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the bad guy 13 · 12-01-2012, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liddellianenko

JDS would knock Jones out cold. Jones' 84 inch reach didn't get him saved from Rashad and Machida, his chin came into play. JDS is the smasher of chins though.

ummm, yes it did. they only both got a good shot on jones through out the whole match. two of the fastest lhw werent able to really mount any offense on jj and while jds is fast hes not as fast as jj, also jon jones has great stand up defense, while jds is very hittable.

the bad guy 13 · 12-01-2012, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWoods

Alright a few points to address here.

1) To call JDS slow is idiotic. He is probably one of the, if not the, fastest heavyweight fighter in the UFC. His footwork is excellent and his hands are second to none. They are major reasons why he could dominate power punchers like Shane Carwin and Roy Nelson, simply because the he could hit them and get away before they could hit back.

2) Jon Jones is one of the least mobile fighters at LHW, mostly because he relies on having both a height and reach advantage in his fights. Against JDS he would still have reach (84 vs 77 inches) but both fighters are 6'4" meaning the extra force behind Bones' punches (from throwing down at his shorter opponents) is gone.

3) If you think Bones' reach advantage is going to play some huge benefit to him lets recall how JDS destroyed Stefan Struve. Not only does Struve have a longer reach than Jones, but he is also 7 foot tall. Junior made that fight look easy, getting within range and chopping the big man down in about a minute. Also, both Frank Mir and Shane Carwin had longer reaches than Junior but he managed to make those fights look easy.

4) Jones kicks are more annoying than effective. Rampage is simply an idiot and has almost never checked a kick in his career, so posting a bunch of pictures of Jones kicking him in the knees and hips isn't going to prove anything. Well, I'm wrong, it proves that Rampage can't defend kicks, but nothing else. Look, I can post pictures too!

Stop posting idiotic threads. Thanks

okay fist of all you are just a hater. sencond while jds is fast he probably will be at a slight speed disadvantage against jones. third struve does not have a longer reach(83) than jones(84.5) and struve although tall, is not a master of using his reach/range like JJ. jones would keep jds at bay with his jab and kicks to the knee.

endersshadow · 12-01-2012, 08:48 AM

I don't know.

The only advantages Jones has over JDS is his reach and diversity in attacks.

I think JDS is quicker with his attacks and has stronger attacks.

Who's stronger in the clinch? That, I'm not sure of.

You keep bringing up that Jones will keep JDS at bay with kicks and jabs.
I have a background in Tae Kwon Do, which is an art based on primarily on kicks. In TKD, we emphasize kicking with our feet, not our shin, to maximize the distance. Jones uses the same method frequently. Yes, he helps keep people at bay... especially people that lack experience in a kicking art. However, kicks are very easy to dodge, and IF your kick is dodged (and it just takes one), you leave yourself open for a very hard counter. With kicks, you commit yourself.

In regards to Jones keeping JDS at bay with jabs (like GSP vs Kosh?), JDS is a boxer before anything else. He will slip his way past the jabs and make Jones pay for extending his arm out.

That's just my two cents. I admit that I like JDS more than Jones, but I also just don't see Jones picking JDS apart like Jones did at LHW. If Jones takes it to the ground and uses grappling, that's a different story, one we don't see much with JDS.

**BWoods** · 12-01-2012, 08:53 AM

Struve's wikipedia article lists him at 84.5, the same reach as Jones

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stefan_Struve

It had been remeasured by the UFC on 5/24/12 and was reported by Ariel Helwani

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f2/ufc...reach-2099475/

I'm not going to even address your first (this is the correct spelling of first by the way kid) point. Since it's just your opinion. I could have wrote you off as a nut-dangler but oh well.

JDS not only leaps in and out of his striking but forms his gameplan around that ability. Also he has never gassed in a fight, meaning he could keep that pace up for 5 rounds. I don't know how you can say that Jones is going to have a speed advantage when he has never utilized a quick gameplan. Jon Jones forces his opponents back with his rangy kicks and takes the center of the cage.

The reason I say JDS has a speed advantage is because he fights fast. Jones fights tall. What will end up happening if you put those fighting styles together, well if they are the same height and JDS has experience against guys with the same length (something that NONE of Jones' opponents have had thus far) then things will end catastrophically for Jonny-boy. If 5'11" Rashad Evans could almost knock Jones out then what is a man his own size going to do?

JDS is much better at adjusting to his opponents gameplan than you give him credit for. Shogun, while I love him, always just does whatever comes naturally to him, meaning that he will often fall into bad habits and not follow a gameplan. Rampage doesn't gameplan, he just tries to throw big bombs. Lyoto really gave Jones a hard time and was winning the fight pretty nicely before he got too aggressive and was taken down.

Jones doesn't really use his jab as much as he could, he likes to use kicks as a range finder because he likes to keep as much range as possible. Also his hands are not nearly as good as people would like to imagine. He often leaves them low, something he can get away with because of his height and is a problem for a lot of tall fighters.

Just think about this... if Stefan Bonnar gave Jon Jones his hardest fight and was also 6'4" what do you think someone that is much bigger, much stronger, much faster, and much much more skilled will do? Even if JDS and Jones were physically identical I would pick JDS because of his fighting style and his abilities.

