***OFFICIAL*** Ronda Rousey vs. Sara McMann Thread - Page 13 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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View Poll Results: Your prediction
Ronda Rousey (c) 21 67.74%
Sara McMann 9 29.03%
Draw 1 3.23%
Voters: 31. You may not vote on this poll

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post #121 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 06:00 PM
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I guess it must have been those 3 BOMBS Ronda landed after Sara went down.

It was all good to let Pyle reign down shot after shot on TJ, who at one point looked unconscious though.

As long as Uncle Dana keeps his "biggest UFC star" as the champion, everything is good in UFC management world. Look for a $100,000 deposit into a Swiss bank account from Zuffa to a Herb Dean.

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post #122 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 07:11 PM
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The stoppage was early and here's why:

YES, McMann was dropped and wasn't intelligently defending herself in the 2-3 seconds that she was recovering from the shot, BUT 1) She was already starting to get up when Herb Dean actually stepped in to separate the two.

2) She's an olympic silver medalist wrestler and Herb Dean needs to take that level of toughness, fitness, and cardio into account there, liver shot or no liver shot. Some people can recover quicker than others from those and I believe McMann should've been given that opportunity.

3) IT WAS A TITLE FIGHT. Both fighters need to be given the benefit of the doubt because the stakes are so much higher. Whether thats technically the right thing rulebook-wise, or completely politically correct, is irrelevant because it's the truth. Stoppages need to be definitive, as in no doubt about it to any viewer, if for no other reason than because it's the last impression left in the mind of the viewer. For that very reason, a questionable stoppage in the main event has the ability to taint the entire card in the viewers mind, and hurts the UFC as a result.

Truth be told, I think Herb knew he screwed up in the Waldburger fight, and wasn't about to make the same mistake twice in one night. Herb Dean's reputation as the best ref in MMA only continues to exist based on past performance and because Dana White perpetuates the claim. I, for one, have never bought into that claim, and his recent performances only prove that point. He's one of the best, no doubt, but he's no Big John. I'm sure that had Big John been reffing those fights, we wouldn't be talking about late/early stoppages.
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post #123 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 08:52 PM
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No matter how hard i try to see peoples point of view here i just cant. I dont see how Herb can be blamed here. The way Sara dropped has basically in every fight been the indicator that the fight should be stopped. I doubt there is anyone that saw Sara drop and assumed she was going to pop back up 2-3 seconds later. It was the perfect illusion and not only did Herb fall for it but i fell for it myself. I thought the fight was over when she collapsed and i was surprised when she popped back up. I cant blame Herb for pulling the trigger because if he didnt and let Sara continue taking punishment everyone would be saying "Sara dropped to her knees and hand and covering up her liver with the other hand she was completely defensless and Herb for some reason let her keep taking punishment. Herb is now endangering the fighters" but since she surprisingly popped back up after the initial "im done" reaction she gave the complete opposite is happening right now.

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post #124 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 09:09 PM
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I have seen countless fights where people got dropped way more brutally (and to their backs, staring at the stars, in a lot of cases, rather than to the considerably more safe three-point kneel that Sara was in) and were allowed more than a whopping 1-2 seconds of time to mount a defense before the ref jumped into to tell them they were unable to continue fighting.

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post #125 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 09:27 PM
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I have seen countless fights where people got dropped way more brutally (and to their backs, staring at the stars, in a lot of cases, rather than to the considerably more safe three-point kneel that Sara was in) and were allowed more than a whopping 1-2 seconds of time to mount a defense before the ref jumped into to tell them they were unable to continue fighting.
I dont see how a three point knee is safe while in excruciating pain holding her liver with 1 hand. She left the side of her head completely unguarded for some perfect brutal shots that will have leverage behind them.

Yeah iv seen people get dropped brutally staring at the stars too and those fights get stopped if not there an then that is only because the ref is too slow to stop the next 3-4 shots that shouldnt have happened but did because the ref wasnt quick enough.

I have seen every kind of situation imaginable when it comes to stoppages. So i dont really care about what you have seen as we are talking about this situation.

