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Old 03-09-2013, 11:48 AM   #11 (permalink)
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There's one thing he lacks and that's a master strategist on his team whom he respects completely. Rafael is probably the closest, but to me he's much more tactical.

- better game plans
- conditioning

Shogun and Wand fight very similar to what you would do in a street fight. It's showed in 90% of their fights. The only time I've ever seen Shogun game plan was again Lyoto the first time around and Wanderlei against Cung Le.

This is also why they're fan favorites.
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Old 03-09-2013, 11:57 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by TheLyotoLegion View Post
Can he beat Nog though?

I think if he comes in and tries to fight technical and doesn't gas he can, but if he shows up like he did against Vera I think Nog will work him. Their first fight was pretty close and Shogun has regressed where Nog albeit in terrible fashion just picked up the biggest win of his career.


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Of course he can beat Nog, anyone can beat anyone and he's beaten him before. The first fight is irrelevant because it was under a different rule set a long time ago, and they've both changed a lot.

Shogun may not be what he has been, but he's achieved a LOT more than Nog has since their first fight. A rusty Shogun is better than all of Nog's UFC opponents so far.
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Old 03-09-2013, 12:19 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Always good to see Shogun taking his career seriously. I'd personally like to see him try a drop to MW (and given his pudgy physique, I think he could do it) and reinvent himself there. Either way, I'm looking forward to his fight with Big Nog.

LL is just mad because Shogun had his way with Machida - twice.
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Old 03-09-2013, 12:26 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Of course he can beat Nog, anyone can beat anyone and he's beaten him before. The first fight is irrelevant because it was under a different rule set a long time ago, and they've both changed a lot.

Shogun may not be what he has been, but he's achieved a LOT more than Nog has since their first fight. A rusty Shogun is better than all of Nog's UFC opponents so far.
A rusty Shogun is not better than Rashad, Davis or Bader.


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Old 03-09-2013, 03:04 PM   #15 (permalink)
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A rusty Shogun is not better than Rashad, Davis or Bader.


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He has so much more finishing potential than any of those guys, whatever condition he's in. Not to mention will to win. None of them beat Rua in a five round fight, if they beat him in a 3 rounder, it's probably via dry hump.

Better athletes? Yes. Fighters? Na.
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Old 03-09-2013, 07:29 PM   #16 (permalink)
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A rusty Shogun is not better than Rashad, Davis or Bader.
Rashad and Bader get clocked and knocked out in the first round. Both of them are easy to hit with suspect chins, particular Bader. As much as he's fallen these days, Shogun still finds & hits everyone he fights, and with his power those 2 are toast. Davis is hard to say, his striking sucks balls but his wrestling & ground skills are solid, he's the hardest matchup out of the 3 for Shogun.

Personal thoughts. Shogun needs to get back to where he was for the Liddell and Machida fights. He mixed things up beautifully instead of just relying on his overhand right and leaping left hook. He used low-high combos, attacked the body to get free headshots, and used his low kicks to take out his opponent's legs and open them up for more strikes. And of course get his cardio back, or at least better. If he can do all that he can take out anyone not named Jon Jones, and give Jones a damn good run for the money.
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Old 03-10-2013, 04:00 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I think Shogun's doing the smart thing, learning to focus on his hands. He's had some incredibly bad luck with his injuries and I'm amazed the guy can still throw a solid kick given the abuse his knees have taken over the years. Hopefully he comes in with better conditioning for his fight with Nogueira.

Shogun is one of those fighters that I could see beating everyone in the top ten but Jones, but also losing to everyone in the top ten just as easily. I think he has trouble with Jones, Gustafsson (who already soundly beat him), Teixeira, and Machida. I think he wins a rematch with Henderson and beats Rashad, Bader, Nogueira, but I can also see him losing to these guys as well.
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Old 03-10-2013, 04:28 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Shogun and Bas are the only two fighters I look up to and idolize, forever a legend in my book. Seeing him as Champion one more time would be great before he finally retired. Even if he doesn't, he had a great career.
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Old 03-10-2013, 04:44 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Rashad and Bader get clocked and knocked out in the first round. Both of them are easy to hit with suspect chins, particular Bader. As much as he's fallen these days, Shogun still finds & hits everyone he fights, and with his power those 2 are toast. Davis is hard to say, his striking sucks balls but his wrestling & ground skills are solid, he's the hardest matchup out of the 3 for Shogun.

Personal thoughts. Shogun needs to get back to where he was for the Liddell and Machida fights. He mixed things up beautifully instead of just relying on his overhand right and leaping left hook. He used low-high combos, attacked the body to get free headshots, and used his low kicks to take out his opponent's legs and open them up for more strikes. And of course get his cardio back, or at least better. If he can do all that he can take out anyone not named Jon Jones, and give Jones a damn good run for the money.
People always say that about Rashad, his chin isn't as bad as made out to be but Shogun certainly can KO him, Rashad likewise has the potential to out wrestle Shogun. I think Rashad would have beat him had their fight went through.

As for getting to where he was when he fought Machida, I don't think his body will allow that, he may know this hence his recent changes and he can still give many fits and beat most but I believe injuries ultimately got the best of him.


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Old 03-10-2013, 06:04 PM   #20 (permalink)
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As for getting to where he was when he fought Machida, I don't think his body will allow that, he may know this hence his recent changes and he can still give many fits and beat most but I believe injuries ultimately got the best of him.
Sad, but accurate. His knees are toasted from the busts/surgeries sequencies and he used them a lot to brilliantly mix thing up. Violent low kicks opening for nasty hand combos or knee direct strikes. We have been watching long periods of fights not seeing a single kick from Shogun. The reason is obvious for me.

Shogun used to be a professional model and gave up to get his face on the line against monsters. His heart and passion for the fights are unquestionable and are up there with Wand and Big Nog. These guys are legends.
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