Then again why am I wasting my time trying to use rational and reasoning. You're a Jones fanboy and are pretty uneducated about the sport and about fighting in general. Not saying I'm the smartest guy in the world but it's enough for me to end this discussion here having said my piece.

**BWoods** · 12-01-2012, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the bad guy 13

ummm, yes it did. they only both got a good shot on jones through out the whole match. two of the fastest lhw werent able to really mount any offense on jj and while jds is fast hes not as fast as jj, also jon jones has great stand up defense, while jds is very hittable.

I had to come back for this one because it's such a stupid stupid statement for you to have made.

According to the official stats page of the UFC, www.fightmetric.com

The man with the second highest striking differential (strikes to opponents vs strikes taken) is Junior Dos Santos with a 4.78 strikes landed per strike taken. Sixth place on that list is Jon Jones at 2.48 strikes landed to strikes taken. Meaning that Junior DOUBLES Jones' productivity in terms of hitting his opponent and not getting hit. So not only is Junior a more difficult target to hit but he hits his opponents more than Jon Jones does.

Stop saying stupid things.

To the mods: sorry for the double post.

the bad guy 13 · 12-01-2012, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWoods

I had to come back for this one because it's such a stupid stupid statement for you to have made.

According to the official stats page of the UFC, www.fightmetric.com

The man with the second highest striking differential (strikes to opponents vs strikes taken) is Junior Dos Santos with a 4.78 strikes landed per strike taken. Sixth place on that list is Jon Jones at 2.48 strikes landed to strikes taken. Meaning that Junior DOUBLES Jones' productivity in terms of hitting his opponent and not getting hit. So not only is Junior a more difficult target to hit but he hits his opponents more than Jon Jones does.

Stop saying stupid things.

To the mods: sorry for the double post.

look at jds vs cro cop, nelson, carwin all got good shots on him

the bad guy 13 · 12-01-2012, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWoods

Struve's wikipedia article lists him at 84.5, the same reach as Jones

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stefan_Struve

It had been remeasured by the UFC on 5/24/12 and was reported by Ariel Helwani

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f2/ufc...reach-2099475/

I'm not going to even address your first (this is the correct spelling of first by the way kid) point. Since it's just your opinion. I could have wrote you off as a nut-dangler but oh well.

JDS not only leaps in and out of his striking but forms his gameplan around that ability. Also he has never gassed in a fight, meaning he could keep that pace up for 5 rounds. I don't know how you can say that Jones is going to have a speed advantage when he has never utilized a quick gameplan. Jon Jones forces his opponents back with his rangy kicks and takes the center of the cage.

The reason I say JDS has a speed advantage is because he fights fast. Jones fights tall. What will end up happening if you put those fighting styles together, well if they are the same height and JDS has experience against guys with the same length (something that NONE of Jones' opponents have had thus far) then things will end catastrophically for Jonny-boy. If 5'11" Rashad Evans could almost knock Jones out then what is a man his own size going to do?

JDS is much better at adjusting to his opponents gameplan than you give him credit for. Shogun, while I love him, always just does whatever comes naturally to him, meaning that he will often fall into bad habits and not follow a gameplan. Rampage doesn't gameplan, he just tries to throw big bombs. Lyoto really gave Jones a hard time and was winning the fight pretty nicely before he got too aggressive and was taken down.

Jones doesn't really use his jab as much as he could, he likes to use kicks as a range finder because he likes to keep as much range as possible. Also his hands are not nearly as good as people would like to imagine. He often leaves them low, something he can get away with because of his height and is a problem for a lot of tall fighters.

Just think about this... if Stefan Bonnar gave Jon Jones his hardest fight and was also 6'4" what do you think someone that is much bigger, much stronger, much faster, and much much more skilled will do? Even if JDS and Jones were physically identical I would pick JDS because of his fighting style and his abilities.

Then again why am I wasting my time trying to use rational and reasoning. You're a Jones fanboy and are pretty uneducated about the sport and about fighting in general. Not saying I'm the smartest guy in the world but it's enough for me to end this discussion here having said my piece.

umm jds never gassed? he gassed hard against nelson and was visibly slower in the latter rds agaisnt carwin, and rashad never "almost" ko'd jj, you just reaching now. also JJ was still very green against bonnar when they fought, if they were to fight again jj would finish bonnar in 1 rd.

rabakill · 12-01-2012, 09:28 AM

Junior would send him back to LHW, Junior has faced wrestlers, Junior has faced guys with really tall reach, Junior has faced kickboxers and destroyed them all with ease.

the bad guy 13 · 12-01-2012, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabakill

Junior would send him back to LHW, Junior has faced wrestlers, Junior has faced guys with really tall reach, Junior has faced kickboxers and destroyed them all with ease.

True, but he hasnt faced a wrestler that does it all. Kicks, punches, elbows, reach, submissions, while jds is very one dimensional with his striking. JJ would outstrike him from the outside using his jab and kicks to the knee never giving jds a chance to get inside.

burdy · 12-01-2012, 10:00 AM

this has to be a troll thread right?

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