***OFFICIAL*** Mauricio "Shogun" Rua vs. Chael Sonnen Thread - Page 3 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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View Poll Results: Your prediction
Mauricio "Shogun" Rua 13 34.21%
Chael Sonnen 23 60.53%
Draw 2 5.26%
Voters: 38. You may not vote on this poll

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post #21 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-13-2013, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by GDPofDRB View Post
Takedown defense is not the best, and....
Of course it's not the best, it's ******* terrible. I've seen very few fighters at Shogun's level whose takedown defense is as unbelieveably bad as his. Sonnen will expose this, I guarantee you.

When has Shogun showed "good" wrestling? Please enlighten me.

It doesn't take much to see that Shogun's wrestling is pretty abysmal, that his gas tank sucks, and that he's nothing compared to what he used to be. I'd go as far to say that Shogun couldn't beat anyone in the top ten anymore.
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post #22 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 12:38 AM
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Of course it's not the best, it's ******* terrible. I've seen very few fighters at Shogun's level whose takedown defense is as unbelieveably bad as his. Sonnen will expose this, I guarantee you.

When has Shogun showed "good" wrestling? Please enlighten me.

It doesn't take much to see that Shogun's wrestling is pretty abysmal, that his gas tank sucks, and that he's nothing compared to what he used to be. I'd go as far to say that Shogun couldn't beat anyone in the top ten anymore.
There's no point of arguing with a delusional fool living in the past and probably thinks shogun is top 5. Fact is Shogun WAS great, but knee surgeries which probably largely contributed to his UFC fights mainly all having garbage cardio making him ripe for the picking.


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post #23 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 02:47 AM
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Shogun has very solid trip takedowns, many times right to full mount. Therefor he cannot be the worst wrestler in all of the UFC.

Who has Sonnen taken down at 205 ever in his career? What good wrestlers has he beat at 205? Chael is now 36 and bulky. His shot isn't going to be what it once was, he may have to clinch first to get Shogun to the cage. Clinch is not good for him. Also, when did Chael automatically get better at BJJ? He has to have some of the worst sub defense of any top 10 fighter in the UFC. Hunt is about the only one that comes to mind that may be worse. Shogun isn't known for his triangle, but he is certainly capable of subbing the very subable Chael Sonnen. Or maybe even reversing/sweeping him a couple times. Plus Chael is mentally weak in big fights. Whether this is a big fight or not I don't know.

I find it odd that people are going up and down about Shogun's weaknesses. But don't bat an eye at Chael's.

Chael does have a good chin. I hope we can see Shogun sweep or Thai Clinch a few times. Hopefully this can be a good fight and we can get off the little streak of lack luster events/fights besides the Mighty Mouse fight.
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post #24 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 03:04 AM
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Sonnen pretty much defeated Anderson in their first fight, and to even the odds, Anderson had to cheat to win in their second fight.
Sonnen pretty much tapped if I remember correctly. And Chael +T Sonnen cheated first also.

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post #25 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 03:38 AM
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Not so sure about that. His knees seemed pretty fine in the 1st Machida fight.
I'm almost sure he became bad knee Shogun after Machida 2...

Edit - wiki, as good as that is when it comes to sources fide dignity, backs me on the timeline for the 2nd surgery:
Shogun hurt his knee a month before the 1st griffin fight then shredded it fully during the fight. He had knee surgery afterwards but then busted it again training and had a 2nd surgery before getting to the coleman fight. Not the worst but not exactly ideal, it seemed to get better each fight after though, until the aftermath of the second Machida fight.

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post #26 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 04:13 AM
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Originally Posted by jonnyg4508 View Post
Shogun has very solid trip takedowns, many times right to full mount. Therefor he cannot be the worst wrestler in all of the UFC.

Who has Sonnen taken down at 205 ever in his career? What good wrestlers has he beat at 205? Chael is now 36 and bulky. His shot isn't going to be what it once was, he may have to clinch first to get Shogun to the cage. Clinch is not good for him. Also, when did Chael automatically get better at BJJ? He has to have some of the worst sub defense of any top 10 fighter in the UFC. Hunt is about the only one that comes to mind that may be worse. Shogun isn't known for his triangle, but he is certainly capable of subbing the very subable Chael Sonnen. Or maybe even reversing/sweeping him a couple times. Plus Chael is mentally weak in big fights. Whether this is a big fight or not I don't know.

