***OFFICIAL*** Sean Sherk vs Evan Dunham Pre/Post Fight - Page 16 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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View Poll Results: Who will be victorious?
Sean Sherk 11 44.00%
Evan Dunham 14 56.00%
Voters: 25. You may not vote on this poll

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post #151 of 156 (permalink) Old 09-29-2010, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by E Lit Er Ate View Post
it disappoints me how many knowledgeable fans on here think Sherk won

his GnP was basically nothing, no real damage done, just a whole lotta blood.

He got rocked several times and was in deep chokes several times.


That is worth a helluva lot more than TDs with no damage in my book.

Hell at least Bader at Nog rocked with the GnP and had his head bouncing like a basketball off the mat.

Sherk really didnt do much but a glancing elbow and ppl are acting like he did damage.

oh well, Dana knows who really won, Dunham is moving up the charts and Sherk will likely stay put, which is what should happen.

Bottom line is, Dunham threatened to finish this fight from every aspect, striking to grappling. Sherk did not. Dunham did much more damage and got up everytime he was put down along with 4 tight chokes.

Top it off with 5 of 18 on TDs, Dunham did defend most and made Sherk pay. Out of the 5 TDs he got up 5x and locked in subs, 3 of which looked extremely deep.
Nice post and nothing but the truth here!!!

Plus you forgot, that Dunham nearly KO'd Sherk 4-5 times in the last round too. Count all those attempt to finish the fight and Dunham would have won it by Unanimous Decision if the fight was scored as a whole fight, like it should be.
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post #152 of 156 (permalink) Old 09-29-2010, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by E Lit Er Ate View Post
it disappoints me how many knowledgeable fans on here think Sherk won

his GnP was basically nothing, no real damage done, just a whole lotta blood.

He got rocked several times and was in deep chokes several times.
If you look at the fight as a whole Dunham probably should win. The problem is 3 5 minute rounds scored on a 10 point system.

Sherk clearly won round 1 and Dunham clearly won round 3.

In the 2nd round Dunham had only 1 decent choke attempt and Sherk had already shown he wasn't too worried about being choked. Sherk was also not really badly rocked until the 3rd round, the striking in the 2nd was in Dunhams favor but not lopsided(Sherk was landing decent shots as well as Dunham but Dunham was doing a good job at hiding by continuosly moving forward and using his size and reach to push Sherk back). It even looked like Sherk dazed Dunham with one punch but Dunham just powered through it.

The majority of 2nd round was Sherk controlling Dunham, even though he didn't do a lot of damage he wins the round because of the scoring system. People can be disappointed about Dunham losing all they want but he shouldn't have won that fight given the current system in place for judging fights. It was a great learning experience for him and he will learn from it and will become a better fighter in the long run because of this loss. There is no shame in losing a very close decision to a guy like Sherk, the guy is one of the best.
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post #153 of 156 (permalink) Old 09-29-2010, 12:36 PM
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I just watched the fight for my first time. Round 1 I gave it to Sherk. Round 2 and 3 Dunham. I just didn't think Sherk did much damage rounds 2 and 3. He just pressed Dunham into the corner working on a take down and defended the submissions real well round 2.
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post #154 of 156 (permalink) Old 09-29-2010, 05:39 PM
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Fightemetric is useful, but only if interpreted right(their calculated winner is not necessary correct).

For example, in the 2nd round Dunham scored 1 significant strike in the clinch and 0 on the ground. That is where the majority of the fight took place. As I pointed out in another thread judging is based on grappling and striking depending on time spent doing each thing. The 2nd round was a grappling match for ~ 70% of the time and therefore is held in higher regard then the striking. Sherk won the grappling that round and the striking wasn't one sided until the 3rd round. That is why Sherk did win and deserved to win under the current judging system.
You're wrong on this point, scoring is not based on striking & grappling. Its based on EFFECTIVE striking grappling and octagon control.

For as much time that was spent on the ground a good chunk of it was spent defending submissions by Sherk, when Sherk was defending he wasn't producing offence and therefore was losing on two fronts control because he was forced to act defensively and grappling because he was defending a submission.

So if applied correctly its not just time spent in top position that dictates scoring its how effective was he in top position. Who came closer to finishing the fight on the ground? Who was more effective?

The real issue is that the judging guidelines are too vague and need to be more descriptive about what move strike etc has more scoring value.

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post #155 of 156 (permalink) Old 09-29-2010, 08:34 PM
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^ Sherk spent about 10 seconds that round defending submissions(Dunham only had 1 close choke) and the rest of the time controlling Dunham. Dunham spent the majority of that round just trying to avoid being taken down and keeping Sherk from doing damage, there is no way you could say Dunham won the grappling in round 2...

And because the majority of the round was spent grappling it is the major factor in determining the winner of the round, striking comes 2nd and Dunham didn't have enough of an advantage in round 2 to make up for being controlled most of the round.
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post #156 of 156 (permalink) Old 09-29-2010, 10:06 PM
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A. The striking was more significant than that, Dunham landed 36 strikes to the head standing. There was more than one choke attempt and he spent way more than a few seconds defending.

B. Sherk attempted 8 TD's but only landed 2, true he did land a few strikes but too few to say he was winning so domently on the ground that it overshadows the stand up and thats mostly due to Dunham's defense.

To me that was a 10-9 round Donham all the way.

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