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Old 10-25-2009, 12:56 PM   #11 (permalink)
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what is the deal with him saying he does everything for Latinos. hometown pride is good and all but has he ever won a fight for me? nope, he always says im winning this fight for mexico and my latino fans, what about the rest of us man, i mean i feel like someone would be scrutinized heavily if they said im winning this fight for america or winning this fight for whites, i dont know not trying to make a big controversial topic just tired of hearing it ya know
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Old 10-25-2009, 12:58 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Cain's idea of stand up defense of deflecting punches with his face will not allow him to last long against the likes of Carwin or Lesnar.

He took his skill from Kongo, whose ground game consists of deflecting punchese of his own head to win the fight.
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Old 10-25-2009, 01:02 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Cain has no chance against Brock. But is there any fighter in the UFC HW division that has really an advantage against him? No
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Old 10-25-2009, 01:38 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Not that I think he is strong or fast enough to beat Brock, I would give Cain a chance though. The thing is, we haven't seen the behometh that is Brock Lesnar on his back. Like everyone says, wrestlers don't like being on their back. The problem of course is that Brock is sooooo much bigger and stronger, could Cain control him on the ground? I was very impressed with Cains wrestling last night because he was taking a much bigger guy down at will, but of course he is no Lesnar with the wrestling pedigree. I think for Cain to stand a chance, he would need to get some more weight on that body because 238 is not going to cut it against Brock. One last thing that popped in my head right now though; Randy was able to somewhat control Lesnar and he weighed in at like 222. Hmmm, yes Im aware of Randys credentials but it wouldn't be obsurd to think Cain couldn't do the same. Very interesting matchup indeed, at least in my opinion.

I don't know though, maybe Cain needs more fights though. What I see happening is Cain ONLY getting the nod if Carwin takes the belt. If not, I don't think Cain will get the shot over Big Nog. I think make Big Nog fight Cain for the title shot if Lesnar wins. If Carwin wins though, either Cain or Big Nog should get it.
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Old 10-25-2009, 01:50 PM   #15 (permalink)
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The only thing impressive about Cain thus far is his ability to take down opponents who are known to have a limited or non-exisent ground game.

At the bar, people were "ooing" and "aahing" at simple wrestling takedowns.

Give him the winner so this myth of a fighter can be exposed and I can make some mad $.
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Old 10-25-2009, 02:10 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sicilian_Esq View Post
The only thing impressive about Cain thus far is his ability to take down opponents who are known to have a limited or non-exisent ground game.

At the bar, people were "ooing" and "aahing" at simple wrestling takedowns.

Give him the winner so this myth of a fighter can be exposed and I can make some mad $.
I think the "ooos" and "ahhhs" were more because it was takedowns on a much bigger guy. I obviously don't know you or anything about you, but do you think it's easy to take a man that out weighs you by at least 30 pounds, if not more, to the ground? How could you say it's "simple wrestling takedowns" when it's not so simple to do it against someone that has a least trained on wrestling? It might looked simple, but it's not quite as much as it seems. There is a reason these guys train for hours each day to avoid these takedowns and to also apply them. Not very "simple" I guarantee that much, in my opinion.

Like I said, my opinion. Of course we probably won't ever agree, but that's what this forum is for right? To talk about this kind of stuff
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Old 10-25-2009, 02:17 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I think it's only fair, he was supposed to fight Carwin also I think Velasquez's record including last night is better than Shane's (Kongo and Rothwell or just Gonzaga). I don't think he'd beat either. Guy's wrestling isn't superior enough to either, in Lesnar's case I don't think it is at all, So Shane would probably knock him out and Lesnar might knock him out or ummm.... flying armbar?
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Old 10-25-2009, 02:51 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Gotta agree with most here and say that Brock would be just too monstrous and fast for him, I mean, how many strikes did he land on Rothwell without knocking him out? I also thought it was funny that Rothwell protested the stoppage, he may not have been out there and then but he was very, very close.
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Old 10-25-2009, 03:32 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Im a bit worried the size advantage will be too big for Cain as he can't abuse his wrestling against Brock like he did against Rothwell. He clearly deserves the next shot though.
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Old 10-25-2009, 03:39 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I think the "ooos" and "ahhhs" were more because it was takedowns on a much bigger guy. I obviously don't know you or anything about you, but do you think it's easy to take a man that out weighs you by at least 30 pounds, if not more, to the ground? How could you say it's "simple wrestling takedowns" when it's not so simple to do it against someone that has a least trained on wrestling? It might looked simple, but it's not quite as much as it seems. There is a reason these guys train for hours each day to avoid these takedowns and to also apply them. Not very "simple" I guarantee that much, in my opinion.

Like I said, my opinion. Of course we probably won't ever agree, but that's what this forum is for right? To talk about this kind of stuff
Rothwell is known to be a striker without much take down defense. He did a good job holding out, but everyone knew this was Cain's plan going in.

I was a wrestler for a number of years. Takedowns are more physics than anything. They aren't like lifting a person... the aggressor is applying his weight at weaker joints.

All of Cain's TD's affected the knees of Ben, and none of them were "hard" takedowns, ala GSP or Hughes, add strength and power behind the TD. Cain would apply a "simple" takedown and follow up with shots.
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