Trainer: Georges St. Pierre has better MMA jiu-jitsu than BJ Penn (Video) - Page 2 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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View Poll Results: Who do you give the advantage to on the ground?

B.J Penn 63 57.27%
Georges St Pierre 47 42.73%
Voters: 110. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-08-2008, 02:58 PM   #11 (permalink)
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except what people keep forgetting is that bjj isn't mma ground game...functional strenght, wrestling, control, strikes need to be added into the mix...and with that said gsp has a better ground game than bj penn...i don't really understand the whole "mma bjj" cuz it's irrevelant when your getting punched in the face at the same time....

STOP SAYING MMA BJJ and start saying ground game
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Old 11-08-2008, 03:04 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by drockh View Post
BJ without question has a far better ground game.
Depends on which BJ shows up. Did you happen to see what Hughes did to BJ on the ground?
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Old 11-08-2008, 03:19 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Aaronyman View Post
except what people keep forgetting is that bjj isn't mma ground game...functional strenght, wrestling, control, strikes need to be added into the mix...and with that said gsp has a better ground game than bj penn...i don't really understand the whole "mma bjj" cuz it's irrevelant when your getting punched in the face at the same time....

STOP SAYING MMA BJJ and start saying ground game
well put it does get old hearing that crap its still bjj but with punching and kicking envolved simple as that
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Old 11-08-2008, 03:21 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Toxic View Post
This is ridicoulous to even debate, GSP may have as good of a top game and that is a big maybe but BJ is much more dangerous on his back than GSP, I cant wait for this fight.
Yet, BJ hasn't subbed anyone off his back in MMA. I'm not saying he's incapable, but the truth is, most of BJ's submission victories have come from taking dominant positions over his opponents. When he first fought GSP he could never get into those positions because he was always on the bottom. He tried stuff from there, but GSP avoided everything. I'm a huge BJ Penn fan, but let's not go saying his guard is some sort of spider-web of instant doom.


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Originally Posted by Aaronyman View Post
except what people keep forgetting is that bjj isn't mma ground game...functional strenght, wrestling, control, strikes need to be added into the mix...and with that said gsp has a better ground game than bj penn...i don't really understand the whole "mma bjj" cuz it's irrevelant when your getting punched in the face at the same time....

STOP SAYING MMA BJJ and start saying ground game
MMA-BJJ refers to the integration of strikes to set-up BJJ submissions and guard passing. Wrestling is control, but so is BJJ on the ground---from top and bottom positions, whereas wrestling has more to do with keeping/getting the fight where you want it to be.

Sean Sherk has great wrestling because more often than not he can take the fight where he wants it. He also has a good MMA-BJJ top game because he can control, and pass to side control by setting-up with strikes. BJJ takes over when the fight hits the ground, wrestling is the means of getting it there although the line between the two is very thin.

Last edited by Fedor>all : 11-08-2008 at 03:24 PM.
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Old 11-08-2008, 03:52 PM   #15 (permalink)
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GSP has the better ground game, BJ has the better jitz. Isn't that what it says in the video anyway?
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Old 11-08-2008, 04:09 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Better MMA jiu jitsu?? LOL, thats funny. BJ has never been submitted in MMA. I seem to recall Hughes nearly taking off GSP's arm. Throw in the fact that GSP could do nothing in BJ's guard. All he did was lay and pray himself to a victory in that first fight. He did no damage, couldnt pass his guard and just layed there.

Ok, so here come all the GSP lovers crying about how much better GSp has gotten since then. Fair enough, he got better. But BJ has gotten improved just as much. I dont know if BJ even trained for that first fight with GSP. He was gassed very early and GSP still couldnt do anything. Since the first fight BJ has inproved just as much GSp, so it should be a great fight. But to say GSP has better mma bjj is just crazy. He submitted an over the hill Matt Hughes and all of a sudden the GSP fanboys think he's the Nogueira of mma jiu jitsu.
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Old 11-08-2008, 04:10 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toxic View Post
This is ridicoulous to even debate, GSP may have as good of a top game and that is a big maybe but BJ is much more dangerous on his back than GSP, I cant wait for this fight.
How do we know what gsp can do from his back how often do we see him on his back? you said it in your opening line
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Old 11-08-2008, 04:31 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Did anyone listen to the interview? His trainer said that he thinks GSP has a better ground game than BJ. He did not state this as a fact, he gave his opinion.
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Old 11-08-2008, 05:09 PM   #19 (permalink)
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are we talking about ground game or bjj because like people have mentioned its two different things. Bj is definitely better at bjj but i think gsp can control him on the ground and win the fight
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Old 11-08-2008, 05:16 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdun11 View Post
Better MMA jiu jitsu?? LOL, thats funny. BJ has never been submitted in MMA. I seem to recall Hughes nearly taking off GSP's arm. Throw in the fact that GSP could do nothing in BJ's guard. All he did was lay and pray himself to a victory in that first fight. He did no damage, couldnt pass his guard and just layed there.
There's an obvious counter to that argument, in the fact that BJ couldn't do anything with Georges inside his guard.

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Originally Posted by jdun11 View Post
Ok, so here come all the GSP lovers crying about how much better GSp has gotten since then. Fair enough, he got better. But BJ has gotten improved just as much.
I love BJ, I really do. But the only dramatic improvements in his game (since losing to Hughes) have come in the form of better conditioning, and probably crisper boxing. He's always been a dangerous striker, and he's always been a phenomenal grappler, especially when he's on top. Once again, he's never been anywhere near as dangerous off his back in MMA as he is when he is on top.


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Originally Posted by jdun11 View Post
I dont know if BJ even trained for that first fight with GSP. He was gassed very early and GSP still couldnt do anything.
Give me a break, BJ trains for every fight. He was simply outwrestled and controlled for rounds 2 and 3, by a much larger and naturally athletic opponent.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jdun11 View Post
Since the first fight BJ has inproved just as much GSp, so it should be a great fight. But to say GSP has better mma bjj is just crazy. He submitted an over the hill Matt Hughes and all of a sudden the GSP fanboys think he's the Nogueira of mma jiu jitsu.
No one is saying he's the "Nogueira of MMA BJJ", way to blow it out of proportion. GSP has been able to outgrapple every single person he has faced in the octagon, except for Matt Hughes---a loss he avenged through drastic improvement in his ground game---and BJ, who also couldn't do anything with GSP on the ground.

Where has BJ improved? BJ is more or less the same fighter GSP fought the first time, with better boxing technique and better cardio (at 155, who knows at 170?). His ground game is great, as always (from the top position) but he's never been known for pulling-off subs from his back. I definitely think GSP has grown more since the two fighters last met, although they're both very complete fighters in their own rights.

Last edited by Fedor>all : 11-08-2008 at 05:18 PM.
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