Tyron Woodley Confirms UFC 209 Rematch With Stephen Thompson - Page 3 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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post #21 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 12:22 AM
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Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
Because YOU didn't put Hendricks on your list. You listed EIGHT fighters so I ranked them.
Actually, if you'd like to journey up, you first listed Thompsons opponents, not me, and excluded Hendricks from it, billing him at 5-1 without mentioning Hendricks. I just went off of that list.

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Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
You just think he shouldn't have gotten a title shot and he has to constantly defend against the number #1 contender, even though I'm pretty sure he's the only male champion right now that has to do that. Cruz didn't fight Dillashaw, Johnson didn't fight Benavidez, Alvarez didn't fight Ferguson or Khabib, Aldo didn't fight Holloway, McGregor didn't fight Aldo, Bisping didn't fight Romero. Perhaps this is the new racism but it seems awfully funny when the rules seem to only apply to this guy.
It certainly is a new kind of racism considering that Demetrious Johnson is also black.

But you also make random assumptions as always. "Oh, you're dissing Woodley....so that means you're fine with literally every other thing that ever happens ever right?".

Cruz already beat Dillashaw, different situation. Johnson already beat Benavidez twice, different situation. Alvarez should have defended the belt against Khabib or Ferguson. Aldo should defend the belt against Holloway. McGregor already beat Aldo, different situation. Bisping should fight Romero.

But you know, just keeps saying racism, that'll solve everything!

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Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
Woodley won the title, Condit didn't...that justifies the title shot. Someone who you apparently don't consider the real champion.
That's not really how deserving a title shot works. I mean if Cody McKenzie catches Conor McGregor in a guillotine does that mean he was right to jump the line ahead of Khabib and Ferg? Who don't I consider to be a real champion? I completely consider Woodley to be the real champion and have never alluded to otherwise.


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Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
You said win streaks count...Thompson isn't on a win streak. Logic seems to be difficult to you.
Lmfao I'm not even going to entertain this. You know you're wrong here, let's just move on past the childish stuff.

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Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
Woodley will fight them all and do it on short notice the fact that the low money has to come first is his issue, which is fair because lets be frank. The UFC never wanted Woodley they bought his company.
Why on earth would the UFC never want Woodley? I mean where in god's name is this coming from? If they didn't want Woodley, why did they even give him that title shot in the first place? This makes no sense what so ever. The UFC absolutely wanted Tyron Woodley. I mean they hated the guy so much that they fed him to the unstoppable Jay Hieron? UFC wanted Woodley just like they wanted Lombard, Will Brooks and any other talented black fighter (I'm just assuming this is the angle you're taking, as you know, you always do).

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The right thing to do is to give the champion the same treatment every other champion in the company is getting and not for people like you to call for the stripping of his belt when all the 34 year old champion wants to do is make money.
I've never once called for Tyron Woodley to have his belt stripped. Again, you've almost fabricated every single point of view in reference to me throughout this entire post. Are you claiming that Woodley is getting worse treatment than other champions? Because if you want I can just absolutely destroy that point of view in terms of finance if you'd like. Hell, why not, I'll give it a spin just for the heck of it.

Tyron Woodley Salaries
UFC 156 - 87,000 / 87,000 [WON FIGHT]
(Can't find data for 161) [LOST FIGHT]
UFC 167 - 52,000 / 52,000 [WON FIGHT]
UFC 171 - 52,000 / 52,000 [WON FIGHT]
UFC 174 - 60,000 / 60,000 [LOST FIGHT]
(Can't find data for international cards) [WON FIGHT]
UFC 183 - 65,000 / 65,000 [WON FIGHT]
UFC 201 - 270,000 / 70,000 [WON FIGHT, CHAMPION]
UFC 205 - 500,000 [DRAW]

Let's compare this to first, Robbie Lawler.

UFC 157 - 95,000 / 10,000 [WON FIGHT]
UFC on Fox 8 - 78,000 / 78,000 [WON FIGHT]
UFC 167 - 83,000 / 83,000 [WON FIGHT]
UFC 171 - 83,000 / 83,000 [LOST FIGHT]
UFC 173 - 100,000 / 100,000 [WON FIGHT]
UFC on Fox 12 - 105,000 / 105,000 [WON FIGHT]
UFC 181 - 110,000 / 110,000 [WON FIGHT, CHAMPION]
UFC 189 - 150,000 / 150,000 [WON FIGHT]

So, to summarize, in the 8 fights for Lawler to get to his first title defence, he earned a total of $1,442,000 in disclosed contract based pay.

