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Old 11-21-2009, 03:19 PM   #51 (permalink)
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I FU<KING HATE THE IGNORANCE IN THIS THREAD.

most people are great, and know their stuff, but some people are so ignorant it almost hurts just to read their comments. it's disgusting.


I had a 2 year addiction to codeine, morphine, heroin, oxycodone, hydrocodone, buprenorphine, methadone and fentanyl, not to mention the diazepam, oxazepam, alprazolam and others, all of which cost me around $150 a day. (roughly $1,000 a week on narcotics only)

the first year i was happy in my addiction, and was a 'functioning addict'. After 12 months however, some terrible things happened in life and i urgently, urgently needed to quit. I was becoming a liability to my family and the ones i love most. I wanted desperately to quit. I needed to quit. I had no option but to quit. And yet... i could not quit. I attempted suicide multiple times, and nearly succeeded twice. it wasn't out of depression, but simply i knew that if i could not quit then staying around would hurt and destroy my family.

I lost my career, my partner, my health, my self esteem, and much more because of my addiction. I tried to quit every way you could think of - and i mean every. single. way. the things i did to try and quit i could write a book about.

finally, after my third full stint in rehab, i got onto maintenence. So i'm ok now. But during my many months collectively spent in rehabs that cost $600 PER DAY i learnt a lot about why quitting opiates and opiods is so amazingly difficult.

i could write a couple more thousand words on it, but i wont. let's just say that the education i recieved from rehab is what prompted my to study the medicine degree i am 2 years into now, and the complex reasons behind the difficulty of quitting is what prompted me to specialise in neuroscience.

remember guys, you would be surprised the number of blatant mistruths and misconceptions that are floating about in society about addiction. a number of them have surfaced in this thread, but i don't have the time to explain and deconstruct them via an internet forum.

what i will say though, is that anybody who claims that nicotine is harder to quit then opiates is either misinformed, lying (intentionally or unintentionally), or has somehow drawn some very wrong conclusions from his (or her) own experiences. Nicotine withdrawal does not involve constant vomiting, diarrhea, anxiety, depression, convulsions, temperature oscillation....i could go on for some time.

anyway thats it for now; i wish karo the very best in his recovery, and hope that he gets clean and sober and stays that way. and if he never fights again, it will be a shame, but one's health is always more important than one's career.

I hate karo's fight personality, but i wouldn't wish opiate addiction on my worst enemies. i could write pages upon pages on just how humiliating, shameful and horrible it can be.

best wishes to you karo, and for those people in this thread acting ignorant and callous, please reconsider your positions.

thats all for now,

Brendan
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Old 11-21-2009, 03:55 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MooJuice View Post
I FU<KING HATE THE IGNORANCE IN THIS THREAD.

most people are great, and know their stuff, but some people are so ignorant it almost hurts just to read their comments. it's disgusting.


I had a 2 year addiction to codeine, morphine, heroin, oxycodone, hydrocodone, buprenorphine, methadone and fentanyl, not to mention the diazepam, oxazepam, alprazolam and others, all of which cost me around $150 a day. (roughly $1,000 a week on narcotics only)

the first year i was happy in my addiction, and was a 'functioning addict'. After 12 months however, some terrible things happened in life and i urgently, urgently needed to quit. I was becoming a liability to my family and the ones i love most. I wanted desperately to quit. I needed to quit. I had no option but to quit. And yet... i could not quit. I attempted suicide multiple times, and nearly succeeded twice. it wasn't out of depression, but simply i knew that if i could not quit then staying around would hurt and destroy my family.

I lost my career, my partner, my health, my self esteem, and much more because of my addiction. I tried to quit every way you could think of - and i mean every. single. way. the things i did to try and quit i could write a book about.

finally, after my third full stint in rehab, i got onto maintenence. So i'm ok now. But during my many months collectively spent in rehabs that cost $600 PER DAY i learnt a lot about why quitting opiates and opiods is so amazingly difficult.

i could write a couple more thousand words on it, but i wont. let's just say that the education i recieved from rehab is what prompted my to study the medicine degree i am 2 years into now, and the complex reasons behind the difficulty of quitting is what prompted me to specialise in neuroscience.

remember guys, you would be surprised the number of blatant mistruths and misconceptions that are floating about in society about addiction. a number of them have surfaced in this thread, but i don't have the time to explain and deconstruct them via an internet forum.

what i will say though, is that anybody who claims that nicotine is harder to quit then opiates is either misinformed, lying (intentionally or unintentionally), or has somehow drawn some very wrong conclusions from his (or her) own experiences. Nicotine withdrawal does not involve constant vomiting, diarrhea, anxiety, depression, convulsions, temperature oscillation....i could go on for some time.

anyway thats it for now; i wish karo the very best in his recovery, and hope that he gets clean and sober and stays that way. and if he never fights again, it will be a shame, but one's health is always more important than one's career.

