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Old 11-04-2009, 03:40 PM   #101 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by name goes here View Post
Proof is important. Otherwise we'd all be fighting like Steven Segal.

I think palm strikes are good for people without strong wrists, such as women, and then there is the opportunity to 'claw' at the eyes (like Chuck Liddel lol). If you are a skilled gouger, open handed strikes would be superior. Plus there is less chance of damaging your hand.

Otherwise a punch gives a bit more reach, and is a harder contact. And perhaps you don't want to gouge.
The middle bit is very true. There's no point throwing a punch if your wrist might jellyfish.
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Old 11-04-2009, 05:19 PM   #102 (permalink)
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i dunno, as someone who used to break wooden boards and a brick or two while taking tae kwon do, the reason i used my open palm was NOT because it was more effective then my fist, it's because i didn't want to break my knuckles on a brick. There were some black belts and double strike black belts that could break bricks with their hands but after the demonstration they were always in the back icing and putting on herbal medicinal oils on their fist, they obviously felt it.

I was making fun of the guy because saying a well placed palm strike could kill a man isn't saying anything. So what? You name a part of the human body that has a hard bone near the surface of the skin and i can probably find someone who has died from being hit by it.

Technically, a punch is just more effective then a open palm especially given the padded gloves MMA fighters wear.
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Old 11-04-2009, 05:44 PM   #103 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terror Kovenant View Post
When you throw a punch a portion of the force is disperses through your joints (elbow, wrist, and knuckles) so the total force you throw with is not the force that is transfered into your target. A proper palm strike actually has less of its force diffused out through other places and thus gives a higher transfer energy into the opponenet. Also, due to the structure of the bottom of the place it makes it a much more effect tool of striking on solid surfaces than a fist. So if you strike someone in the skull you can do a lot more damage with a palm than a first. There have been plenty of people who have been killed by punches to the head, and given what I just laid out, the probably of potential to kill a man with a palm strike to the skull is higher. Also, the palm strike has a higher chance of breaking ribs and if you strike towards the heart you can severely injure your opponent. Lungren put Stallone in the hospital with an injury to the heart from a punch to the chest. Don't think its not possible to stop someones heart by hitting them in the chest.
I agree scientifically its probably more efficient but so is a Honda prius....
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Old 11-04-2009, 07:22 PM   #104 (permalink)
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Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
thank you Samuel L Jackson... or should i say Gin Rummy?

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http://www.experiencefestival.com/a/...hes/id/2094696
http://en.allexperts.com/e/s/st/strike_(attack).htm
http://martialartsguides.com/Striking_Codes.html
http://www.closequarterscombat.com/b...-or-palm-heel/
http://jiu-jitsusensei.blogspot.com/...hing-with.html

hear, look at stuff on the internet some more.
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Old 11-04-2009, 09:01 PM   #105 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Jesy Blue View Post
The first three links are all exactly the same definitions., namely this: "Many Chinese martial arts teach the Iron Palm, which in the hands of a trained practicioner, can send a more penetrating shock into the body."

You never write a "more" part of a sentence without finishing with the "than" part but lousy writing aside I'll assume they mean more than a fist.

The 4th is a guy explaining that it is good to use palm strikes to avoid breaking your hand. He makes no mention of it being superior to a fist in effectiveness.

The 5th is an account from a guy who used a palm strike to hit a guy in the nose and again makes the point that it is easy to break your hand when you hit with a fist. This guy does suggest that sometimes a palm strike can be as or more effective than a fist.

I never said palm strikes were useless and I don't dispute that they have an advantage over fists in reduced risk of injury. The issue I have is people saying they are more effective than fists but not showing me any evidence of that. Of those links only the 5th one provides any evidence of that, an experienced martial artist who is of that opinion. Weak evidence but at least it is something, so if you want to call that gin, knock yourself out.

It isn't compelling enough to make me reconsider my position but at least 1 out of 5 isn't complete air.
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Old 11-04-2009, 10:27 PM   #106 (permalink)
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What about downward chopping motions with the side of the palm instead of punching with the fist. There are definitely some angles of attack there which are way easier hitting with the side of the hand than having to turn the hand and make it hit with the knuckles.

Karate CHOP!
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Old 11-04-2009, 11:44 PM   #107 (permalink)
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So in relation to palm strikes, i see people saying lesser chance of injury to/breaking the hand. But what about the increased chance of severe sprain or hyperextension using open palm?

I could see many scenarios where this would be a potential danger, but I don't train striking.
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Old 11-04-2009, 11:47 PM   #108 (permalink)
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Hi guys,
Im a big fan of the palm heel and I cant understand why more people donít use them in mma,I find allot of info out there on the palm heel is based on theory,but personally ive always preffered facts
Heres a couple of clips of me explaining the way i palm heel their street defence based but hopefully you can see the aplication for mma,on the second clip you can see how effective they can be

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RN_3IAZX8IE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CArhr...eature=related

if the interests here ill go into more detail of were i think the advantages would be

cheers
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:01 AM   #109 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drogo View Post
I never said palm strikes were useless and I don't dispute that they have an advantage over fists in reduced risk of injury. The issue I have is people saying they are more effective than fists but not showing me any evidence of that.
oooooh that's what this is all about? i'm not saying they are more or less effective, i'm just saying the fist is easier and the current MMA glove/wrist/wrap set up hinders open hands.

this is why i'm confused with your search for proof. i'm sitting here going "proof of what? that it's difficult to throw a palm strike in a cage.... duh!"

if you want someone to argue about the effectiveness of punches vs open hand attacks you're on the wrong guy. i like my palm heels and puma paws and leopard strikes and yes, the occasional tiger claw; but there is the time and place for even the right cross, left hook, straight jab and the uppercut and every once in a great while the SHORYUKEN!

sorry to waste your time in the wrong direction.
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:08 AM   #110 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by HexRei View Post
that wasn't even a palm strike, just a straight up bitchslap.
hes slapping with the finger tips wiping across like you say a bitch slap,if it was a bit deeper on the side of the head he could use the palm heel hook or even a full hand slap with a lot more wieght going into the target,i also notice the extra distance you can get with the open hand compared with the boxing hook and how it sets up the cross really well.

cheers
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