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Old 01-05-2013, 05:17 AM   #41 (permalink)
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Also Anthony Johnson is a beast.
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Old 01-05-2013, 05:57 AM   #42 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ClydebankBlitz View Post
He never really hurt Johnson that bad if I remember, and he had no hard time finishing Akiyama. I think that considering that both fights were first round finishes, that was a horrible example.

He couldn't get close to Jones, just like all of his opponents. If you're holding it by those standards, Machida looks terrible stand up aswell.

I don't think his power, or his skill level, is fading at all. People always say this, but look at the records. He's only lost to Anderson Silva and Jon Jones in the last 6 years, and out of his 7 wins he's 6 of them, 5 in the first round and 5 by KO.

I don't agree that Stann hits harder at all. Stann has a bit of pop and can finish a fight, but while he CAN, Belfort DOES.

Yeah they aren't the most technical when it comes to striking, but Belfort has no problem matching anyone on the feet. "All Bisping has to do". Lol. All I would have to do to beat Anderson Silva is get him down and knock him out on the ground. That's how saying that works yeah?
Hey, just to be clear - I'm not knocking Vitor's striking becauase he or anyone else didn't dominate Jon Jones standing.

When Vitor (and other fighters who rely heavily on their striking) fight ppl with good wrestling and takedowns like Jon Jones, Anthony Johnson or Bisping they tend to fight less then their full ability.

When you say: "Belfort has no problem matching anyone on the feet".

Well bro, what about Jon Jones? Did Belfort have a problem matching him on the feet?

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Originally Posted by SideWays222 View Post
What are you talking about

Vitor looked impressive in both those fights and hardly had a hard time. He is fighting grown men who are professional fighters not kids. So he isnt going to be able to just get a finish whenever he wants but he still finished both fights in the first round. Pretty impressive id say.
He looked impressive, it doesn't mean he doesn't have weaknesses or there aren't areas where Bisping is better than he is.

If I said Bisping has better cardio than Belfort I doubt anyone would dispute it. Bisping has his strengths and Belfort has his weaknesses and despite Belfort looking impressive in all his fights, it doesn't mean Bisping couldn't defeat Belfort in playing his strengths against areas where Belfort is weakest.

...

Really though. Vitor is mostly a guy who relies on power in the same way that Brian Stann and Mike Tyson rely on their power.

In also the same way that JDS is a fighter who relies on his power.

If you can take that away, it can make a big difference.

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Old 01-05-2013, 06:10 AM   #43 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Trix View Post
Hey, just to be clear - I'm not knocking Vitor's striking becauase he or anyone else didn't dominate Jon Jones standing.

When Vitor (and other fighters who rely heavily on their striking) fight ppl with good wrestling and takedowns like Jon Jones, Anthony Johnson or Bisping they tend to fight less then their full ability.

When you say: "Belfort has no problem matching anyone on the feet".

Well bro, what about Jon Jones? Did Belfort have a problem matching him on the feet?



He looked impressive, it doesn't mean he doesn't have weaknesses or there aren't areas where Bisping is better than he is.

If I said Bisping has better cardio than Belfort I doubt anyone would dispute it. Bisping has his strengths and Belfort has his weaknesses and despite Belfort looking impressive in all his fights, it doesn't mean Bisping couldn't defeat Belfort in playing his strengths against areas where Belfort is weakest.

...

Really though. Vitor is mostly a guy who relies on power in the same way that Brian Stann and Mike Tyson rely on their power.

In also the same way that JDS is a fighter who relies on his power.

If you can take that away, it can make a big difference.

I wasnt commenting on any of that. You could be right i dont necessarily disagree. Only this part.

Quote:
Belfort had a hard time finishing Akiyama and Johnson.
but i also think i should comment on this

Quote:
His boxing looked almost non-existent against Jones.
Vitor went in to that fight with a broken hand. So he couldnt exactly box and its impressive he threw any punches at all. Which is why the plan was to take it to the ground and go for Suba (Almost worked too). I think he also threw head kicks while they were standing up.
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Old 01-05-2013, 06:20 AM   #44 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SideWays222 View Post
I wasnt commenting on any of that. Only this part.

but i also think i should comment on this

Vitor went in to that fight with a broken hand. So he couldnt exactly box and its impressive he threw any punches at all. Which is why the plan was to take it to the ground and go for Suba (Almost worked too). I think he also threw head kicks while they were standing up.
Vitor looked gased when he got the finish in the Anthony Johnson fight. The power in his punches was gone and he had to go for the choke because he wasn't really inflicting damage with his strikes anymore. So yeah, I say it looked like he had a hard time getting the finish, bro.

