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Old 12-14-2006, 08:44 AM   #1 (permalink)
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A Closer Look at Kos vs. Joslin...

I'm making this thread not to contest the outcome but to examine what was going on more closely.


Off the bat I want to say that this fight was great by both fighters.

Kos is probably one of the best grapplers to start making it big. His takedown power is probably only matched by the likes of Sherk, Hughes, and Karo (when and if he feels like it). Kos played a wonderful game of survival and knew what the judges wanted and knew what to do to keep himself safe. This is a great tactic for winning fights and by no means does it make him a bad fighter (doing what it takes to win is what it's all about).

Every time Kos tried to stnad with Joslin...Jeff landed some good, solid hits. In fact I think Kos actually has a weak chin...for some of those shots wouldn't have rocked him if he was more solid in the jaw. Kos, seeing/knowing he was unable to stand then proceeded to shoot more often (most often all it took was one to get Jeff down). All but one of them was executed very well. He was able to get a hold of both of Jeff's legs and prevent him from getting a good sprawl & slipping a leg out (when agianst the cage) for a defensive takedown knee.

Jeff was just as impressive as Kos was when it came to both offense and defense. Jeff's stand up was impressive. He had good form, stance, and distance when he was using stand up. On almost all the takedowns Jeff was quick to execute a sprawl. The sprawls were quick but not fast enough and not as good technique wise to be able to break his lags back away from Kos's grip. Many of the takedowns Jeff defended from the center of the ring all the way to the cage.

Once at the cage though, Kos's strength got the upper hand. and the takedowns happened. This is where I was impressed with Jeff the most. A lot of people couldn't see it, but Jeff (in two cases in particular) was using his position on the bottom and shifting his hips to flip Kos. When they were agianst the fence Kos is putting a lot of pressure on the left side of Jeff. It is at this moment that Jeff tries to roll Kos over but was unable because the cage ended up supporting Kos. He makes several attempts but can't get it off....(I think some of it was Kos trying to use the cage although I'm unsure what he was thinking). The second time was when they were in the same position in the middle of the Octagon. Kos feeling the pressure of another roll...picks Jeff up and moves him to the cage (good job on Kos's part). I don't remember off hand which round it was but about 20 seconds before the round was over Jeff was working his legs into a really nice triangle. Watching him work from the bottom like that was wonderful. Jeff did a great job on defense...he was always in full guard and was always working his hips to prevent Kos from either changing position or getting in position for G&P (except for that one time when Kos caught him agianst the fence and he was high up in his guard). To bad the judges don't score points for defensive guard skills.


Although Kos won the fight..I think he actually did the least (except for that one breif moment where he was able to get a few elbows in). Proof of this was that once he slammed Jeff a few times. He actually didn't do much other than takedowns. Proof of his inexperience was toward the end of the fight when Kos caught Jeff in perfect side control and then jumped right back into Jeff's guard instead of using G&P or going for an Arm bar. The match really showed that even those Kos is a great fighter he will need to round out his skills and work on his stand up so that it's ready for times when he is unable to take down his opponent. to be able to beat the likes of Hughes and GSP in a possible title shot in the future.

End note: I want to see Joslin in a few more fights in the UFC. I think if he works on his take down defense a little more he will be able to hang with the best of them and have no problem dealing with wrestlers (body strength and shoots).
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:58 AM   #2 (permalink)
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I have yet to see an exciting Josh Kozchek fight, He is not a finisher. Koz got stood up 5 times for inactivity.
Everyone here keeps saying how great he is, His standup did'nt look good at all. I have to see Kos beat a top ww before I give him credit for bieng an A fighter. I will admit Koz's wrestling and takedowns are second to none. But overall he is boring.

Karo vs Fickett, now that was a great fight
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:29 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I agree with the defensive point comment. I wish they took that into account. That's the same way I felt about Diaz vs. Sanchez... Diaz was reversing and rolling and preventing anything major from being done, but in the end, the guy on top gets the glory.

I think this fight showed two things:

1. All you Koscheck fans that think he is the next in line, are going to have to wait longer. He is not ready to take over the division, and IMO he's not even in the top five. He has a long way to go before he's well rounded enough to fight anybody good.

2. Jeff Joslin is actually pretty good. I've never seen someone display a better use of the butterfly guard.
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:31 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robb2140
I have yet to see an exciting Josh Kozchek fight, He is not a finisher. Koz got stood up 5 times for inactivity.
Everyone here keeps saying how great he is, His standup did'nt look good at all. I have to see Kos beat a top ww before I give him credit for bieng an A fighter. I will admit Koz's wrestling and takedowns are second to none. But overall he is boring.

Karo vs Fickett, now that was a great fight

I think with a record of 8-1 with 4 Subs and 1 KO to which all but 1 of those ended in the first round kinda speaks agianst your thoughts that he isn't a finisher.



