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UFC The Ultimate Fighting Championship (UFC) is a U.S.-based mixed martial arts organization, recognized as the largest MMA promotion in the world. The UFC is headquartered in Las Vegas, Nevada and is owned and operated by Zuffa, LLC. This promotion is responsible for solidifying the sport's postion in the history-books. UFC is currently undergoing a remarkable surge in popularity, along with greater mainstream media coverage. UFC programming can now be seen on FOX, FX, and FUEL TV in the United States, as well as in 35 other countries worldwide.

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Old 02-27-2010, 03:13 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by daveh98 View Post
It's all good dude, we have different opinions but to say pac man is not strong? The guy has moved up 5 weight classes and has gotten stronger with every jump in weight. Almost NO ONE in history has done that (duran, hagler, hearns, sugar ray,). They can have the skills but they usually lose speed and KO power. Pacman has gotten stronger, faster and has kept his KO power....which is why a lot of people are assuming he is juicing.

I will agree that maybe I am being a bit of a fan boy to assume he would win in an octagon against florian...but again..just my opinion which came off harsh.

look, at the end of the day, I am currently training MMA. I love the sport, watch UFC and SF. My brother in law is a BJJ that watches obscure channels and fights that I know nothing of (he watches MMA much deeper than just UFC and SF). We both have the same arguments that I have on these forums. They are just opinions...and some differ.

But if Lesnar trained "just wrestling" and made the transition to MMA, I think "just a boxer" could do so just as easily. I have found learning basic TDD and BJJ to be pretty easy..and fun.

At the end of the day; fighting in the cage or in the ring is the same to me...just a sport. Both have different skill sets. I think MMA has a ways to go before they get as deep and talent rich as boxing. GSP and Brock are probably two exceptions to the rule regarding the "level of athlete" I do reference. Yes I think boxers are overall better athletes. It didn't take me long to watch enough seasons of TUF to see a bunch of drinking and poor lifestyles that reaffirmed my notions. Obviously..just an opinion and my bad for coming off too elitist or something. Peace.
I agree with what you said about Paquiao, but the thing about boxer's transitioning to MMA successfully imo it all depends on their style. Pacman would probably be able to do it but Floyd would struggle big time imo because his defensive stances and style isn't built for kicks,knees, takedowns or 4 oz gloves which would hurt him badly. Alot of defensive fighter's would have alot harder time adjusting to MMA.

Last edited by streetpunk08 : 02-27-2010 at 03:15 PM.
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Old 02-27-2010, 03:38 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by streetpunk08 View Post
I agree with what you said about Paquiao, but the thing about boxer's transitioning to MMA successfully imo it all depends on their style. Pacman would probably be able to do it but Floyd would struggle big time imo because his defensive stances and style isn't built for kicks,knees, takedowns or 4 oz gloves which would hurt him badly. Alot of defensive fighter's would have alot harder time adjusting to MMA.
I completely agree.

Back on topic, I agree with the article. I think that boxing needs to promote better to the casual fan. A lot of exciting "KO" fast action fights do occur; but they occur on HBO and Showtime leading up to the "mega fights." By the time the megafight showdown occurs, it is the two highest level of guys which often creates a chess match because their skills are so high. The lower level fights show the excitement of the striking. Boxing is starting to improve with the Super 6 Tournament.

Boxing needs to also work on "stacking their cards." Because main events (not all) can be boring, then they need exciting undercards like MMA is doing. Heck you even have boring main events in MMA now because they don't fill the hype and people don't want to take risks like the up and comers.

Boxing will not die; not even close. But they do need to make some adjustments.
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Old 02-28-2010, 02:00 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by daveh98 View Post
It's all good dude, we have different opinions but to say pac man is not strong? The guy has moved up 5 weight classes and has gotten stronger with every jump in weight. Almost NO ONE in history has done that (duran, hagler, hearns, sugar ray,). They can have the skills but they usually lose speed and KO power. Pacman has gotten stronger, faster and has kept his KO power....which is why a lot of people are assuming he is juicing.

No doubt he is strong for a boxer and he is fast as hell (check his video of him shadow boxing on youtube). But he doesn't know how to utilize his strength like a wrestler or MMA guy who has been on the ground has. MMA guys face guys much bigger than them as well because of less weight classes. Boxing has 3-5 pounds inbetween some weight classes, which is part of the problem with boxing currently (too many weight classes).

I will agree that maybe I am being a bit of a fan boy to assume he would win in an octagon against florian...but again..just my opinion which came off harsh.


Quote:
But if Lesnar trained "just wrestling" and made the transition to MMA, I think "just a boxer" could do so just as easily. I have found learning basic TDD and BJJ to be pretty easy..and fun.

