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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 12:52 PM Thread Starter
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Scoring?

...And defense. My main issue here is to question people's/judge's scoring of fights. If fighter A.) throws a jab and hook all while pushing forward but more often than not he gets stuffed with a defensive jab by fighter B.) at the same time that he misses with both punches; do both fighters get points? One for aggression and the other for accuracy and getting in his hits.


My other question is on defense. Does a fighter earn points for punches thrown that are blocked (i.e. fighter A.) throws a punch and fighter B.) covers up making fighter A.)'s punch land on fighter B.) arm/elbow/hand?




My own opinion on the UFC judges/fans is that they tend to base a lot of scoring on aggression and action. That is to say that if fighter A.) throws 120 punches in a fight and lands about 45 of them and fighter B.) throws 60 punches and lands 45 of them than many people judge it in favor of the person throwing more punches (this is taking into account that both fighter's punches have about the same effectiveness; i.e. no KO'ing punches that seem to knock the other out). Not that Baseball is anything like MMA but a batter that gets up to bat 120 time and only hits 45 times will have a worse batting average than a person than a person that batts 60 times and gets 45 hits. Just sayin' I think there is something to be said for accuracy.



Thank you in advance for all your comments.


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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 01:48 PM
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After watching UFC Unleashed last night I have to wonder whats up with the scoring. It looked like Forrest dominated Tito in that fight in the last 2 rounds and Tito won the first round. I cant believe that one judge scored it 30-27 Tito? makes you wonder if the fix was in
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan
After watching UFC Unleashed last night I have to wonder whats up with the scoring. It looked like Forrest dominated Tito in that fight in the last 2 rounds and Tito won the first round. I cant believe that one judge scored it 30-27 Tito? makes you wonder if the fix was in
The scoring in most combat sports is just plain terrible, it comes down to opinion instead of un-biased viewing. It's obvious alot of times that if a certain fighter is more popular than the other fighter he will win the decisions, the only way for a fighter to avoid that is to get the Knockout and leave no doubters. IMO Forrest won that decision against Tito,it was a very close fight but I beleive Griffin pulled it out but Tito got the "W" instead.

You can't have everything. Where would you put it?



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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 02:06 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan
After watching UFC Unleashed last night I have to wonder whats up with the scoring. It looked like Forrest dominated Tito in that fight in the last 2 rounds and Tito won the first round. I cant believe that one judge scored it 30-27 Tito? makes you wonder if the fix was in


I'm reserving my judgement on that fight. I don't like to argue with that one anymore. It's been beaten to death.


But I will say that As they announced the scoring (even when the middle judge scored it in favor of Forest) Forest seemed to know that he was going to lose. He was shaking his head and just wanted to walk away.

"You can light a fire for a man and he will be warm for a day."
OR
"You can light a man on fire and he'll be warm for a lifetime."

My Top 6
BW = Miguel Torres
LW = Tyson Griffin
WW = GSP
MW = Gegard Mousasi
LHW = Lyota Machida
HW = Fedor
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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 02:26 PM
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In this sport, as opposed to accuracy, when two fighters are exchanging and they land the same amount of punches, the edge is given to the fighter with the more aggression. If someone gasses and throws 12 weak-ass punches and someone else in the same round at the same time throws 30 punches and connects with twelve weak-ass punches, the edge is goign to the aggressor. That usually isn't as much of a POINT as it is a SIDE NOTE, if ya nkow what I mean?



When I'm scoring and someone gets stuffed or both of them connect at the same time, I tend to nullify points instead of just handing points out like f***ing christmas candy...

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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 02:31 PM
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Allow me to clraify though- Scoring is kinda tough, no matter what, and sometimes (all too ften means you're a s***ty score person, but sometimes) you will not see something or miss something or misjudge something. Same thing with refereeing. It's tough- it really is. It's not a justification nor an excuse, but it happens sometimes. And by nullification, I mean if the exchange happend and someone is stuffed and both should be awarded points, I just wouldnt give either of them points...