Don't really remember the Akiyama fight. All I remember is Vitor may have needed 20-40 punches to get the finish whereas I suspect Brian Stann would have finished Akiyama with 2-10 punches. And I'm still not sure if it was the punches to the back of Akiyama's head that actually finished him. So yeah, maybe he did have a hard time getting the finish & it was only the illegal shots that did Akiyama in.

Did Vitor have a broken hand? I don't know if that was actually the case. After the fight there are medical suspensions and I don't remember Vitor having a medical suspension for a broken hand.

Here:

Quote:
UFC 152 Medical Suspensions

Jon Jones: Indefinite suspension; needs x-ray of right arm for medical clearance (minimum 14 day suspension)
Vitor Belfort: 30 days rest; laceration over eye

http://www.mmamania.com/2012/9/24/33...-jon-jones-arm
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Old 01-05-2013, 07:11 AM   #45 (permalink)
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Weidman needs to beat someone credible before he deserves all this credibility he's getting. All Munoz was talkin about was sobbing in front of the tv before the fight and how depressed he was, not exactly the best preparation for war.
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Old 01-05-2013, 07:23 AM   #46 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Trix View Post
Vitor looked gased when he got the finish in the Anthony Johnson fight. The power in his punches was gone and he had to go for the choke because he wasn't really inflicting damage with his strikes anymore. So yeah, I say it looked like he had a hard time getting the finish, bro.

Don't really remember the Akiyama fight. All I remember is Vitor may have needed 20-40 punches to get the finish whereas I suspect Brian Stann would have finished Akiyama with 2-10 punches. And I'm still not sure if it was the punches to the back of Akiyama's head that actually finished him. So yeah, maybe he did have a hard time getting the finish & it was only the illegal shots that did Akiyama in.

Did Vitor have a broken hand? I don't know if that was actually the case. After the fight there are medical suspensions and I don't remember Vitor having a medical suspension for a broken hand.

Here:
Is that why??? Not because he is a black belt who saw an opening to get the finish with a submission??

Akiyama is an EXTREMELY durable guy. He has only been finished by punches once in his career and that is against Jerome Le Banner in his second fight and ofcourse Vitor Belfort. He took Leben punches and kept coming. So Vitor needing a barrage of punches to finish him does not mean anything bad. And Vitor has always had fast hands that overwhelm you rather then getting the 1 punch KO. Though the guy has plenty of power and in neither of those fights did he have a hard time getting the finish. (Though im not sure why you are trying to compare his punching power to Stanns. Sure if id have to guess Stann has more 1 punch KO power then Vitor. But what does Stann have to do with this discussion?)

Well you can google it and find plenty of articles reporting that he went in to the fight with a broken hand.

Quiet frankly i dont hold much weight with those reports. I dont know how thorough their inspection is. Iv seen interviews of fighters mentioning injuries that never get reported in the medical suspension. Its quiet possible that they focus more on brain scans rather then x-raying every bone. They probably just expect the fighter to mention if there is severe pain in a region and then move on from there. Hell i recall when i had a broken collar bone the doctor wanted to take more x-rays but said he didnt want to expose me to any more radiation so he scheduled me for another appointment.
Like i said i just dont know much about their inspection so until i do it isnt something im going to focus on.

And a random thought

I do know that the UFC didnt want to pay for a procedure for Tito because he claimed for it to have happened outside of the octagon. So im not sure but i wouldnt be surprised if the medical suspension just lists injuries that happened in the fight. (Again i dont know if that has any truth to it just a theory)

Thinking about it it would be nice if one of our star reporters gets an interview with the doctors that perform these inspections so we can get a little insight.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:53 AM   #47 (permalink)
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I already don't like Vitor being played down because if Bisping wins I'd hate to see the "Bisping only beat Vitor cause Vitor is an old and past it fighter". I personally think Vitor right now is pretty damn close to as good as he ever was. If Bisping wins, it's the first time Vitor has been beat by someone who isn't a legend ever. I suppose Kazushi Sakuraba isn't quite on the same scale as the others, but we all know the Gracie Killer. Dan Henderson, Alistar Overeem, Tito Ortiz, Randy Couture, Chuck Liddel, Jon Jones, Anderson Silva. No one has ever just cause Vitor off guard and upset him who wasn't/didn't become a legend. I don't think Michael Bisping really fits into that mold of a natural legendary fighter, so to win this fight he will need to have his tactics and dicipline down to a tee, and that will be so respectable if he can do it.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:54 AM   #48 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SideWays222 View Post
Is that why??? Not because he is a black belt who saw an opening to get the finish with a submission??

