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Old 12-11-2008, 03:48 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Swick vs. Goulet, punches to the back of the head?

I just re-watched Swick/Goulet and felt like Goulet got hit 5 to 10 times to the back and/or top of his head (top of the head falls under the rule too, explained further). It's kinda hard to tell from that camera angle and that's why I'm asking your opinion.

*This is not a controversial thread to question Swick's performance which was impressive IMO or to take anything away from Mike (FYI I was rooting for him)*

This thread is also about this "strikes to the back of the head" rule that confuses me a lot as I saw some fighters getting 1 point deduction for hitting that area a couple of times after being warned once only, and some other fighters not being warned at all for doing it (maybe what happened yesterday?) or being warned 3/4 times or even more and not being penalized afterwards (GSP/Hughes).

Steve Mazzagatti (not the best ref out there but still a ref) was being interviewed to explain his point deduction against Lesnar and he was basically saying "the back of the head is considered to be the center line from the back of the neck (spine area), all the way to the top of the head, basically the mo hawk area" meaning you can't hit anywhere on the spine/back of the neck, center area in the back and top of the head.

Direct link to what Mazzagatti said:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKMQ2xoaHjI#t=2m


Full interview:



Discuss.

Last edited by N1™ : 12-11-2008 at 04:23 PM.
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Old 12-11-2008, 03:52 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Xerxes View Post
I just re-watched Swick/Goulet and felt like Goulet got hit 5 to 10 times to the back and/or top of his head (top of the head falls under the rule too, explained further). It's kinda hard to tell from that camera angle and that's why I'm asking your opinion.
I was wondering about that during the fight. It looked pretty close to the top/back of the head, but I think it was mostly hammer fists to the side of the head.

Quote:
This thread is also about this "strikes to the back of the head" rule that confuses me a lot as I saw some fighters getting 1 point deduction for hitting that area a couple of times after being warned once only, and some other fighters not being warned at all for doing it (maybe what happened yesterday?) or being warned 3/4 times or even more and not being penalized afterwards (GSP/Hughes).
So it seems like it's up to the ref's discretion.
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Old 12-11-2008, 04:02 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I was thinking the same thing during the fight i was like wow no warning for those shots to the back of the head?? Either way i think this was swicks fight but i still couldn't believe there wasn't atleast a warning for those shots.
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Old 12-11-2008, 05:24 PM   #4 (permalink)
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During the fight I thought the shots looked suspicious, but then when I saw the replay it seemed like they all connected either at the side or the top of the head.

In that video with Mazz, when he pulls his piece of paper up along the back of his head he pulls it almost to his forehead, but I doubt that he really means to pull it that far, because he says "all the way to the top of the head", which I think implies that the actual top of the head is not an illegal area to hit.
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Old 12-11-2008, 05:36 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Old 12-11-2008, 05:45 PM   #6 (permalink)
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from what i understand, it's only the base of the skull that should be avoided..i HATE in the midst of punches a guy turns so he's hitting the back of the head...i mean, it's a goddam fight ....it's a stupid rule and needs to be changed
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Old 12-11-2008, 05:48 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Your right it does look like he might have hit him in back of the head.
There are a bunch of inconsistancies between refs in the UFC. There is also so much to keep an eye for them. With the fast action in the Swick fight I don't know if he could have seen the hits, warned Mike and then broke them up in time.
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Old 12-11-2008, 06:55 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Couchwarrior View Post
In that video with Mazz, when he pulls his piece of paper up along the back of his head he pulls it almost to his forehead, but I doubt that he really means to pull it that far, because he says "all the way to the top of the head", which I think implies that the actual top of the head is not an illegal area to hit.
I'm even more confused now. IMO when he talks about the "Mo Hawk rule" he clearly means the center line of the top of the head falls under this rule. Basically you have to imagine your opponent with a mo hawk (Chuck lol) and avoid hitting him on the hair.
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Old 12-12-2008, 04:47 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Xerxes View Post
I'm even more confused now. IMO when he talks about the "Mo Hawk rule" he clearly means the center line of the top of the head falls under this rule. Basically you have to imagine your opponent with a mo hawk (Chuck lol) and avoid hitting him on the hair.
You're right, I didn't pay attention to that part. So at least according to Mazz then, it's illegal to hit your opponent directly to the back of the head or the neck, or the top of the head all the way to the forehead. That's a huge area.

So then Swick's blows were illegal after all. Or at least would have been if Mazz was reffing.
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Old 12-12-2008, 05:16 AM   #10 (permalink)
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It's called the mohawk rule. And I think it's pretty lame for anyone to get heated up (not saying you are) about someone landing a strike to the back of the head when a fighter has already been stunned and the other fighter is just pouncing with a flurry. Obviously there's gonna be some strikes landed to the back of the head. After all, the head is round, not square.
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