Has TUF run its course / 6 figure contract - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
UFC The Ultimate Fighting Championship (UFC) is a U.S.-based mixed martial arts organization, recognized as the largest MMA promotion in the world. The UFC is headquartered in Las Vegas, Nevada and is owned and operated by Zuffa, LLC. This promotion is responsible for solidifying the sport's postion in the history-books. UFC is currently undergoing a remarkable surge in popularity, along with greater mainstream media coverage. UFC programming can now be seen on FOX, FX, and FUEL TV in the United States, as well as in 35 other countries worldwide.

Reply

Old 12-16-2012, 10:42 PM   #1 (permalink)
Bantamweight
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 561
RedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level now
Has TUF run its course / 6 figure contract

I got thinking about this after the lackluster finale between Ricci / Smith last night. I have sort of 2 questions / thoughts.

1. Has TUF run it's course? I don't mean the show itself -- I haven't been able to stand the artificial feuds and drama of 'the house' for a long time. I have a very tough time watching an entire episode. The last season where I watched all the episodes was GSP/KOS, and I skipped a lot of the filler, and went straight to the fights for quite a few episodes. I watched a bit of Bisping/Miller, but not the whole thing, and again, a lot of skipping ahead to the fights.

What I mean is the number of TUF tournaments, and the quality of fighters coming out of it. We went from typically 2 seasons per year, to 4 tournaments in 2012. Is the talent pool running thin? Maybe we just had 1 bad tournament (only 2 finishes after the 16-man roster was set), but I think this will be a growing trend. I think we are going to see a lot of 1-dimensional, fringe type fighters like this Colton guy coming out of TUF unless something is changed.

2. I think part of the problem with TUF attracting fringe-type fighters (Julian Lane anyone? - Let me bang, bro!) is the contract structure. It heavily favours the UFC. A 3 year contract at 3 fights year, with 12k show / 12k win for 3 fights in the first year, 16k/16k for 3 fights in the 2nd year, and 22k/22k for 3 fights in the 3rd year. Problem is, only the first year is guaranteed - the UFC holds the option to drop the contract if they don't like you, or renegotiate the value of the 2nd and 3rd years. Nelson is in his 3rd year, but his 2nd year was at 15k/15k, and his 3rd year is 20k/20k.

Look at Roy Nelson. He's doing decent since winning TUF, and he's in the last year of his 6 figure contract. Problem is, you have guys like Dave Herman who came into the UFC 2 years after Nelson, and are making more in disclosed pay (Herman is at 21k/21k vs Nelson's 20k). Not only that, but Nelson has beat Herman. Herman is 1-3 in the UFC, and was able to re-negotiate his contract after his first 3 fights, and is making more than Nelson.

Up and comers who know they have talent want to skip the house, the non-paid exhibition fights, and the 3 year contract all together. They will want to sign with the UFC for a year and then re-negotiate a better deal for themselves.

Unless the contract is beefed up to attract better talent, I don't think we will see top talent attracted to it anymore.

Last edited by RedRocket44 : 12-16-2012 at 10:56 PM.
RedRocket44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 

Old 12-16-2012, 11:21 PM   #2 (permalink)
BEWARE OF THE PENGUIN!
 
No_Mercy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,600
No_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings System
Thought about this briefly before. First of all TUF was designed as a feeder. No talent means no fights = no business. Rather than have to buy out contracts from rival organizations or at least match it they develop their own talent.

The quality of fighters have gone downhill, but I also think they don't necessarily want to attract top tiered ones otherwise what's the point. TUF is for up and comers. Roy Nelson did not belong in there. He was already an IFL champ and fought in Abu Dhabi. He breezed through the competition who were mainly amateurs or first timers.

That's why they have TUF Brazil now which is brilliant and will be branching out all over the world then they'll integrate them into the UFC.

You gotta see the big picture.

Back then people watched TUF first to get into the UFC hence why the Stephan Bonnar vs Griffin fight was pivotal. Not many people watched UFC only the hardcore fans. Now it's the other way around. The UFC doesn't need to rely on TUF as much anymore because of their monopoly over the last decade. It's really quite amazing what they've done.

Withstood the challenge from Affliction and Pro Elite.
Bought out Pride.
Bought out SF.
Bought out WFA assets for Lyoto's contract I believe. I went to the parties of the head promoter. BTW: Best parties on Earth. Can you say blonde girls galore in nurses outfits!!!
__________________
Marcus Aurelius: Tell me again, Maximus, why are we here?
Maximus: For the glory of the Empire, sire.

