***OFFICIAL*** B.J. Penn vs Jon Fitch Pre/Post Fight Discussion - Page 25 - MMA Forum - UFC Forums - UFC Results - MMA Videos
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View Poll Results: Who will win?
BJ Penn 34 50.00%
Jon Fitch 34 50.00%
Voters: 68. You may not vote on this poll

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post #241 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 03:31 AM
 
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Originally Posted by limba View Post
We could go on for days.
Like i've said: we have different criterias on wich we scored this fight.

Aggression? - I wouldn't say BJ was more aggressive than Fitch.
BJ went for a flying knee and took Fitch down and went for a RNC, clearly trying to end the fight which equals aggression, Fitch when he ended up in dominant position layed in the closed guard clearly lacking aggression.
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Octagon control? - more like controlling Fitch in thoses 30-40 seconds he had his back, but losing that position doesn't really equall control.
shrugging Fitch off, defending Fitchs TD attempts and then taking Fitch down equals octagon control, BJ controlled that octagon for at least 3 minutes of that round.
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Damage? - the only famage BJ did was when he caught Fitch with that elbow and made him bleed.
Which trumps the zero damage Fitch did that round.




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post #242 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 03:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Toxic View Post
BJ went for a flying knee and took Fitch down and went for a RNC, clearly trying to end the fight which equals aggression, Fitch when he ended up in dominant position layed in the closed guard clearly lacking aggression.
shrugging Fitch off, defending Fitchs TD attempts and then taking Fitch down equals octagon control, BJ controlled that octagon for at least 3 minutes of that round.
Which trumps the zero damage Fitch did that round.
Let's agree on one thing.
Something needs to change when it comes to judging.

I can't trust these judges when i know how they scored the Fukuda-Ring fight. And one of the hudges scored the Siver-Sotiropoulus fight 30-27!

More and more bad judging.
I know it's not the UFC's fault, but...they need to come up with something.

One solution - judges should make the scores available after each round.
That way each fighter would know where he stands and how hard he needs to push.
I am sick of poor decisions.

.



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post #243 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 03:54 AM
 
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Originally Posted by limba View Post
Let's agree on one thing.
Something needs to change when it comes to judging.

I can't trust these judges when i know how they scored the Fukuda-Ring fight. And one of the hudges scored the Siver-Sotiropoulus fight 30-27!

More and more bad judging.
I know it's not the UFC's fault, but...they need to come up with something.

One solution - judges should make the scores available after each round.
That way each fighter would know where he stands and how hard he needs to push.
I am sick of poor decisions.
I am one of the few who does not want the judging criteria changed, I think it needs consistency more than anything but I have yet to see a better system. I think the Japansese scoring system is every bit as flawed as ours. I didn't see the Fukada/Ring fight so I can't comment but it sounds like it was just a standard robbery to me not a judging criteria problem.

I think having fighters know were they stand can work badly and make fighters fight safe as well.




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post #244 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 04:31 AM
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BJ executed a horrible gameplan, yet again.

He tried to wrestle head to head with someone bigger and stronger than him.

His corner gave him hall of fame worthy crappy advice(as it always does): "fast punches, fast punches".

He got Fitch down & immediately went for the finish when he probably would have been better off taking things step by step and wearing Fitch down a little before trying to sink in the sub.

Penn also stood directly in front of Fitch the entire fight which is a pretty dumb move. He probably would have done better if he moved more and gave Fitch angles like he did with Hughes.

Seems like Penn is a very good fighter, but his training staff and corner don't have the same level of sophistication or training that Fitch does. They come up with the dumbest fight plans known to man. And, at some point in his fights against Edgar and Fitch, it seems like Penn realizes hes being out-classed and neither he nor his corner has an answer.

I thought Fitch won. Although, I was hoping Penn would pull the upset.

