainly an elite wrestler, he's not even close to being the very best, there's a big difference. He's probably top five though.
Bit of a contrdiction there. I do agree with what you're saying though. Considering you provided a citation of your facts kind of makes it difficult to disagree.
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:52 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tyson Fury View Post
Bit of a contrdiction there. I do agree with what you're saying though. Considering you provided a citation of your facts kind of makes it difficult to disagree.
There is quite a big gap from the creme de la creme (gsp, jon jones) and the rest of the wrestlers, even the guys in the top five. Chael Sonnen is top five, but I feel that the likes of GSP and Jon Jones are on a a completely different level.

For example look at Anderson Silva and the rest of the top five MW's. Those guys might be top five, but Anderson is still way, way ahead of them in terms of skill.
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:59 AM   #39 (permalink)
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There is quite a big gap from the creme de la creme (gsp, jon jones) and the rest of the wrestlers, even the guys in the top five. Chael Sonnen is top five, but I feel that the likes of GSP and Jon Jones are on a a completely different level.

For example look at Anderson Silva and the rest of the top five MW's. Those guys might be top five, but Anderson is still way, way ahead of them in terms of skill.
Well put and I understand. I knew what you meant I just thought it looked kinda funny. And yeah I'm with you 100% Same would apply to Maia his Jitz.
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Old 11-21-2012, 12:33 PM   #40 (permalink)
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I see what you mean. It would probably make the fight more excting too! But surely the closed guard is the best way to get a sub off your back. So wouldn't Silva try to stop GSP passing guard? The only reason Anderson would allow GSp to pass guard would be so he can scramble. OK hes got more of a chance finishing the fight onhis feet, obviously, but is he not more vulnerable to takedowns? Thus giving GSP more points? I think Silva should just try to avoid the takedown and KO GSP. Condit connected so I'm sure The Spider can find a way.
Well depends if he wants to try and sub him or if he wants to get back up. I too think he can tie GSP up well from guard and that can be a way he can get it standing anyway. I think he can sub GSP, it will be the strongest wrist control GSP has ever dealt with. He didn't go down to the ground with Shields. It would definatly be the best guard he has been in, especially with ANderson's length.

Sure, he should definatly try to avoid the TD that should be plan A. But like I said, if it comes down to it where he isn't subbing GSP and GSP is just in guard...then I would let GSP get confident by giving up position in order to look for a counter.

ANderson could attack this fight in many ways and has many aspects that he can exploit or challenge. GSP basically has 1 or 2 ways. Wrestling/keeping him there. Or if Anderson gasses from the weight cut he could cruise the 2nd half of the fight.
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