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Old 10-23-2008, 09:51 PM   #21 (permalink)
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True that war Rashad.
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Old 10-23-2008, 09:54 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sinister View Post
Rampage was also better than Forrest at damn near everything and Forrest still managed to win that fight. And I wouldn't say Forrest has a good chin at all, he has amazing recovering time when he's put on his ass but he drops quite easy. It showed in the Jackson fight after he was dropped, he covered up when Jackson unleashed punches. Rashad can knock out Forrest, he just needs to be ready to get on top of him before Forrest clues in to where he is.

I don't think Rashad has bad cardio, but definatly not the greatest but that is one of the easiest things to change in your gameplan as long as you train really hard at it. Tito used to have shitty cardio and is now known for having some of the best in the LHW division.

Forrest won't sub Rashad as easy as you think, Rashad is a strong wrestler and will know how to place himself to avoid a quick submission from Forrest. But Rashad's sub defense hasn't really been tested, but I haven't seen crazy BJJ displays from Forrest either.

Forrest works with one of the best gameplan masters in Couture. But Rashad also trains at a camp known for having some of the best gameplans brought into the Octagon with Greg Jackson.

I'm not rooting for Rashad, but this fight is a hell of a lot closer than you make it out to be.
Rampage dropped him once with a clean uppercut which would knock of most everyone in the LHW division. Forrest also took full power punces from Rampage for 5 rounds and didn't get dropped again. Thats called an amazing chin unless you think Rampage like a girl. Yes your right though Forrest has incredible recovery time. People forget just because Forrest got KO'ed once that he has taken some bombs before.


Also what follow up did I see when Rampage dropped him? Forrest if I recall correctly Forrest grabbed overhooks, took time to recover, Rampage landed almost nothing on the ground and nothing with any power. You seriously need to rewatch the fight.

I just did though and while Forrests BJJ didn't look as good the second time around thats more offensively then anything else. His defense and gaurd looked great, as it did in the Shogun fight. His guard passing is still nice, so I'm quite sure he can sweep Rashad or alteast make it so that the only thing Rashad can do on the ground is lay and pray (even then that might not work).

Standing Forrest will **** Rashads legs, probably to the point where he can't walk by rd. 3

Even if he can, he'll be way to gassed from Forrest's pace to stand or defend a TD.

FTR I'm not denying Rashads power, and I know if he hits Forrest perfectly, he may KO him. But he won't TKO forrest, it has to be an absolute KO or Forrest will just grab overhooks/wrist control, rest and sweep or stand.

I honestly belive minus a flash KO which probably won't happen because of Forrests chin and gameplanning, his only chance is to lay and pray, and that won't work in the later rounds so yeah, I've definitely got Forrest winning this one.

You over estimate Rashad.
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Old 10-23-2008, 10:59 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Keep in mind Grotty, to never use fighting 'calcutators.'

Liddell > Silva
Silva > Jardine
Jardine > Liddell

It just hardly works out, so please don't try to justify why a fighter can or cannot win due to a fighters fight history. If you're going to say a fighter can or cannot win, at least say WHY. Is he a better/worse striker, wrestler, grappler, ect. Don't base it solely on your like or dislike of a fighter to speculate how a fighter will do.
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Old 10-24-2008, 12:23 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by geoff0011 View Post
Keep in mind Grotty, to never use fighting 'calcutators.'

Liddell > Silva
Silva > Jardine
Jardine > Liddell

It just hardly works out, so please don't try to justify why a fighter can or cannot win due to a fighters fight history. If you're going to say a fighter can or cannot win, at least say WHY. Is he a better/worse striker, wrestler, grappler, ect. Don't base it solely on your like or dislike of a fighter to speculate how a fighter will do.
That is rediculous. So I'm never supposed to analyze a fight. I never used MMA math friend.

I said Forrest would **** Rashads legs, and its a general implication he has better striking.

I just told you he has better BJJ, and why I said that. If Werdum subs Nog for example, I think its safe to say he has 1. Very good BJJ and 2. Chuck Liddell wouldn't be able to sub him.

The ground game is very differnet form striking, because in BJJ you don't really make mistakes. You don't 'just get caught' unless your in very preliminary stages. So yeah, if he can tool Shogun and Rampage on the ground, it's a fair assesment to say he will beat Rashad on the ground. I even went into specific aspects, saying Forrest has shown incredible defensive BJJ, and a great guard. Rashad has also shown vaunerability to subs when Tito caught that guilotine.

I can't make it much clearer then I did before, Forrest has better BJJ then Rashad and would quite easily defend Rashad on the ground, and likely sub him or sweep him.

And I don't hate Rashad either, didn't say I do. I even said his way to win.

Do you need any further clarification?
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Old 10-24-2008, 12:44 AM   #25 (permalink)
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I'ma break it all down for you. Since I don't want to multi-quote, I'll just bold my letters.

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Originally Posted by GKY View Post
That is rediculous. So I'm never supposed to analyze a fight. I never used MMA math friend.

I think he was talking to Grotty, but it's all good.

I said Forrest would **** Rashads legs, and its a general implication he has better striking.

