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Omaplata 02-04-2007 09:31 PM

Silva's win was sketchy.
You can play a serious "what if" game with the Silva / Lutter fight - Lutter cut 20lbs to make weight for the fight, and had to cut even more after he botched the weigh-in, so he was weak and unable to perform to standard. Since he actually was able to take Silva down, and was able to pass to side and mount, the question can be speculated on: did Lutter, assuming he had had a better training regimen, have a chance?

But's that's not why I think Silva's win was sketchy.

Silva's win was sketchy because he used 3 clearly illegal elbow strikes to make Lutter tap. He struck Lutter on the crown of the skull with the point of his elbow - very clearly a breach of:

10. Striking downward using the point of the elbow.

Regardless of Herb Dean not calling it, regardless of Mike Goldberg making excuses for it, and regardless of Joe Rogan being a doofus on air questioning Couture about it (Couture himself immediately bringing up the elbows when Lutter tapped), Silva used an illegal strike, and there should have been a time-out to allow Lutter to recover, the same as with an accidental kick in the groin. But seeing as how Silva did it intentionally, disqualification shouldn't have been ruled out.

I sense I'm going to take some heat for this, but that's life. The elbows were illegal, and those were the strikes that made Lutter tap.

nprussell 02-04-2007 09:41 PM

no - i dont think you should take too much heat for that comment. i am not a ref but from what i know and from what i have been told those strikes were borderline legal - if not illegal.

the biggest point though is that the ufc referees will not make a call. it seems like they are puzzled as well.

except for big john - he is in total control ever since UFC III.

buo 02-04-2007 09:42 PM


Silva's win was sketchy because he used 3 clearly illegal elbow strikes to make Lutter tap. He struck Lutter on the crown of the skull with the point of his elbow - very clearly a breach of:

10. Striking downward using the point of the elbow.


I disagree... I watched the fight a few times to investigate. Silva was frustrated and has held himself from giving the downward elbow a few times, showing that he was clearly aware of the rules. The arching elbows that he gave was closer to the top of Lutter's forhead. If they were illegal, Lutter would be the 1st one to protest.

kds13 02-04-2007 09:48 PM

alright. first off, the elbows were legal.. watch it again. he follows through. he doesnt come at a downward angle. i'm sick of hearing this in every silva lutter thread.

second, he made lutter's bjj look terrible. lutters biggest advantage looked like his biggest weakness. he got a full mount and did jack sh*t. then when he tried that weak ass armbar, silva powered out of it.

third, silva's striking, what little there was, was better than lutters.

the only thing lutter did effectively was his wrestling. his takedowns were good, but he did not set up his shot attempts real well. the only ones he got were when silva tried an agressive strike.

silva outclassed lutter, and although it looked at times that he was in trouble, silva was comfortable in this fight.

Wise 02-04-2007 09:50 PM

I think the only one that was illegal was the first one he threw when he first locked the triangle in.

Omaplata 02-04-2007 09:59 PM

Those elbows were delivered downwards, parallel to Silva's body, and struck with the point. Follow-through is irrelevant - legal elbows in the UFC are thrown perpendicular to the fighter's body in a sweep. If I wanted to demonstrate a spike elbow to someone, I'd say - "look at what Anderson Silva did to Travis Lutter at UFC 67."

Lutter wouldn't have argued because he wouldn't have seen them. His face was buried in Silva's crotch. And I doubt he would have raised a stink anyway - if you lose, you lose - you don't run to the ref crying and saying, "No fair!"

Of course, a good ref (or judges, or NSAC members) would have called a time-out and Lutter wouldn't have had to. Anderson Silva would still have won - it just wouldn't have been with a foul.

SuzukS 02-04-2007 10:09 PM

I told you all Herbie is a terrible ref! Seriously, Silva would have won sooner or later anyway so pfft

baz00ca 02-04-2007 10:12 PM

the rule is open to interpretation. when i look at the rule I see it as saying you cannot strike North-South with the point of the elbow. interpreted in this way Silva's elbows were legal as they were going parallel to the mat.

It's really a rule that has to be clarified and/or rewritten by the NSAC

pt447 02-04-2007 10:15 PM

Silva's win was not sketchy... my freakin god... will there ever be a PPV or a single fight that isn't disputed?

Bonnar426 02-04-2007 10:30 PM

Let me put it to you this way. Herb Dean knows what is going on in that octagon. He analyzes every situation that goes on in there. If those elbow strikes were illegal he would have done something about it. Now I know Herb isn't you God, John McCarthy, but he still does a pretty decent job.

Seriously, what is it with some of you guys trying to start shit after every UFC Pay-Per-Veiw.

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