Karo camp admits he pulled out due to addiction to painkillers - Page 7 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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Old 11-21-2009, 11:16 PM   #61 (permalink)
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Kicking addiction to anything is a highly individualized process from what I've read, heard, and seen in this thread.

FWIW, there are good studies to show that kicking cigarettes is as hard or harder than kicking heroin.
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Old 11-21-2009, 11:32 PM   #62 (permalink)
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I suppose it would be better if I refferenced relapse as the issue. And you're right about ease of access and public acceptance. But it's not difficult to score narcotics at all.
Much, much harder than "scoring" cigarettes. Let's just leave it at that.

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I would assert that the nicotene itself is the bad guy, far more over social acceptance.

Anyone who has faced the narcotics addiction can clearly see in Karo's statements how for from reality he is. The deal with him trying to get the sanctioning body to let him take something stronger than tylenol cracked me up. That and the bs lie about the fine all brought back some memories, and I suppose those memories are part of my avoidence of relapse....I never broke any laws or placed myself or anyone else in danger for nicotene.
His press release about excuses was definitely ridiculous.

Swp, I've never seen a study claiming that that I felt satisfied with the conditions of. It's easy to look at recidivism rates but there are a lot of other factors which mentioned earlier in this thread.
Tons of people quit smoking each year (in the millions, actually) but because it is so easy to obtain (by in stores with hassle or shame) socially accepted (at worst your health conscious friends will frown and you will have to smoke outside the bar) and easy to maintain for the long-term (a couple decades of heroin addiction is pretty much a death sentence, plenty of people smoke for fifty+ years) that it's really very difficult to quantify which is "harder" to quit.

But, just go to any rehab clinic and compare those there for heroin addiction to a friend who stopped smoking for a while... no contest. the smoker might have the jitters, the heroin addicts are probably rolling around crying in between mitigative drugs.

Hell even alcohol has much more dangerous withdrawals than nicotine. You can die in extreme cases of delerium tremens.
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Old 11-21-2009, 11:41 PM   #63 (permalink)
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I thought that might be the reason. I myself am a rcovering addict and if he wants to get back ont the right track he needs to get help first get out of the high pressure of the fight game and work on his addiction. and maybe in a coupkle of years he will be back. it took a good 2 years before i got back to training properly, you really lose perspective when you get hooked on crap.
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Old 11-21-2009, 11:44 PM   #64 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by swpthleg View Post
Kicking addiction to anything is a highly individualized process from what I've read, heard, and seen in this thread.

FWIW, there are good studies to show that kicking cigarettes is as hard or harder than kicking heroin.
Its so true dude i smoked meth, crack, i popped XTC like candy and drank like a fish but none of that was as hard a kicking the smoking habbit. ...... that was the hardest habbit to kick by far
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Old 11-22-2009, 12:20 AM   #65 (permalink)
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Addiction to pain killers only requires the addictee to say no.

Karo is becoming the Steve Howe of mma.
I am a cognitive behavioural therapist and an internationally cerfified clinical addictions counselor. Let me try to explain this to you or anyone else completely ignorant of addiction so that hopefully you don't labour under these ridiculous assumptions anymore. First, it is a myth that addiction takes "willpower" to overcome.

What happens when you train all day and are short on food and water? What two words describe those deficits? Yup...Hunger and thirst. You know what hunger and thirst are? WITHDRAWAL symptoms. Our natural evolution has triggered signs to let our brain signal to our body that we are "hungry" and "thirsty" when needed so that we feed ourselves....to survive. When we do that, our brain releases a bit of dopamine to reward for feeding our bodies. Now if you take ENOUGH drugs/alcohol/nicotine over a long enough period of time, you will become addicted? Why? Because there is A LOT MORE dopamine released in the brain by say vicodin/oxycontin/percocets/et al, then say a big mac. So the brain, in time, believes that it NEEDS those drugs much more than food and water. Therefore, the WITHDRAWAL symptoms are much much more significant than being thirsty and hungry. Now I don't know about you, but i get damn pissy if I haven't eaten all day. So imagine what drug addiction feels like. That is why people do "almost anything" to feed that addiction. The brain signals to "feed me" and do so by any means necessary.