Woodley earned $1,412,000 in the six fights that I can actually find evidence of salaries. Even if we saw Woodley dropped to 52 immediately in his second fight and stayed at 60 for the other fight we can't find, that would still say he made $1,584,000...MORE than Robbie Lawler did (and we're not even taking into account that Woodley got put on UFC 205 with PPV points which likely did at minimum in the mid 1.5mil range and would send him flying sky high above what Robbie would have earned for 189). Oh, and let's not forget that Lawler is earning less despite getting that additional win bonus too because his record was better.

So, please, inform me again about how Woodley, the unwanted soul, is getting less than what other champions are getting buddy. Go on, try, I beg you.

EDIT: Just for extra fun I'll edit in the current champions in each division, excluding McGregor for obvious reasons.

Nevermind, found an easier solution.

Woodley has earned 1,864,000 disclosed after 9 fights.
Forrest Griffin earned 1,884,000 disclosed after 15 fights.
Rafael dos Anjos earned 1,706,000 disclosed after 21 fights.
Carlos Condit earned 1,628,000 disclosed after 13 fights.
Stipe Miocic earned 1,538,000 disclosed after 12 fights.
Ben Henderson earned 1,373,000 disclosed after 13 fights.
Johny Hendricks earned 1,477,000 disclosed after 18 fights.
Renan Barao earned 1,316,000 disclosed after 12 fights.
Miesha Tate earned 1,236,000 disclosed after 9 fights.
Anthony Pettis earned 1,151,000 disclosed after 12 fights.
Max Holloway earned 1,132,000 disclosed after 16 fights.



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Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
It's okay, Condit was talking retirement and on the last fight of his contract for Maia. Much like when Wonderboy head kicked Hendricks I said wait and see how Johny rebounds because he might have been done going into that fight.
So to summarize, it never matters when the biggest opponents to Woodley win because their opponents suck now yeah? Cool.

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Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
He got his title shot...doesn't deserve two especially with fighters coming off title loses, I believe they have a 25-30% win rate. Anyone who knows anything about this sport is the best time to get a fight against a former champion is right after they lose the belt or the title shot. I wouldn't mind seeing him face Cerrone, Larkin or Maia.
He isn't getting two. The first fight ended in a draw. He never lost his title match. If you don't lose your title match, then you don't lose your opportunity. You wouldn't mind seeing Thompson fight another challenger while Woodley presumably fights someone with a better recent record...like GSP or Nick Diaz yeah?

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I'm impressed that Dana White and Bjorn Rebney were too scared to keep him under contract
Why would Bjorn Rebny be scared to keep him under contract? That makes no sense what so ever. Surely having a dominant champ to rival the UFC's best was a plus if anything. For the record, I like Askren and he could definitely be a big player with the best ion the world. But you can't deny the guy's not had a decent win in nearly 4 years. Can't keep him at the top of the ladder if he's not fighting anyone.
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post #22 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 01:18 AM
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You sure do start a lot of sentences with "I mean" Mr Clyde..





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post #23 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 02:43 AM
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He probably likes to clarify things alot.

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post #24 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 03:09 AM
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Originally Posted by ClydebankBlitz View Post
Actually, if you'd like to journey up, you first listed Thompsons opponents, not me, and excluded Hendricks from it, billing him at 5-1 without mentioning Hendricks. I just went off of that list.
ACTUALLY I asked you who should have gotten the Condit shot over Woodley and you said Thompson and Maia and those were the fighters records at that time.


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Originally Posted by ClydebankBlitz View Post
It certainly is a new kind of racism considering that Demetrious Johnson is also black.

But you also make random assumptions as always. "Oh, you're dissing Woodley....so that means you're fine with literally every other thing that ever happens ever right?".

Cruz already beat Dillashaw, different situation. Johnson already beat Benavidez twice, different situation. Alvarez should have defended the belt against Khabib or Ferguson. Aldo should defend the belt against Holloway. McGregor already beat Aldo, different situation. Bisping should fight Romero.

But you know, just keeps saying racism, that'll solve everything!
Just because one black guy hasn't given you a reason to be racist against them, you don't get immunity from being racist against other black people. Woodley is from Ferguson one of the most racists places in America, he won the title and has received god knows how many racist messages on twitter. And rather than extending a degree empathy or even humanity you decide to make this about you....you are the victim.

I don't believe any of those fighters you listed fought the number one contender in back to back fights, but that's beside the point because right now at this point in time the champions aren't facing the top guys except for Woodley.