Baked, not fried... the healthy choice.

No_Mercy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 11:22 PM   #3 (permalink)
LL
Rough Sex and Banana Pudding
 
LL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Dance Class with Dom.
Posts: 8,340
LL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings System
The problem with TUF is that everyone ends up getting into the UFC it seems.

Now that's not a bad thing, we've got guys like Koscheck, Florian, Leben, Schaub, Meathead, Wiman, Maynard, Vinny, Bonnar, and tons of others who came in but really it defeats the whole purpose of the show and outside of the Featherweight and Bantamweight seasons the talent hasn't been that good, that season produced a title contender in Dodson and guys like Bedford, Brandao, and a guy I think has a ton of potential in Bermudez.

I'm glad they all made it in because they've put on some good fights and I'm a big Bermudez guy but really....that defeats the whole purpose of the show, this season was different but that's because the entire season was flat out garbage. From now on, only the winner, not even the runner up should get a UFC contract, that may not help but it'd certainly make things more interesting.
__________________
THE PERFECT STORM

THE PERFECT RECORD

THE PERFECT FIGHTER
LL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 11:27 PM   #4 (permalink)
Lightweight
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Flint,Michigan
Posts: 1,806
Wookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level nowWookie is on another level now
Excellent point! It really doesn't make a whole lot of sense to even try out for the Ultimate Fighter anymore. The only thing to gain is how well the UFC promotes the people from the show, but that doesn't mean a whole lot when they make the money from it and you don't.
Wookie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 11:31 PM   #5 (permalink)
Bantamweight
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 561
RedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level now
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLyotoLegion View Post
The problem with TUF is that everyone ends up getting into the UFC it seems.

Now that's not a bad thing, we've got guys like Koscheck, Florian, Leben, Schaub, Meathead, Wiman, Maynard, Vinny, Bonnar, and tons of others who came in but really it defeats the whole purpose of the show and outside of the Featherweight and Bantamweight seasons the talent hasn't been that good, that season produced a title contender in Dodson and guys like Bedford, Brandao, and a guy I think has a ton of potential in Bermudez.

I'm glad they all made it in because they've put on some good fights and I'm a big Bermudez guy but really....that defeats the whole purpose of the show, this season was different but that's because the entire season was flat out garbage. From now on, only the winner, not even the runner up should get a UFC contract, that may not help but it'd certainly make things more interesting.
I agree partially.

It's unfortunate that a lot of the runner-ups get signed, because they typically get signed to a 1-year contract, instead of 3. It's usually for less money (3 fights, anywhere from 6k/6k to 10k/10k), but if they do well they get to re-negotiate sooner than the guy who won the tournament.

However, the UFC isn't going to stop handing out contracts to runner-ups as long as they deserve it. Imagine if they refused a contract to Bonnar because he didn't win? I don't need to go over the full list of runner-ups who were signed, and have gone on to put on good fights.

Last edited by RedRocket44 : 12-16-2012 at 11:36 PM.
RedRocket44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 11:37 PM   #6 (permalink)
BEWARE OF THE PENGUIN!
 
No_Mercy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,600
No_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings System
It's the same model as America's Top Model or American Idol/X-Factor. It all goes to Tyra and Simon Cowell respectively. In this case the UFC gets first dibs on emerging talent.

Take for example Keith Jardine. He was able to make a name for himself by beating Chuck Lidell and he was making $10k per fight. Might not make sense to fans, but for the UFC it makes a whole lotta sense. For every 30 sub par fighters they get they'll get at least one standout per season and that's all they need. Look at Nate Diaz. He's done pretty well for himself transitioning from a loud mouth nobody to a loud mouth somebody. Now everybody knows him and his fan base has grown along with his brother. Griffin, Kos, Diego, Leben, Rashad, and Bisping. Bisping owes everything to TUF.

You guys have to see it for what it is. It's boot camp plain and simple.
__________________
Marcus Aurelius: Tell me again, Maximus, why are we here?
Maximus: For the glory of the Empire, sire.

Baked, not fried... the healthy choice.

No_Mercy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 11:51 PM   #7 (permalink)
Bantamweight
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 561
RedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level nowRedRocket44 is on another level now
Quote:
Originally Posted by No_Mercy View Post
You guys have to see it for what it is. It's boot camp plain and simple.
The point I'm trying to make is the "6 figure contract" was attractive 6-7 years ago in the first seasons, and the competition was better. The structure / value of the contract hasn't changed, and good fighters like Rory McDonald for example skip it all together, and end up making more money.