Akiyama is an EXTREMELY durable guy. He has only been finished by punches once in his career and that is against Jerome Le Banner in his second fight and ofcourse Vitor Belfort. He took Leben punches and kept coming. So Vitor needing a barrage of punches to finish him does not mean anything bad. And Vitor has always had fast hands that overwhelm you rather then getting the 1 punch KO. Though the guy has plenty of power and in neither of those fights did he have a hard time getting the finish. (Though im not sure why you are trying to compare his punching power to Stanns. Sure if id have to guess Stann has more 1 punch KO power then Vitor. But what does Stann have to do with this discussion?)

Well you can google it and find plenty of articles reporting that he went in to the fight with a broken hand.

Quiet frankly i dont hold much weight with those reports. I dont know how thorough their inspection is. Iv seen interviews of fighters mentioning injuries that never get reported in the medical suspension. Its quiet possible that they focus more on brain scans rather then x-raying every bone. They probably just expect the fighter to mention if there is severe pain in a region and then move on from there. Hell i recall when i had a broken collar bone the doctor wanted to take more x-rays but said he didnt want to expose me to any more radiation so he scheduled me for another appointment.
Like i said i just dont know much about their inspection so until i do it isnt something im going to focus on.

And a random thought

I do know that the UFC didnt want to pay for a procedure for Tito because he claimed for it to have happened outside of the octagon. So im not sure but i wouldnt be surprised if the medical suspension just lists injuries that happened in the fight. (Again i dont know if that has any truth to it just a theory)

Thinking about it it would be nice if one of our star reporters gets an interview with the doctors that perform these inspections so we can get a little insight.

Vitor vs Johnson.

http://all-fights.narod2.ru/ufc/Vito...y_Johnson.html

Can't tell if he gased or not, but his punches when he had Johnson's back did look a low slower than at the start of the round. It could be because he was in a precarious position, I don't know.

I think Brian Stann would beat Vitor in a straight stand up war & ppl tend to overrate Vitor because he KO'ed Rich Franklin (hey so did Cung Le!) and came the closest to beating Jon Jones(a title previously held by Machida because he punched Jon Jones in the face once, previously held by Rampage for lasting the most rounds with JBJ), not necessarily something to brag about.

Akiyama is durable. But I don't know that there really is such a thing as a "good chin". More often it has to do with fighting someone who doesn't know how to deliver a punch properly which makes it seem as if their chin is good. Then they fight someone who knows how to punch and quickly get knocked out.

There is no one who can take a direct hit on the chin by a real puncher like a Mike Tyson or a George Foreman. Having a chin and being durable may be moreso myths that developed in MMA due to fighters with undeveloped striking skills who punch someone in the head 50-100 times without managing to inflict any real damage.

If Vitor needs 20-40 punches to put someone out with 4 ounce gloves, it may be that his technique and power are overrated. I think Stann and others may have better technique and boxing than Vitor does.

They may not be as exciting and go for the kill, but I think there are people who would knock Vitor out & that its kind of sad the best thing ppl can say about Vitor is that he "came closest" to "almost beating" Jon Jones.
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:01 AM   #49 (permalink)
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How, in ANY way shape or form, is the best thing people can say about Vitor is that he almost beat Jon Jones? What about the legendary career which took place before that? What about being the UFC champion? Do you know who Vitor Belfort is?
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:06 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Everyone here is talking like Munoz is thrash. As far as I remember, when Munoz was scheduled to fight Sonnen, so many people here were saying "Munoz is going to outwrestle Sonnen, bad" and "Munoz manhandled Sonnen in college wrestling, he is gonna do it again".

Belfort should have been disqualified for the fight against Akiyama. Yes he had Akiyama hurt and was on his way to winning the fight, but that doesn't mean he has the right to swing some illegal blows. He should have been disqualified for those back to the head shots just like Erick Silva and Alessio Sakara were disqualified for theirs. It was utter bullshit. "Back of the head puncher" Belfort ranks right up there with "Nuts destroyer" Kongo for me.

Anyone cares to argue with me that if the Belfort-Johnson fight wasn't in Brazil, the fight could have been hella different?

Anyway, yes Belfort stands a good chance of winning this fight. Good matchup for him anyway. I want Bisping to win though. I hope Bisping fights smart and uses those oblique kicks to take away Belfort's movement, and clinches with Belfort anytime Belfort goes in for the flurry.
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