You think that leg kicks will save him? The same leg kicks that were used against him by Jardine, Rashad's training partner? Forrest will not be sticking with the leg kicks, because he will get dropped if he does. Leg kicks leave you open to hooks, and no one wants to eat a hook from Rashad right now. And I disagree, Rashad has some of the most underrated striking.

I just told you he has better BJJ, and why I said that. If Werdum subs Nog for example, I think its safe to say he has 1. Very good BJJ and 2. Chuck Liddell wouldn't be able to sub him.

Uhm.. what? Maybe I should read your past post.. but for now I'm moving on.

The ground game is very differnet form striking, because in BJJ you don't really make mistakes. You don't 'just get caught' unless your in very preliminary stages. So yeah, if he can tool Shogun and Rampage on the ground, it's a fair assesment to say he will beat Rashad on the ground. I even went into specific aspects, saying Forrest has shown incredible defensive BJJ, and a great guard. Rashad has also shown vaunerability to subs when Tito caught that guilotine.

Where to start.. I agree. Forrest can have some great subs, but Rashad is waaaay to slippery to actually get caught and stay caught. He sweats like Shaq. Second, I doubt Forrest has much of a chance of sweeping Rashad, or getting close to a Kimura or Triange in the guard, if Rashad doesn't want you to move, YOU ARE NOT MOVING. Sure, it can be lay and pray, but his ability to pass has also greatly improved. And there is no doubt in my mind that he can get full mount and knock him out a la Lambert. I agree, Forrest has a great guard, so it will be a tough one to pass, but Rashad is a wrestler at heart. Plus, Forrest got knocked out in the guard by Jardine.

I can't make it much clearer then I did before, Forrest has better BJJ then Rashad and would quite easily defend Rashad on the ground, and likely sub him or sweep him.

He has better BJJ for sure. But it won't be too affected if he keeps it standing, which Rashad would knock him out. And if it does get on the ground, Rashad will stay on top.

And I don't hate Rashad either, didn't say I do. I even said his way to win.

I started on TUF, rooting for Forrest Griffin and Chris all the way. And Forrest has ways to win as well, I just didn't get into them.

Do you need any further clarification?
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Old 10-24-2008, 01:28 AM   #26 (permalink)
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I really want Forrest to win this fight, but all I'm seeing when I close my eyes is Rashad with the belt around his waist. I guess he's simply a bad matchup for Forrest Griffin.
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Old 10-24-2008, 02:17 AM   #27 (permalink)
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I'm thinking that Rashad will take this. The arguments for Griffin are founded, but he fought Rampage and Shogun on their worst nights. I think that Rashad is more well rounded than Griffin, and as long as he can get inside, will have a good night ahead of him.
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Old 10-24-2008, 06:11 PM   #28 (permalink)
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If you're going to quote me GKY, at least read what I had written. Could just be a mistake, thought I was attacking you, so in return you get defensive and try to attack me, but I wasn't even referring to you. But please, pay more attention next time.
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Old 10-24-2008, 07:07 PM   #29 (permalink)
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My prediction

I’m sorry, but most people commenting here don’t know anything about fighting. Just internet nerds who think they know everything, and get all the expertise in video games. This fight is extremely close, as for people commenting on Griffins past fights. If you actually watched Griffin, he was losing to the fight with Shogun, what gave out was Shoguns Cardio big time. It was plain as sight you can see it late first round, as for second round he was totally gassed. Griffin’s cardio was nothing great in that fight. It was simply, Shogun came to the fight in bad shape. As for the fight with Rampage, it was obvious Rampage wasn’t at his best. As for Rashad Evans, everyone is a fool for down rating his stand up. He has some of the most clean hitting boxing striking, I have ever seen. His speed and power with his striking is on par with some professional boxers. His stand up is second to no one, and I would consider it even better then Anderson Silva when it came to pure striking. The guy is undefeated for a reason, and I have nothing against the guys fighting style myself. My prediction for this fight:
Evans vs. Griffin
Evans KO Griffin = First three rounds
Griffin submitting Evans = Round 1 – 5
I have no clue what the coaches of Evans or Griffin is telling them how to train for this fight. This greatly determines the fight in general. Knowing Griffins coach’s they will have Griffin stand up with him and look for opportunities for takedowns and ground and pound/submissions. If Griffin is smart he will take this to the ground. If Evans up’s his cardio, and comes into this fight prepared he could easily win this fight.

If Evans keeps the fight standing, I give the fight to Evans. If Griffin can take him down I give it to Griffin. I foresee it ending early by KO for Evans, or submitted by Griffin. Both of these guys have a nice chin so I believe it will go the distance. In which it will go to as stated above. Knowing Griffin, he likes to stand and bang why I believe he will lose this fight for this reason alone. Rampage fight was evident of that.

Last edited by Johnathanrs : 10-24-2008 at 07:12 PM.
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Old 10-24-2008, 07:20 PM   #30 (permalink)
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No need to try and be offensive Jonathan, but I got to admit every time I read this thread, it seems more and more ridiculous. I'm not saying that Rashad is a better fighter than Forrest, but I wouldn't have said that he would beat Chuck either. There is always a chance, no matter how sure you are.
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