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That's not really how deserving a title shot works. I mean if Cody McKenzie catches Conor McGregor in a guillotine does that mean he was right to jump the line ahead of Khabib and Ferg? Who don't I consider to be a real champion? I completely consider Woodley to be the real champion and have never alluded to otherwise.
If he beat all three guys...sure. Woodley beat Condit and was passed over, he sat for a year and half waiting for his rightful shot, because that's what happens with most of the top guys...they wait. Lets say Wonderboy beats Woodley via split decision do we then get the trilogy?


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Lmfao I'm not even going to entertain this. You know you're wrong here, let's just move on past the childish stuff.
You've clearly contradicted yourself several times


Quote:
Why on earth would the UFC never want Woodley? I mean where in god's name is this coming from? If they didn't want Woodley, why did they even give him that title shot in the first place? This makes no sense what so ever. The UFC absolutely wanted Tyron Woodley. I mean they hated the guy so much that they fed him to the unstoppable Jay Hieron? UFC wanted Woodley just like they wanted Lombard, Will Brooks and any other talented black fighter (I'm just assuming this is the angle you're taking, as you know, you always do).
The UFC did a garbage job promoting Woodley, Jay Hieron was supposed to be fed to Erick Silva, Silva pulled out. As a matter of fact Woodley's best performances were when the UFC didn't matchmake for him but he came in last minute.


Quote:
I've never once called for Tyron Woodley to have his belt stripped. Again, you've almost fabricated every single point of view in reference to me throughout this entire post. Are you claiming that Woodley is getting worse treatment than other champions? Because if you want I can just absolutely destroy that point of view in terms of finance if you'd like. Hell, why not, I'll give it a spin just for the heck of it.

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Originally Posted by ClydebankBlitz View Post
If Woodley doesn't want to fight any contenders, he should vacate the belt.
I don't know if this is a contradiction or if I'm speaking to a different person at this point.



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He isn't getting two. The first fight ended in a draw. He never lost his title match. If you don't lose your title match, then you don't lose your opportunity. You wouldn't mind seeing Thompson fight another challenger while Woodley presumably fights someone with a better recent record...like GSP or Nick Diaz yeah?
That's a fun rule you just pulled out of your ass, I'm sure Royce Gracie, Caol Uno, and Oleg Taktarov would love to know when they are getting their new title fights.

Quote:
Why would Bjorn Rebny be scared to keep him under contract? That makes no sense what so ever. Surely having a dominant champ to rival the UFC's best was a plus if anything. For the record, I like Askren and he could definitely be a big player with the best ion the world. But you can't deny the guy's not had a decent win in nearly 4 years. Can't keep him at the top of the ladder if he's not fighting anyone.
You or I have no clue the level of competition in ONEFC but we've now had dozens of champions come from other organizations and immediately become UFC champions. Rebny dumped Askren and Kole Conrad because they didn't draw him money and they could be the best HW and WW fighters in the world but we will never know because promoters pick and choose who they want in their company.


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post #25 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 03:12 AM
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Kole Conrad retired to he could pursue something he can do in his 50s and get a nice retirement doing it. Askren shouldn't have been dumped and that was a bad choice on Bjorn's part.

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post #26 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by John8204 View Post
ACTUALLY I asked you who should have gotten the Condit shot over Woodley and you said Thompson and Maia and those were the fighters records at that time.
I'm sure I misread it when you wrote it then, because who cares about the Condit shot? We're talking about the Woodley shot.

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Just because one black guy hasn't given you a reason to be racist against them, you don't get immunity from being racist against other black people. Woodley is from Ferguson one of the most racists places in America, he won the title and has received god knows how many racist messages on twitter. And rather than extending a degree empathy or even humanity you decide to make this about you....you are the victim.
But if I'm not racist against the hundreds of black guys in the UFC, Bellator, whatever...and am exclusively holding my racism back for Tyron Woodley, I'm not entirely sure that constitutes as racism.

Richard Ayoade: "Never discount the possibility that people hate you for who you are as a person".

He probably received a lot of racist stuff on twitter. I'd say he's not received a fraction of the hatred Ronda Rousey gets. I know you hold racism at the top of the totem pole because the media tells you to, but I reckon someone telling Rousey she sucks Dana White's dick for a career is a little bit worse than someone calling Woodley a monkey.

Why should I show empathy because he's from a bad place? So what you feel is that I should allow Woodley a special pass to say wanker stuff and to get title shots over other fighters because he's from a bad place and some twitter folk were mean to him?

And lmao how am I a victim in this? You're posts are just getting more and more randomly fabricated.