1. He who spares the bad injures the good

2. To compete is to live, but in order to fight you must first begin by digging two graves.

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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow30597
Allow me to clraify though- Scoring is kinda tough, no matter what, and sometimes (all too ften means you're a s***ty score person, but sometimes) you will not see something or miss something or misjudge something. Same thing with refereeing. It's tough- it really is. It's not a justification nor an excuse, but it happens sometimes. And by nullification, I mean if the exchange happend and someone is stuffed and both should be awarded points, I just wouldnt give either of them points...
your right, I think scoring is pretty hard. A lot of times I am watching a fight and I see someone throw a hook or something and I think it didn't even land or just grazed him and then the announcer says "Great left hand." It is really hard to tell sometimes if something landed or if a strike really had any kind of effect.

What I always wondered is do judges give more points when grappling to the guy who attempts a submission, but fails or the guy who was in a lot of trouble, but escaped?

If I remeber correctly in the Ed Herman vs Kendall Grove fight Kendall kept getting Ed in some pretty good holds, but Herman escaped them all. I appreciate a good escape over a good attempt, but I am not sure how the judges see it.

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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 03:22 PM
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Again, being a judge, I see it as an advantage point, not a real point, to the attacker. I love it more when someone escapes something , but they shouldn't have gotten locked into it, therefore the aggression goes to the guy on the bottom who's still making the fight happen and not just trying to save his ass...Likewise or inversely, if the guy on top is raining punches and the guy on bottom is just blocking, the advantage and aggression goes tot he guy on top, whether the punches connect or not. It's an aggression issue, really. It's where no POINTS per se are about it btu the advantage in a split decision will definitely go to the aggressor (sometimes not even a split decision- for the actual POINTS, if it's within two to three points, I'll usually start looking bat the aadvantage points to keepsake).

1. He who spares the bad injures the good

2. To compete is to live, but in order to fight you must first begin by digging two graves.

3. No good deed shall go unpunished.
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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2006, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oil
I'm reserving my judgement on that fight. I don't like to argue with that one anymore. It's been beaten to death.


But I will say that As they announced the scoring (even when the middle judge scored it in favor of Forest) Forest seemed to know that he was going to lose. He was shaking his head and just wanted to walk away.
WHAT, if you watched the fight (live and not the editied version) you would have seen Griffen got down and do push up saying he wanted to go 2 more rounds. He wanted to continue the fight because i remember hearing before the fight they announced taht if it's undecided by 3 round it might put 2 more to decide, and Griffen wanted 2 more rounds to finish off tito.

But you seem to think that "forrest thought he lost" which is far away from the truth as it can be.

I have noticed a lot of editing mishaps, for instance we all know that in the first fight with GSP and Hughes, Hughes won with 1 second left. (4:59 via arm bar) but when you watched it on Unleashed it showed that there was 5 seconds left in the round.... hummm i just found that odd. Also Anderson Silva Vs Rich Franklin, Anderson Ko'd Rich 2:59 seconds in the first round, but when you watched it they took away the time on unleashed.

These dont seem like BIG things, but they are. They are slowly changing the stats. It's not right, Not that i care, becuse i have seen these fights and pointed it out, but next time you watched unleashed be aware that the stats you see might not be correct.


This whole post is only because the one post that i have quoted, that person seems to think that Forrest didn't want to go on, but if anyone watched that fight live, you would have seen something totally different. Because in the live fight Forrest was shaking his head after he heard the first judges score, giving Tito the win, which he knew that he won that fight. And rightfully so.

UFC = American TV, and American TV = LIES.


so UFC = LIES


I know you might not like it, but i have noted 3 things that Unleashed has changed from the live fight, and giving the fighter who they wanted to win alittle better stats (ie Tito, Rich, Matt)

im not re reading this, cuz its way to hard to explain over a message board.

For most of you, ignorance is bliss, but for me it's about the truth.

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4-0, Admins taken down in bets 2 (asskicker, Jdun11)
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