That doesnt change the fact that Sara dropped like a sack of potatoes and wasnt what so ever protecting herself. Herb Dean was well within his right to stop the fight.

The only one to blame here is Sara. She tied Herbs hands when she dropped and didnt protect herself.

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post #126 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 09:30 PM
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I dont see how a three point knee is safe. She left the side of her head completely unguarded for some perfect brutal shots that will have leverage behind them.

Yeah iv seen people get dropped brutally staring at the stars too and those fights get stopped if not there an then that is only because the ref is too slow to stop the next 3-4 shots that shouldnt have happened but did because the ref wasnt quick enough.
It does matter because she was holding herself up with her own body. She had not gone limp and two seconds is not a fair time to give a clearly conscious opponent to mount a defense. By your logic any standing opponent who gets tagged with 2 or 3 good punches but has his hands dropped should have their fight stopped and declared a loss too. Because stance is irrelevant right?

Plus, LOL these are Ronda Rousey punches. She has looked like a pillow fister against every single opponent in the past, this will probably be her crowning glory of knockouts. That knee was clearly a liver or solar plexus hit and there's no reason not to give Sara some time to recover from that.

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post #127 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 09:33 PM
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It does matter because she was holding herself up with her own body. She had not gone limp and two seconds is not a fair time to give a clearly conscious opponent to mount a defense. By your logic any standing opponent who gets tagged with 2 or 3 good punches but has his hands dropped should have their fight stopped and declared a loss too. Because stance is irrelevant right?

Plus, LOL these are Ronda Rousey punches. She has looked like a pillow fister against every single opponent in the past, this will probably be her crowning glory of knockouts. That knee was clearly a liver or solar plexus hit and there's no reason not to give her some time to recover from that.
Being unconscious isnt the only reason to stop a fight. If she didnt go limp why did she drop to her knees?? She wanted to drop to her knees and hold her liver while leaving her head completely available for a pounding?? Her knees went limp. Thats what happened when you get dropped by a body shot. She doesnt need to go unconscious for a fight to be stopped.

Plus in tons of fights the fight gets stopped without the opponent going limp... How many times iv seen a fighter still trying to protect themselves only for him to be too badly hurt to do it correctly and the fight gets stopped. Thats what happened here.


She was too badly hurt to correctly protect herself. End of story.

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post #128 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 09:35 PM
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Being unconscious isnt the only reason to stop a fight. If she didnt go limp why did she drop to her knees?? She wanted to drop to her knees and hold her liver while leaving her head completely available for a pounding??
Um, because she fell down, but was still conscious? on her knees in a three point position? and the fight was stopped less than two seconds later? LOL is women's mma some kind of special case or something? No men's fight would be considered over without a huge controversy here (which is actually why there is a decently large controversy going on over it)

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post #129 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 09:41 PM
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Um, because she fell down, but was still conscious? on her knees in a three point position? and the fight was stopped less than two seconds later? LOL is women's mma some kind of special case or something? No men's fight would be considered over without a huge controversy here (which is actually why there is a decently large controversy going on over it)
Have you ever seen a person going unconscious from a body shot?? No you havent. Her body stopped responding or she wouldnt have been on her knees not protecting herself. She would have been better off moving and covering herself but she was too badly hurt.

Its you who is using womens mma as some kind of special case because Ronda doesnt punch as hard as a man because if a man put themselves in that spot the punches that would have been raining down on them from that spot would have been jaw breaking.

In your mind a fight cant be stopped from a body shot but only by knocking someone out.

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post #130 of 145 (permalink) Old 02-23-2014, 10:02 PM
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I definitely think a fighter that drops to their knees deserves more time to defend than two seconds, and they usually do get it in male MMA. In most male MMA fights they'd get twice that at least.

And yeah it's completely normal for a ref to gauge the amount of damage that appears to be being inflicted from strikes when judging a stoppage. And in fact title fights usually get special consideration where the challenger is given extra time to recover because of the important of the situation.

I didn't feel like Ronda's little punches were the kind of intensity that warranted jumping in and calling a finish in literally two seconds.

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