I find it odd that people are going up and down about Shogun's weaknesses. But don't bat an eye at Chael's.

Chael does have a good chin. I hope we can see Shogun sweep or Thai Clinch a few times. Hopefully this can be a good fight and we can get off the little streak of lack luster events/fights besides the Mighty Mouse fight.

good post, i think shogun is guna hurt chael

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post #27 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 04:15 AM
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Nope he won't this isn't 2005 shogun or at least 2009 shogun, this is 2013 always gasses and gets hit shogun


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post #28 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 06:38 AM
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This really is a choose your own adventure type fight.

Basically you are betting on Shogun's knees vs Chael's head.

I don't know if anyone watched the latest Best of Pride but Shogun had both an omoplata attempt on Nog and a head/arm choke on Overeem. He's got submissions, but he never seems to commit to them (likely for fear of gassing). Chael's also taken two brutal beatings at the hands of Jones/Silva and he's old with testosterone issues so his chin is really going to be a question mark for this fight.

On the other hand you never know what Shogun is going to show up or if/when he'll quit in the fight. Sonnen has changed camps and is now under the tutelage of Mark Munoz and we saw the shape Munoz was in in his last fight. Sonnen could go five rounds or look for a choke finish, he has to be motivated knowing that his path to a MW title fight is only one or two(easy) fights away.

We could see a FOTY,
we could see either guy retired...brutally,
we could see either guy give a performance that could lead to their cut from the UFC
You could see a submission, TKO or decision, you could even see a draw...

I know who I'm betting on but I'm pumped for this one. I think every fight leading up to this one will be short one rounders and feel like exhibition fights and this one will deliver.
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post #29 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by jonnyg4508 View Post
Why is Sonnen regarded as such an elite guy? He has proven nothing at 205. He put up ZERO resistance vs. Bones and was easily beat at his own game. He lost bad to Anderson the 2nd time. He arguably lost to Bisping, at the very least Bisping gave him all he could handle.

So what a near victory over a hurt Silva and a win over Brian Stann who is now retired means he is among the elite?

He may win, but to say you don't know how he loses??? Sonnen has had one foot out the door for a while now. He spends more time on the set of UFC Tonight than he does in the gym.

Never understood where Sonnen became an elite fighter? He is good no doubt. But proven nothing what so ever at 205 and is not getting any younger.



Shogun's lack of gas tank is so damn over-exaggerated. Listen, I'm not saying it is a strength of his. But come on. People act like he is Tito Ortiz. Who did he gas against? Bones? Who wouldn't gas vs. a extremely large, one of teh best in the world, wrestler? Hendo? Who wouldn't gas when taking that much damage? Several H-Bombs. He still went 5 rounds and pulled enough gas out at the end to over-come all those shots he took. GSP would be worn out too if he took those shots. Where else? The Vera fight where he found a finish in the 4th? Gustaf? Lets get real. Most of the 205 division wouldn't have the gas to go 5 rounds. He has gassed to guys who really have beat him up or are just that much better (Gustaf, Bones). Sonnen was as or more tired as Shogun has been in the 5th round vs. Anderson the first time. Anderson taking 500 "punches" out-lasted a guy who was on top the whole time. Chael gassed on top. Other than that he has been in a bunch of 3 round fights and sort of gasses in those.

Why do people think Sonnen is this cardio machine (where is the proof) and Shogun can't even go 3 rounds? Sonnen isn't going to hurt Shogun as much as Hendo, Gustaf, Bones or hell even Vera did. Taking shots has something to do with gassing....

Totally exaggerated.
Ran through Marquardt back when Nate was number 2 in the division and dismantled Yushin. Those are his best wins. Not to mention Anderson cheated in the second fight. Chael was cutting too much weight to make 185 and thats why he looked 'bad' against Bisping even though he won all three rounds pretty clearly.

Chael grinds out Shogun for a lopsided decision or late finish. Shogun hasn't looked good in years.

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post #30 of 342 (permalink) Old 08-14-2013, 10:07 AM
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^ ahahah the chances of Sonnen finishing Shogun are less than 1%
and i'm being optimistic

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