I hate karo's fight personality, but i wouldn't wish opiate addiction on my worst enemies. i could write pages upon pages on just how humiliating, shameful and horrible it can be.

best wishes to you karo, and for those people in this thread acting ignorant and callous, please reconsider your positions.

thats all for now,

Brendan
Allen Carr wrote a really great book about how to quit smoking, and I think a lot of what he writes about can be related to addictions in general.

In brief, sometimes no matter how strong your willpower is on something, if you don't know the way out of the cave you can be stuck in their forever.

It's the same in education. There are students who try as hard as they can, but without the right analogy or right connection to something they can't make heads or tails of what they're reading.

If I have a car that's broken down, and I don't know how to jumpstart it, pushing it as hard as I can won't make it start any faster. Willpower is only half the game.
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Old 11-21-2009, 04:23 PM   #53 (permalink)
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First off- thank you. Getting clean in the hardest thing and greatest thing ive ever accomplished in my life so far. As for my post I didnt mean to sound insensitive to Karos problem but the facts are Karo needs to recognize he has a problem after that he needs to do something about it. And this is where I meant 'deep down he has to want to stop". He needs to check in to a detox then go from there to a rehab or theraputic community and from there he needs to attend self help groups like NA or Secular recovery or any of the others. The help is out there its just a matter of getting it and if you dont think you have a real problem (denial) you wont seek treatment until youve slid a long way down the socio-economic scale (rock bottom)which is the route that I had to take and I hope Karo doesnt have to take it that far. I like watching him fight and wish him luck.
How do you know he hasn't done any of this? I realize you've probably read a few pamphlets but it's not as easy as you might think. A lot of people simply die from their addictions even with the best help.
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Old 11-21-2009, 04:33 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Damn. This sucks. I was trying to be optimistic before but now it's useless. Addiction to pain killers is not something to laugh about or bash him for. People get addicted to them all the time, and it's unfortunate that most people get addicted on accident just by having one or two prescriptions for a real problem.

Karo is still relatively young, and has a lot to learn. I hope he can get cleaned up, judo throw some fools in Strikeforce for a lil while, and maybe eventually get back to his full potential as a fighter. He's always been a favorite of mine and I wish him the best luck overcoming his addictions and anxiety issues as I can relate first hand to them. It's not fun.
Hit the nail on the head.
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Old 11-21-2009, 04:41 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Since we are on the topic, im actually in the process of trying to stop taking opiates as we speak. Right now im taking at least 80mg of oxycontin, to as much as 240mg a day.

And for those people that think you can just quit, like smoking. Its a tad different than that, trust me!
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Old 11-21-2009, 05:20 PM   #56 (permalink)
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It seems like the trend that pisses me off with this thread is the group of wannabe mensa members who call other posters stupid, and ridicule them for their real life experiences and opinions formed from that.

These same people go on to post their opinions as though they are authorities on the subject.

Every one of you folks doing this represent the worst in meaningful discussion and fostering of informative interaction.

So i pissed some of you off by what I said about cigarettes. My statements come from real life experience, involving the addiction of both cigs and hardcore narcotics. What the hell gives you the moral high ground to ridicule this.

So we all know that addiction is a bitch...and we all know that some people handle the issue better than others...

If you don't buy what im selling thats fine, but show some maturity in your responses. Unless you're just addicted to being an ass.

Now, to all the folks that take offense to my stance, especially those that have been addicted to both narcotics as well as nicotene, let me throw this out there...