But you are right, if only 1 out of 30 who fight on TUF (even 1 out of 50) go on to fight in the UFC for a few years, it's probably worth it to them.
RedRocket44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2012, 11:58 PM   #8 (permalink)
LL
Rough Sex and Banana Pudding
 
LL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Dance Class with Dom.
Posts: 8,340
LL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings SystemLL Is Beyond A Rankings System
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRocket44 View Post
I agree partially.

It's unfortunate that a lot of the runner-ups get signed, because they typically get signed to a 1-year contract, instead of 3. It's usually for less money (3 fights, anywhere from 6k/6k to 10k/10k), but if they do well they get to re-negotiate sooner than the guy who won the tournament.

However, the UFC isn't going to stop handing out contracts to runner-ups as long as they deserve it. Imagine if they refused a contract to Bonnar because he didn't win? I don't need to go over the full list of runner-ups who were signed, and have gone on to put on good fights.
I get what you mean and I'm glad they signed the guys from the first couple of seasons and the lighter weight season but look at Survivor, you finish in second...oh well, that's just that, you spent 39 days on an island and you don't get anything for it.

I have no idea if that is the exact problem but I do think if everyone went into TUF knowing it's only the winner that the drama and the excitement would increase and in a good way, not the drunken Julian Lane "LET ME BANG BRO!" kind of drama but the "oh snap, if you lose you're out" kind of way.

It just makes the whole show seem pointless, they consistently talk about how the goal is to win the show and you see a guy like Manley distraught he didn't win but he's gonna get a fight in the UFC anyway.
__________________
THE PERFECT STORM

THE PERFECT RECORD

THE PERFECT FIGHTER
LL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 12:04 AM   #9 (permalink)
BEWARE OF THE PENGUIN!
 
No_Mercy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,600
No_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings SystemNo_Mercy Is Beyond A Rankings System
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRocket44 View Post
The point I'm trying to make is the "6 figure contract" was attractive 6-7 years ago in the first seasons, and the competition was better. The structure / value of the contract hasn't changed, and good fighters like Rory McDonald for example skip it all together, and end up making more money.

But you are right, if only 1 out of 30 who fight on TUF (even 1 out of 50) go on to fight in the UFC for a few years, it's probably worth it to them.
Do you think Colt or some of the past winner would have made it into the UFC without TUF. It's a feeder. Kinda like a satellite poker tourney into the main event...haha. Six figures is plenty enticing for 90% of the fighters out there. Guys like Rory trained a lot longer. TUF is simply a shortcut into the big leagues. Some of the winners couldn't cut it; Big Daddy, Escudero, Lutter, etc.

It goes both ways. TUF serves its purpose. I still watch it from time to time. Next season I'm almost certain ratings will spike...pun intended.

Ultimately I'm not even debating here. I definitely see the lack of interest, lack of quality fighters, with a thin plot line. In fact there is no plot it's a reality show. It covers a niche though. Remember that boxing reality show with Oscar. It never made it. TUF has been around for a long while now.
__________________
Marcus Aurelius: Tell me again, Maximus, why are we here?
Maximus: For the glory of the Empire, sire.

Baked, not fried... the healthy choice.

No_Mercy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 12:43 AM   #10 (permalink)
Middleweight
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,795
rabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By Allrabakill Is Beloved By All
As someone who never watches it I would say it's constructive. It's good to have a feeder where they literally have a tournament to see who belongs in the UFC. Instead of having private fights that aren't televised why not televise it, it's good to attract more talent. At the end of the day it may be trash tv but the concept needs to stay, guys like Nelson and Griffin need to get their shots some how.
rabakill is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On

VerticalSports
Baseball Forum Golf Forum Boxing Forum Snowmobile Forum
Basketball Forum Soccer Forum MMA Forum PWC Forum
Football Forum Cricket Forum Wrestling Forum ATV Forum
Hockey Forum Volleyball Forum Paintball Forum Snowboarding Forum
Tennis Forum Rugby Forums Lacrosse Forum Skiing Forums
Copyright (C) Verticalscope Inc SEO by vBSEO 3.3.2
Powered by vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2009 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.
vBCredits v1.4 Copyright ©2007, PixelFX Studios