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post #11 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 04:41 PM
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Question is; can Nog sink in a triangle on Brock's goliath arm and neck??
That's a legitimate question. Nog had Couture sunk in a couple of times and it's too obvious to point out the structural and ridiculous strength variance between Brock and Randy.

Cleeeeaaaarly Nog is more talented, but Brock is sooooo much more beast and I don't know that the relative margin of talent superiority to beast-mongering ratio will, balance out in Nog's favor as he expects.
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post #12 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 04:51 PM
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That's a legitimate question. Nog had Couture sunk in a couple of times and it's too obvious to point out the structural and ridiculous strength variance between Brock and Randy.

Cleeeeaaaarly Nog is more talented, but Brock is sooooo much more beast and I don't know that the relative margin of talent superiority to beast-mongering ratio will, balance out in Nog's favor as he expects.
is lesnar structurally bigger than bob sapp? I think nog can summit him but as for a choke it might be hard for him to get lesnar. But nog can do it if gracie can get dan severn nog can get lesnar.
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post #13 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 05:05 PM
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The guy who said technique beats strength didn't watch Mir vs. Lesnar 2.And to the guy who pointed out Royce Gracie's triangle on Severn, I think Brock has a little bit better sub defense training than Severn did at that time.Nog vs. Couture was a bad idea. Because no matter who won, people would think that they were back to the original form. Nog beating a 46 year old legend does not equal betting Brock. Nog would get mauled by lesnar. He would not sweep him or submit him. Lesnar vs. Nog=Mir vs. Lesnar except an earlier finish.
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post #14 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 05:12 PM
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The guy who said technique beats strength didn't watch Mir vs. Lesnar 2.And to the guy who pointed out Royce Gracie's triangle on Severn, I think Brock has a little bit better sub defense training than Severn did at that time.Nog vs. Couture was a bad idea. Because no matter who won, people would think that they were back to the original form. Nog beating a 46 year old legend does not equal betting Brock. Nog would get mauled by lesnar. He would not sweep him or submit him. Lesnar vs. Nog=Mir vs. Lesnar except an earlier finish.
ur forgetting mir won against brock by luck, but randy put up a great fight just got ko but was able to stop the ground and pound. Now u have nog who has better submission than mir, and a better stand up game along with a better chin than randy. That 46 year old did the best job i've seen against brock. But saying he would get mauled by brock is crazy cause if brock gets crazy on the ground he'll get submitted. Plus stand up nog can bang with brock.
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post #15 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 05:50 PM
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I think that if Brock has been training his technique really hard he could stand a chance.(athough it still wouldn't come close to Nog, who's top game has even seemed to improve)

But I think that Nog definitely has a chance to win, I'd say that fight is 50/50

But then again... I would love to see Brock lose, so I don't know how valid my opinion is. :P


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post #16 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 06:12 PM
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Mir has a lot more technique than Lesnar. He kept on spouting off on all the stuff he would throw at Lesnar, that Lesnar had never seen. Well, you can have all the technique in the world and still get beat. Mir had a bad gameplan.

I easily can see this going the way of Lesnar/Mir II. If Nog comes in over confident just because from a technical stand point he is superiour, I could see this being a very short night for Nog.
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post #17 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 06:37 PM
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is lesnar structurally bigger than bob sapp? I think nog can summit him but as for a choke it might be hard for him to get lesnar. But nog can do it if gracie can get dan severn nog can get lesnar.
What does Gracie/Severn have anything to do with Nog/Lesnar? One BJJ fighters abilities & accomplishments does not have any implications on another. Also, how does Bob Sapp have anything to do with anything in this conversation of "current affairs"?

Let me break down the logic of what I was responding to:

A). Nog struggled to lock Randy down, even when he had a formidable hold/position on Randy (a couple of times).

B). Therefore, the issue regarding Nog having struggled to lock a submission against Randy, brings a relevant inquiry as to how this specific issue could be applied to an enormously stronger and significantly larger opponent.

C)(i). Nog beat Sapp in August 28, 2002. Nog's latest "issue" was on display a month ago. Unlike the theological concept of "once saved, always saved," fighters don't have the grace of "once able, always able," Furthermore,....

C)(ii). Sapp is a turtle on his back and he cried when he got punched by Mirco. The inadequacies of one giant fighter does not implicate all the others and Brock is an especially prominent exception to the flaws historically suffered by "big fighters."

Do I think Nog has a chance against Brock? Yes, do I genuinely question his ability to submit Brock, based on Nog's latest performance against a weaker, smaller, arguably slower and much older opponent? Yes. Just to clarify, clearly Nog dominated Couture in general, that's not the issue, it's the specific moments of his inability to seal the deal from a decent position on multiple occasions (therefore, less likely that they were mere fluke escapes).
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post #18 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 06:50 PM
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What does Gracie/Severn have anything to do with Nog/Lesnar? One BJJ fighters abilities & accomplishments does not have any implications on another. Also, how does Bob Sapp have anything to do with anything in this conversation of "current affairs"?

Let me break down the logic of what I was responding to:

A). Nog struggled to lock Randy down, even when he had a formidable hold/position on Randy (a couple of times).

B). Therefore, the issue regarding Nog having struggled to lock a submission against Randy, brings a relevant inquiry as to how this specific issue could be applied to an enormously stronger and significantly larger opponent.

C)(i). Nog beat Sapp in August 28, 2002. Nog's latest "issue" was on display a month ago. Unlike the theological concept of "once saved, always saved," fighters don't have the grace of "once able, always able," Furthermore,....

C)(ii). Sapp is a turtle on his back and he cried when he got punched by Mirco. The inadequacies of one giant fighter does not implicate all the others and Brock is an especially prominent exception to the flaws historically suffered by "big fighters."

Do I think Nog has a chance against Brock? Yes, do I genuinely question his ability to submit Brock, based on Nog's latest performance against a weaker, smaller, arguably slower and much older opponent? Yes. Just to clarify, clearly Nog dominated Couture in general, that's not the issue, it's the specific moments of his inability to seal the deal from a decent position on multiple occasions (therefore, less likely that they were mere fluke escapes).
Naw i was just pointing out that nog has faced and submitted a guys as big as brock in sap. Also with the gracie thing i was just saying his bbj skills is capable of choking out brock which above asked if he could do it. So the size difference between gracie and severn shows that sizes don't matter. Sum it all up nog is very capable of beating brock via submission. Which some people think in this thread is impossible.
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post #19 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 06:51 PM
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The big difference in Nog not being able to sub Randy and possibly subbing Brock is that randy has been doing this for years and your not going to throw a technique at him that he hasnt seen or drilled a thousand plus times. Not only is randy a great fighter, he is one of the best coaches in the game. Look at all the great fighters who have gone to extreme couture to train with this dude. Randy is lightyears ahead of brock when it comes to the submission game. Not a knock on Brock, its just that its impossible for him to have attained even half of the knowledge about mma that Randy has at this point. That is one of those things that can only come with time and many years of training.
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post #20 of 49 (permalink) Old 09-10-2009, 06:53 PM
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agree with above....just look how brock was not able to keep randy on the ground.
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