At the end of the day; fighting in the cage or in the ring is the same to me...just a sport. Both have different skill sets. I think MMA has a ways to go before they get as deep and talent rich as boxing. GSP and Brock are probably two exceptions to the rule regarding the "level of athlete" I do reference. Yes I think boxers are overall better athletes. It didn't take me long to watch enough seasons of TUF to see a bunch of drinking and poor lifestyles that reaffirmed my notions. Obviously..just an opinion and my bad for coming off too elitist or something. Peace.
I don't think you can compare a wrestler getting into MMA to a boxer getting into it because a wrestler only has to learn enough stand up to keep him from getting knocked out. A boxer on the other hand, has a hard task of learning not just TDD, but the groundgame and the clinch. Plus, he has to adjust his stance to the leg kicks and takedowns as well. But its cool, guess we will agree to disagree.
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Old 02-28-2010, 08:27 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Boxing vs. MMA is an over indulged argument. I love both sports as a spectator and realize that the two style are probably equally as dangerous in a street fight. For example, Paul "Cemtex" Daley(sp?) just KO'd a ranked kickboxer in his last fight, right? Daley got submitted by Jake Shields, who is a wrestler. The guy who can dominate with his strengths usually wins. Florian would get decked by either Pac or Floyd...he couldn't catch Floyd and Pac wouldn't stop punching him in the face. I would give a 50/50 chance that BJ could defeat either boxer b/c his bjj is so sick.
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Old 02-28-2010, 08:32 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Word....good post. But if a wrestler only has to learn enough stand-up to not get knocked out, wouldn't a boxer only have to learn enough wrestling to not get taken down? I think the trend currently in MMA is to stand-up and NOT get taken down. There is so much that I appreciate with high level BJJ that I think a lot of MMA guys are starting to try to learn the best stand up they can in order to not go against the world class BJJ guys. They would rather take the "punchers chance" and go for the KO, or keep it on a 3-5 round decision. Really, most main events in UFC right now are having guys just use wrestling in reverse to just keep things on their feet. Liddell, Machida, Rampage, Kos, are all guys that can do other things but are choosing to stand.

On another note, people that think boxing is boring are not watching regular fights on TV. hot prospects usually ice their competition while making names for themselves. This guy is brand new, very green...but is someone that is exciting and shows a lot of promise. It would be sweet to watch a guy like this make a transition to MMA and learn some basics to wrestling and other disciplines to use his striking....watch the way he goes to both the body and the head. Both clips are only a few minutes and the full fight..not edited...almost like a young mike tyson.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTtM3xEcYUY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKx82MZ6A8s

I love both sports and I defend MMA on my boxing forums. I just defend boxing on the MMA forums. I like to have both perspectives.
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Old 02-28-2010, 09:37 PM   #56 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by daveh98 View Post
Word....good post. But if a wrestler only has to learn enough stand-up to not get knocked out, wouldn't a boxer only have to learn enough wrestling to not get taken down? I think the trend currently in MMA is to stand-up and NOT get taken down. There is so much that I appreciate with high level BJJ that I think a lot of MMA guys are starting to try to learn the best stand up they can in order to not go against the world class BJJ guys. They would rather take the "punchers chance" and go for the KO, or keep it on a 3-5 round decision. Really, most main events in UFC right now are having guys just use wrestling in reverse to just keep things on their feet. Liddell, Machida, Rampage, Kos, are all guys that can do other things but are choosing to stand.

Strikers in MMA are nowhere near as technical as boxers or pure standup guys yet, so a wrestler learning striking to not get knocked out would have an easier time learning that than a boxer would wrestling/BJJ/TDD where a large number of fighters have high wrestling/grappling credentials already. Boxing can definately be utilized in MMA, but I think it will be by grapplers first than by boxers first. Examples would be BJ Penn or Lil Nog and maybe JDS. BJ Penn can use straight boxing with no kicks because his takedown defense and ground game is so good already that no one wants to attempt to take him down and if they do, they won't last long on the ground with him.
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Old 02-28-2010, 10:51 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Someone needs to bring an iron fist back to the sport of boxing. I want one douchebag scumbag kingpin running the sport of boxing, and that's Dana F'ing White. That's right, I want Dana to run BOTH the UFC and ALL of boxing!

Dana would be the only person on the planet with the vision and the cajones to restore boxing to it's original days of glory.

And some rules changes must be implemented.

1. First of all, do away with the three knockdown rule. This subjects competitors to the possibility of three concussions within a very short period of time. This is completely wrong and twisted, I don't care what the precedent is in boxing.

2. Along the same lines, eliminate the standing 8 count, where the ref inexplicably shakes a dazed boxer by the wrists and asks: "are you all right?" before allowing him to continue. This is very, very dangerous and should not be allowed under any circumstances. If a fighter is so badly injured that he needs a "standing 8," the fight should be stopped then and there.

As a substitute for rules 1 and 2, institute the MMA rule: once a boxer is unable to intelligently defend themselves, end the fight. Then and there.

3. Use smaller gloves. The bigger gloves are actually MORE dangerous than MMA gloves. They actually disperse force over a greater area doing more damage than the smaller MMA gloves.

4. Instead of 12 round or 36 minute title bouts, make it 8 rounds, 3 minutes each, for a 24 minute fight. For non title fights, make it 5 3 minute rounds. This would essentially make boxing matches equivalent in length to MMA matches. Boxing matches are too long and therefore place the fighters at greater risk of injury.

To be continued...

Last edited by michelangelo : 02-28-2010 at 10:55 PM.
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Old 02-28-2010, 11:00 PM   #58 (permalink)
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5. Completely eliminate the existing alphabet soup of organizations which recognize champions. Have ONE recognized, unified body awarding titles.

6. Institute a simplified weight division system, similar to the UFC's:

115 lbs.
125 lbs.
1. 135 lbs.
2. 145 lbs.
3. 155 lbs.
4. 170 lbs.
5. 185 lbs.
6. 205 lbs.
7. 265 lbs.
8. Super heavyweight (no weight limit)

This is a drastic set of changes, which are unlikely to occur, but it's what's required to bring some sanity back to the sport of boxing.

I'm really saddened that athletic commissions throughout the United States and the world allow boxing to continue as it is: the legions of massively injured and debilitated fighters is truly tragic. Here's hoping for change...
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