I will agree with you that his stand up is deplorable. And no I don't think he's a great fighter. I think he still has a long way to go. If he can better his stand up or better his ground game..his overall game will greatly improve just based on his wrestling ability....like Sherk...only with more reach. If he doesn't start improving his game in those areas he will begin to get beat downs and his record will start to look like Riggs's does now. Great wins with mounting great loses.
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Old 12-14-2006, 10:01 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Koscheck did what he had to do to win. It wasn't the most entertaining thing, but it really wasn't THAT boring.

Joslin is good on his feet, and really good on the ground. He completely neutralized Koscheck for the most part. People who say Koscheck didn't try to do much didn't really watch the fight. Because, everytime Koscheck even tried some GnP, Joslin would shift positions. Jeff Joslin was a really dangerous opponent for Kos, and should be brought back. Do I agree with the scoring? Not really, I would've probably had it split. Joslin worked, and was tagging Koscheck on his feet.

However, I still thought Koscheck won. He executed some nice slams, and utilized some GnP(When he actually could). Joslin had some nice standup, but he was on the defensive a lot. Still, Jeff Joslin is pretty good, and should be brought back. I'd really like to see Joslin vs Diaz myself.

I think everyone is giving Koscheck time to evolve. I'm still giving him 2 years. People who say "He looked horrible!", obviously didn't really watch the fight. Koscheck fought the smartest fight he could.
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Old 12-14-2006, 10:12 AM   #6 (permalink)
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All I have to say is that I cannot believe Koscheck had the audacity to call out Georges St. Pierre during his post-interview.

What the hell was he thinking? I would love to see Koscheck get his request and have them throw St. Pierre at him so he can get spanked.

It is not bad to be cocky, but you have to know your limits.

I am also definitely looking forward to seeing Joslin fight again, he seems to have great potential. His body structure seems small however, so he would do better in the 155lbs division.
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Old 12-14-2006, 10:50 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I agree, I was sitting there watching this fight and Kos never changes his style. He is great at getting a take down but once he is there he just lays on them and hopes the ref doesn't stand them up. His first fight with Leben and pretty much every fight since then have been that way. I really don't think he should be commended for this and if he keeps up this style he will never be a legit contender. Going back to the other post wondering why he never gets any "real" competition this would be one reason as to why, if he gets in there with anyone who is worth anything he will get walked all over. I wouldn't mind seeing a rematch with Kos and Leben.
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Old 12-14-2006, 11:00 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I agree, I was sitting there watching this fight and Kos never changes his style. He is great at getting a take down but once he is there he just lays on them and hopes the ref doesn't stand them up. His first fight with Leben and pretty much every fight since then have been that way. I really don't think he should be commended for this and if he keeps up this style he will never be a legit contender. Going back to the other post wondering why he never gets any "real" competition this would be one reason as to why, if he gets in there with anyone who is worth anything he will get walked all over. I wouldn't mind seeing a rematch with Kos and Leben.
I actually think he should be commended.... Although he isn't well rounded...what he does ..he does very very well. Joslin isn't easy to take down. He has a good sprawl and he's great on the ground. He should not be commended for his performance as a whole. It's only a matter of time (as you've already stated) before he starts to go up agianst people with better or equal takedown defense/offense...I think the next match should be Karo vs Kos.
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Old 12-14-2006, 11:01 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Beeno
I agree with the defensive point comment. I wish they took that into account. That's the same way I felt about Diaz vs. Sanchez... Diaz was reversing and rolling and preventing anything major from being done, but in the end, the guy on top gets the glory.

I think this fight showed two things:

1. All you Koscheck fans that think he is the next in line, are going to have to wait longer. He is not ready to take over the division, and IMO he's not even in the top five. He has a long way to go before he's well rounded enough to fight anybody good.

2. Jeff Joslin is actually pretty good. I've never seen someone display a better use of the butterfly guard.
Of course the top guy gets the glory. Are you listening to what your saying. The guy on top is the one controlling the fight. If your constanly getting put on your back and all your doing is keeping a guy from pounding your face in why should you get points for that. Thats like saying you should get points for avoiding punches. Thats stupid as hell. Joslin couldn't defend the takedown. He wasn't even close to as strong Kos. Anytime Kos wanted him on the ground he put him there. The only time Joslin controlled the fight was when he jabbed Kos a couple times. Other than that he was completely dominated. I agree Kos needs to work on his GnP he should be able to stay more busy when he is on top.
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Old 12-14-2006, 11:29 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Joslin <3

Koscheck was probably the worst possible opponent for him...anyone else, especially someone willing to stand with him is gonna get KTFO.

excited to see Joslin again...and train with him this summer
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