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post #245 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 04:58 AM
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Personally, I saw the 2nd round as a draw and the 3rd round as 10-9, but I can understand giving BJ the 2nd and 10-8 for the 3rd.

Round scoring aside, I feel that Fitch really won, because I think the later rounds should count more, and I could even see possibly giving him the 2nd too.

If this was a 5 rounder BJ would have been finished.
Fitch vs Penn is an awesome SUPER FIGHT between 2 championship caliber fighters. And as such, they should go 5 rounds. A finish would have been a much more satisfying ending than a close decision.

I absolutely loved this fight and am excited for a rematch. Not sure if a lot of people felt the same way though. 5 Rounds for the rematch!

Last edited by Hail the Potato; 02-27-2011 at 05:04 AM.
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post #246 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 05:36 AM
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Was Penn/Fitch a good example of MMA at a crossroads

First let me get my bias out in the open, im a big BJ Penn fan but im not blinded by that and i believe BJ lost the fight to Fitch (the 2nd round was close but i think Fitch took it)

But watching that fight i couldn't help but feel that it is a really good example of how MMA is changing or at least at a crossroad in how it will look in the future

In the 2nd round when BJ went for the flying knee i was yelling No!, and sure enough when it failed to land it opened him up for an easy takedown. Both times BJ took Fitch down, he went aggressively for the back and the choke. The first time i cheered, but the second time i was yelling No! just stay on top as best you can.

I want to cheer for flying knees and aggressive guard passing or submission attempts, but with judges awarding staying inside guard as long as you stay active with strikes (regardless of the amount of damage they do) it doesn't seem to make sense anymore for fighters to take these chances.

Is this just the sport evolving and we should accept it or will it be bad for the sport when fighters like BJ Penn start thinking twice about going for flying knees and chokes?
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post #247 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 05:53 AM
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There are two types of fighters in MMA.

Guys that look to finish, and guys who don't, but will go for a finish if it is safe enough/presents itself without much risk.

Penn is a guy who likes to finish. That's why Penn has so many fans, he goes for flying knees, he goes for chokes, he goes in there trying to hurt you and put you away as fast as he can. He's exciting, when he fights sparks fly, even when fighting a guy like Fitch who is as boring as watching paint dry, he makes the fight entertaining and exciting.

To answer your question:

No, fighters like Penn won't start thinking twice about flying knees and chokes and going for the finish/kill, it is part of them to fight with passion, fight with the whole purpose of putting their opponent away. There are honestly not many fighters like Penn, it's why he's a legend and one of the best ever.

There will always be fighters who straight up want to be exciting and try to finish.
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post #248 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 06:07 AM
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Like the dude above, ill expand there are actually three types of fighters, guys who can finish,guys who try to finish but can't and jon fitch. Examples guys who can finish-anderson silva, example guys who try to finish but can't gsp, and then there is jon fitch. Fitch I think plays it beyond safe. If Bj penn was not fighting fitch tonight i would have not watched. Jon fitch puts me to sleep better than sleeping pills. He is good at what he does, he is a great fighter, but when i pay 55 dollars i want to be entertain. I would rahter watch silva dance around for 5 rounds than a jon fitch fight. I don't get it though Dana is always on silva case for not finishing fights. But Jon fitch dominates his opponents to the point where there helpless. For example tonight was he afraid of getting gas if he punched bj a little harder, or was he scared that hitting bj for the tko would leave him in a bad position.

I'll sum it up by saying Jon fitch is a great fighter just not worth a pay per view buy.
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post #249 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 06:11 AM
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Jacksons helped Marquardt 'evolve' from a ruthless finisher to a strategic fighter and now he's losing.

WAR CIGANO



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post #250 of 295 (permalink) Old 02-27-2011, 06:13 AM
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Jacksons helped Marquardt 'evolve' from a ruthless finisher to a strategic fighter and now he's losing.
nate sucked before jackon, jackson helped him not get his ass kicked as when he fights contenders he loses via decisions.
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