It is sad that Dana White reduces this situation to a Twitter conversation and does not offer treatment to his fighters. This should be a flipping obligation of the UFC. I believe he just did this to Junie as well? Doesn't the UFC take care of their fighters at all? Addiction is not an overnight process and neither is overcoming it. Dana really should stand by his fighters because Karo seemingly became addicted trying to represent the organization and himself by doing his job.....Dana should get on his...end rant.
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Old 11-22-2009, 12:25 AM   #66 (permalink)
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Its so true dude i smoked meth, crack, i popped XTC like candy and drank like a fish but none of that was as hard a kicking the smoking habbit. ...... that was the hardest habbit to kick by far
read a couple of posts up. there are a plethora of reasons that those other habits are harder to maintain than nicotine.
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Old 11-22-2009, 12:26 AM   #67 (permalink)
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A few pamphlets (laughing) how bout 4 rehabs, 21 months in jail going to mtgs, and still attending selfhelp groups for over 9 years now. I think that qualifies me to post on addiction. The truth is nothing will get you clean until you really want to and only then do you start to try. It might not work for most at first but if you keep trying you can do it! like Ive said millions of people have stopprd opiates. So why cant Karo? Not everyone needs to hit bottom like some of us to stop. But most do unfortunately.
congrats on recovery. It is not an overnight process. I posted above a little rant on addiction. You correctly mention you don't "have to hit rock bottom" to get help..exactly correct and that is why Intervention's work pretty well...as well as drug courts. Which is exactly why your first statement is an old school belief that isn't true; "you have to want to get clean." At some point you need to, but not initially and that is proven with drug court in which people who are forced to quit end up getting the same message in treatment as the people who "really wanted it." the sad/scary part is that equals very few people who get the message. Glad you are one of them!
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Old 11-22-2009, 11:13 AM   #68 (permalink)
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read a couple of posts up. there are a plethora of reasons that those other habits are harder to maintain than nicotine.
Nicotine and Caffiene have been proven to be the most addictive substances by far and its no accident that they are available on every corner. What makes these chemicals dangerous is the fact that there mood and mind altering qualites are not as intense as Crack, H, X, and Meth which give the users a false sense of control over there addicition, and the only way you can evert kick an addiction is by recognizing you have a problem. With the hard stuff you hit rock bottom real quick and we are forced to make a choice between a life of misery or a chance at a healthy life so we are forced to this crossroad much quicker. But with smoking most of us know we have a problem but we usually don't recognize the problem until its too late, its the silent killer, It claimed my Moms life at 46 and she was 10 years clean from drugs and booze and it was smoking in the end that killed her.Thats how i realized that smoking was just as bad. and the withdrawls were much more intense. This all from personal experience and the 1000's of people i have met that agree, if you have ever been to an AA meeting before you would notice the one thing tthat people do a lot of, smoking. Addiction affect people from all walks of life, i have met Police officers, fire fighters, Laywers and i even met a fromer Priest that smoked crack (NO JOKE!!!) its a serious issue and i encourage everyone to read the post from the Doctor above about addiction because eveything they spoke of is what we learn in treatment.
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Old 11-22-2009, 01:09 PM   #69 (permalink)
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I want to throw in here, that there is a clinical model of "the addictive personality" that's better explained by the professional in this thread, that complicates the process of recognizing addiction and attempting to treat it.
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Old 11-22-2009, 02:11 PM   #70 (permalink)
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I want to throw in here, that there is a clinical model of "the addictive personality" that's better explained by the professional in this thread, that complicates the process of recognizing addiction and attempting to treat it.
There is a genetic part to addiction, my mom, aunts, 2 grandpa's and distant relatives are all addicts either recovering or are still practising.Although this dose play a roll, no one forced me to take drugs i made the choice and it's no ones fault that i am an addict but my own. But your right here that some people are born addicts and some pick it up by accident, with drugs like Oxycotin, Demerols which are fairly common pain killers for chronic pain, any person who takes enough of these will experience withdrawls when they stop. these drugs add and or enduce neuro chemical like endorphins (a natural form of morphine the body creates to ease pain) to be uptaked by neuro transmitters in the brain that causes a sense of comfort, and when this chemical is gone we begin to miss it. anyways i hope Karo the best and i hope to see him back one day, i think Dana needs to ease up a bit, Karo did screw the UFC over but he has to get back his life. and i just want to say how impressed i am that many people are understanding of this situation. Its great to see people getting envolved and adding their support.
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