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I don't believe any of those fighters you listed fought the number one contender in back to back fights, but that's beside the point because right now at this point in time the champions aren't facing the top guys except for Woodley.
Not for a lack of trying to avoid it though. I mean you're acting like Woodley is great for accepting this fight and Bisping is scum for not fighting Romero...even though Woodley acted the EXACT same as Bisping in trying to get out of his number one contender fight. If Bisping signs to fight Romero, they'd be on entirely equal playing fields (of course you'd never admit it because that would mean being impartial).

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If he beat all three guys...sure. Woodley beat Condit and was passed over, he sat for a year and half waiting for his rightful shot, because that's what happens with most of the top guys...they wait. Lets say Wonderboy beats Woodley via split decision do we then get the trilogy?
He beat Condit, put together a two fight win streak in doing so, and then lost a number one contenders fight to Rory MacDonald (you know, the guy Stephen Thompson beat to earn his title shot). He didn't get passed over.

No, why would there be a trilogy? One guy won. If Woodley wins by split decision there shouldn't be a trilogy either. If someone wins this fight, they should then face Demian Maia. Simple.

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The UFC did a garbage job promoting Woodley, Jay Hieron was supposed to be fed to Erick Silva, Silva pulled out. As a matter of fact Woodley's best performances were when the UFC didn't matchmake for him but he came in last minute.
And the UFC did a stellar job promoting Stephen Thompson? Woodley has been constantly featured on PPV broadcasts in the biggest stages. That's pretty damn good promotion.

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I don't know if this is a contradiction or if I'm speaking to a different person at this point.
Woodley does want to fight contenders, he's signed to fight Stephen Thompson. IF he refused to fight contenders, then of course, like McGregor, he should be stripped of the belt. That's not the case, henceforth, I have never once called for him to be stripped of the title and you've entirely made that up.

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That's a fun rule you just pulled out of your ass, I'm sure Royce Gracie, Caol Uno, and Oleg Taktarov would love to know when they are getting their new title fights.
It amuses me how far back you had to go just to get any references lmao. Out of curiosity, why didn't you use the more recent reference, Frankie Edgar Vs Gray Maynard?

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You or I have no clue the level of competition in ONEFC but we've now had dozens of champions come from other organizations and immediately become UFC champions. Rebny dumped Askren and Kole Conrad because they didn't draw him money and they could be the best HW and WW fighters in the world but we will never know because promoters pick and choose who they want in their company.
We have no level of the competition? That's not how MMA works mate. That's like me claiming the current BAMMA champions are the true greatest in the world because we don't know the level of competition they are fighting (which we totally do).

Regarding Askren, I'm typically in agreeance with you. Askren should have had everything thrown at him by Bellator to keep him in the org (dominance earns money. Doesn't matter if you're boring as long as you dominate). UFC also should have offered a solid chunk of money for him as well.

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post #27 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 02:00 PM
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Woodley was never ducking Thompson. He was ducking a missed opportunity to capitalize financially as the person who's holding a belt. There are fighters who fight to prove they're the best and in this day & age there are a lot more fighters staying true to the term, prize fighter. I don't know what Woodley actually thinks about McGregor as a fighter or a person, but he's mentioned numerous times that he respects McGregor's business acumen. Woodley was trying to do McGregor things, but without McGregor's clout, so it falls flat.
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post #28 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 05:36 PM
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Woodley was never ducking Thompson. He was ducking a missed opportunity to capitalize financially as the person who's holding a belt. There are fighters who fight to prove they're the best and in this day & age there are a lot more fighters staying true to the term, prize fighter. I don't know what Woodley actually thinks about McGregor as a fighter or a person, but he's mentioned numerous times that he respects McGregor's business acumen. Woodley was trying to do McGregor things, but without McGregor's clout, so it falls flat.
This is true, but until McGregor avoids Khabib/Ferg in favour of Nate, it's not the same.

Stephen Thompson is a guarantee threat. Georges St Pierre and Nick Diaz combined haven't won a UFC fight in like 7 years. GSP might be long past his prime for all we know (didn't he retire before Anderson lost?) and Nick's a much easier fight for Woodley than Thompson. That's the problem.

I kind of give him some leeway with Bisping. It's easy to callout Bisping because of his clear downsides, but like Conor fighting RDA over Edgar, it IS the champion a weight class above, you can't really deny that they are then fighting at the top. Of course, it feels a little different because it's hard to pick someone Bisping might fight next where he'd even be the favourite, but none the less I give him some passes for that.

But picking GSP, Nick or McGregor over Thompson is picking a potentially easier opponent instead of a more difficult one, that's my problem. RDA is probably harder than Edgar.

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post #29 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-11-2017, 11:19 PM
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Either way I'm glad this fight is happening.

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