The lengths that people will go to in order to sustain their painkiller addiction is obviously far greater than what people will do for their next smoke. Very few people throw their life in the trash can for the nicotene, but for that painkiller buzz...hell yes. But my previous statement about the difficulty of quitting cigarettes vs narcotics is based on the actual act of quitting and not relapsing. It is a very hard but very short time frame when quitting the painkillers. But by my expeience and everyone i've ever known who has gone through the process, once that time period is over then the cravings and urges to pick it back up are nothing like the hardship of the initial withdrawal. You could throw a bottle of oxys at me and I'm not going to have a real hard time throwing them back at you. Once you quit cigarettes after a serious addiction to them, the initial withdrawal is tough but not life altering. The urge and craving to smoke again however is constantly present. I know people who havent smoked in 20 years and they will admit that the urge to smoke again never goes away completely. I've tried to quit at least 7 times with as much as a yea of being smoke free, but that craving to smoke never left. I'm not unique in this situation, as again, many people I know who have quit hardcore narcotics and managed to avoid relapse, and don't claim to be haunted daily by it.

Thoese of you calling posters names and ridiculing their positions based on their life stories should be ashamed. I don't mean to be a dick, but those of you with mod status should be saying this, not me.
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Old 11-21-2009, 05:26 PM   #57 (permalink)
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comparing smoking and narcotics doesn't make sense in the first place. smoking isn't hard to quit because of the terrible, painful withdrawals, it's hard to quit because of ease of access (buy legally in stores), social acceptance (lots of people do it and it isn't seen in nearly as negative a light as opiate addiction), and the simple fact that it's easier to be functioning long-term smoker than a functioning long-term painkiller addict. Some people smoke from childhood till they're 70, few people can live through a painkiller addiction that long.

Certainly there are strong cravings for some but it's still absolutely nothing like the first week or two of opiate withdrawal, and not really a fair comparison for either drug. For the record I smoked for two years and quit and luckily don't have craving, but I know people who do and I am glad I don't have to deal with it. I have more cravings for vicodin than cigarettes.
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Old 11-21-2009, 05:52 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by HexRei View Post
comparing smoking and narcotics doesn't make sense in the first place. smoking isn't hard to quit because of the terrible, painful withdrawals, it's hard to quit because of ease of access (buy legally in stores), social acceptance (lots of people do it and it isn't seen in nearly as negative a light as opiate addiction), and the simple fact that it's easier to be functioning long-term smoker than a functioning long-term painkiller addict. Some people smoke from childhood till they're 70, few people can live through a painkiller addiction that long.

Certainly there are strong cravings for some but it's still absolutely nothing like the first week or two of opiate withdrawal, and not really a fair comparison for either drug. For the record I smoked for two years and quit and luckily don't have craving, but I know people who do and I am glad I don't have to deal with it. I have more cravings for vicodin than cigarettes.
I suppose it would be better if I refferenced relapse as the issue. And you're right about ease of access and public acceptance. But it's not difficult to score narcotics at all. I would assert that the nicotene itself is the bad guy, far more over social acceptance.

Anyone who has faced the narcotics addiction can clearly see in Karo's statements how for from reality he is. The deal with him trying to get the sanctioning body to let him take something stronger than tylenol cracked me up. That and the bs lie about the fine all brought back some memories, and I suppose those memories are part of my avoidence of relapse....I never broke any laws or placed myself or anyone else in danger for nicotene.
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Old 11-21-2009, 06:56 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by HexRei View Post
How do you know he hasn't done any of this? I realize you've probably read a few pamphlets but it's not as easy as you might think. A lot of people simply die from their addictions even with the best help.
A few pamphlets (laughing) how bout 4 rehabs, 21 months in jail going to mtgs, and still attending selfhelp groups for over 9 years now. I think that qualifies me to post on addiction. The truth is nothing will get you clean until you really want to and only then do you start to try. It might not work for most at first but if you keep trying you can do it! like Ive said millions of people have stopprd opiates. So why cant Karo? Not everyone needs to hit bottom like some of us to stop. But most do unfortunately.
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Old 11-21-2009, 10:25 PM   #60 (permalink)
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I've tried to quit at least 7 times with as much as a yea of being smoke free, but that craving to smoke never left. I'm not unique in this situation, as again, many people I know who have quit hardcore narcotics and managed to avoid relapse, and don't claim to be haunted daily by it.
You really should consider reading Allen Carr's The Easy Way to Stop Smoking and then see if you say the same thing you just said.

You have nothing to lose in reading that book except 3 hours. What you have to gain is never having that feeling ever again.
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